how do you get to try different type of yachts for live aboard

[andy2487]

Hi all we are at the beginning of are journey, with a plan to sail for 5 year with a family of 4 ,the problem i have is we are not a sailing family i have my day skippers and am doing a lot more training up to yacht masters.
and every course i can fit in from boat repairs to first aid etc etc ..

We are looking for a boat to bluewater live aboard but keep getting told we need to try as many boats as possible that's the hard part we dont live on the coast any more and dont have the contact with people who have boats we can ask to go out on to see what we think. so my question is how do you go about trying different types out for this kind of change to a life .


Age old problem i learned to sail on mono hulls and am draw to them as a rule, the wife like the space and not healing of a cat.

My short list of boat types is :
moody
Hylas
hallberg rassy
leopards
privilege
Manta Mark II

Can any one recommend a way of try before you buy lol

 

[moomba]

Hi all we are at the beginning of are journey, with a plan to sail for 5 year with a family of 4 ,the problem i have is we are not a sailing family i have my day skippers and am doing a lot more training up to yacht masters.
and every course i can fit in from boat repairs to first aid etc etc ..

We are looking for a boat to bluewater live aboard but keep getting told we need to try as many boats as possible that's the hard part we dont live on the coast any more and dont have the contact with people who have boats we can ask to go out on to see what we think. so my question is how do you go about trying different types out for this kind of change to a life .


Age old problem i learned to sail on mono hulls and am draw to them as a rule, the wife like the space and not healing of a cat.

My short list of boat types is :
moody
Hylas
hallberg rassy
leopards
privilege
Manta Mark II

Can any one recommend a way of try before you buy lol

try bare boat charter companies around the UK and abroad and ask them about their fleet , but to be honest , they are mainly production boats , like Bavaria , Jean,, and Defour
It will be hard to find a hallberg , hylas for rent , the Caribbean is the place to rent a cat.. virgin islands are the main hub,
There are people that have charter boats cruising around the place as individuals , that might be a good bet for a different boat , but you will need to check the web for their websites.

 

[Kelpie]

Seriously consider a charter. If you haven't sailed before as a family it is a relatively cheap way to try out the lifestyle, without the huge upfront financial commitment. Following that, give some thought to buying a simple small boat on which to learn the ropes. Something small enough to be cheap and easy, but big enough to actually spend a few nights aboard in comfort. You will come away with a clearer idea of what you want from your 'forever' boat, and if you have bought wisely you can sell the first boat at hopefully only a small overall cost. And you might even have some fun in the process!

As to viewing different boats, I think the best you can do is to view boats for sale and take a good long look around each one- lie down in the berths, open up every locker and see just how much stowage there is. Move around the cabin, cockpit, and deck with your imagination picturing you heeled over in the teeth of a gale. If it's a private sale you may be offered a test sail. In my experience brokers don't offer this and tend to breathe down your neck throughout the viewing, which can be quite off-putting.

Other than that, read reviews, blogs, and ask for first hand experience of particular models on forums like this. You never know, a proud owner may offer you a look around their boat.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Not sure how to answer your question , I don't think trying a boat for a few days or a week is going to give you a really idea what it's going to be like as a liveaboard boat ,
we been full time liveaboard for more years then I like to remember and have changed boat twice in the last nine years ,
We are now two and find our 42 foot mono boat just about right for us although we know couple with much smaller boats that seen to managed but they all seen to say if they could afford a bigger boat they would jump at it .
Children take up a lot of room and need space , some thing to keep in mind , plus you will have a lot more stuff then a week end family .
I take by what you said your a couple with two children In Which case you want to be thinking on the terms of everyone having their own berth .
Depend how much you have to spend a cat may be a better option , Moody's make good liveaboard boat but then so do many others , you could start with looking at ads for boats which will give you some idea of the space there have , then once you have a short list you can start looking .
You could also try a ad if n a sailing Mag or join one of the crew sites but I wouldn't think they be keep for a whole family to crew , but you never know .

 

[andy2487]

Thank you for the the reply so far guys have looked in to charter and will be doing one next year as it's too late in the season for eroup and cost of flights to area like bvi are painfully with a family of 4 . Yes it is for my wife and kids so we are looking for separated cabin's if possible currenly doing are home work on all the different types in are short list and the must have and like to have, me if we go mono hull I must have a skeg rudder or partly and a full fin would be nice but I am bettering that be hard to find .once again thank your for the thoughts.

 

[Yngmar]

Having gone through this all a few years ago, it's surprising how difficult it is to get access to this crowd while you do not have a boat, and how easy it is once you do!

Now that we have a boat, we regularly visit (and get visited by) other boaters that we just met, most of whom are as interested in looking around our boat as we are in theirs. Always something to learn from it.

So perhaps charter a boat, put it in a busy liveaboard marina and then befriend the natives. People like to chat, most cruisers are very friendly, and drinks invitations are usually welcome and often returned. Get many boat tours, make some friends, and you can ask what they do and do not like about living aboard their boats.

Monohulls can come in spacious too (e.g. Nauticat), and deck salon ones even come with a view rather than the typical basement flat (but beware of falsely labeled deck salons), but they all heel

 

[Tranona]

Jumping straight in and buying the forever boat is very high risk - even if you look at a lot.

The two key things to appreciate are living on a boat, particularly in higher temperatures and understanding what is involved in operating a substantial boat, both making it go where you want it to go and making sure it functions as designed.

For the first the best way is to charter a boat somewhere undemanding like the Ionian. You can get monos of course but cats are now common so you can compare the two types. There is a very good article in this month's PBO on the merits or otherwise of cats from an experienced liveaboard sailor.

For the second requirement buy a modest 30-35' boat and sail for a couple of seasons in the UK. This will not only give you experiencve of managing the boat but will also test out whether you and your family actually like it over a more extended period.

These two activities will give you a much better idea of what is involved and what you like and don't like. You will then be much more confident when you come to buy the ultimate boat - or it will put you off the whole idea and save you a lot of money and grief!

finally, no boat is perfect and few are actually built with full time liveaboard in mind. As you will see from boats that people use there are many factors that influence choice - hence the variety. Equally boat choice is perhaps not the most important factor for success. Arguably much more important is the attitude of the crew and it has to be said that many dreams fail because of crew issues particularly if children are involved. So make sure you all buy into the idea at the same level.

 

[andy2487]

Thank you could not agree more about all being on board with the plan kids most of all .we are seasoned motor home family use to extended time in small space abroad we've been lucky and spent a lot of time in Canada UK and Europe, and all feel the time is right to make the next step.would love to have the funds to try a few seasons of charter and so on but a plan that gives us a budget of around 200k for a boat and a on going income of around 3k a month.
does this sound reasonable.

 

[macd]

"how do you get to try different type of yachts for live aboard"

The short answer is that you don't, any more than you'd expect to try out a house before buying. In this sense I suppose the suggestions of chartering are equivalent to renting, expect that one is very short term and the other usually not. One is also a holiday, which has a habit of distorting perceptions.

Obviously someone in your position, Andy, has no practical experience of living aboard to fall back on. My experience, and that of many I've spoken with, is that only owning and living on a boat gives a true guide to what you will need, and what you won't. I suppose that's an argument for buying relatively small and cheap, and using the experience to teach you what will suit you all better when you come to trade up. It's the approach adopted by many, but perhaps not by design: most of us probably didn't know, when buying our first boat(s), that one day we'd aspire to living on one. (These are essentially the points made above by Tranona, he is usually well worth heeding.)

A minority of people in your position seem to want something roughly equivalent to their house, but on the water. That's a very expensive option, but perhaps OK if you can afford it. In practice much will depend on how you're prepared to "make do" (or, to put it another way, rough it). But housing yourselves and your growing children is going to stretch that envelope quite a bit. Perhaps the thing you need to know most, and first, is whether all of actually want the liveaboard life. It's not for everyone. There are plenty of tales of people learning that only after they've bought the boat, kitted it out, and set off.

But there are also plenty of families who'll tell you it's the best move they ever made. Hope yours is one of them. Good luck.

 

[Graham376]

Family of 4 and you are doing courses, have the others been on a boat at sea? Have met a few wannabe liveaboards who are now single handers after family jumped ship and others whose wives just fly out to wherever "he" has taken the boat to. As said above chartering would be sensible way of starting as you will be on board with possible opportunities to have a nose around other boats, as well as seeing how the family take to it. Another opportunity is to sign up on one of the crewing sites and do some delivery trips, where you are quite likely to sail older more suitable boats. If you are planning to head to hot climates, I suggest you avoid boats with timber decks, as well as being very hot, they cost a fortune to replace when time expired.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Has usually Mac , experience LB and sailor and Tranona who been around boat a very long time are making good point ,
Personally I don't agree with the view of chartering to find out what it's like or the boat you need .

For a start , what do you charter ? Cat , mono , 35' 50' and what do you do if you don't like the boat ? charter again and again
Next is the cost of the charter which if you on a limited funds you just wasted several thousand of pound to what benefit ,
Thirdly , week or two high summer ( I guess most are not going to charter in oct/Nov , ) chilling in the sun , diving of the back into clear blue water to cool off , evening under stars night , glass of wine in hand , boat with just two bags of clothing, off cause that going to be the dream your looking for , in reality, there not many days like that .
That 11 mts boat you just had a wonderful two weeks charter which seen a ideal boat is going to be looking very different which it's packed out with summer and winter wardrobe for four people , toys for the kids , schools learning stuff, tools , spare parts, heaters, winter /summer footwear , I won't go on , as the list is just to much for me to think of .
The fact is full time liveaboard suit some and not others and with young children it can be a difficult task although there are many family that do it ,
Most of us had the advantage of starting off in small boats and working our way up so by the time we got to being liveaboard we had some idea what we was looking for , in your case Andy that's not the case ,
Here real option instead of chartering , Rent an apartment for a week close to a big liveaboard winter marina and visit it , you quickly find where everyone hang out , let it be know you not a dreamer and you there for the reason of talking to liveaboard and find out what it's like , try and talk to the once who been doing it for a few year , new comers on they first year are still seeing the excitement and not the reality, people who been doing it for some year will be more honest at the same time with a bit of luck you meet up with other with children and get their point of view ,

Lastly it's good to see your realistic with finding your dream .

 

[[3889]]

A cheaper and more eclectic option to chartering is to offer your services on a site such as Crewseekers. Even if you don't get on board the specific boats in which you are interested you will get a wide range of experience on boats with different characteristics. Not really an option for all the family but a good source of info in helping decide what you like or don't like.

 

[RupertW]

I don’t see any downside to chartering - the cost if you are working is small compared to the cost of owning, and idyllic circumstances is exactly what you need when introducing the family. If they don’t love idyllic you can forget the real thing.

And most importantly you can avoid ever going near some old boat from that 80s or 90s with their pitiful accommodation for living on and their special smell whose magic is that the owner is utterly in denial about it.

 

[Bobc]

Don't discard production boats. There are lots of Bavarias, Beneteaus, and the like used as liveaboards. They are very spacious and good value, and don't believe all the talk that "they are only any good for coastal sailing", many have crossed the Atlantic, Pacific, etc., in comfort and safety.

Also, consider buying where you intend to cruise (if you are going to the Med or Caribbean, you can get a lot more for your money there).

I would suggest that you get the biggest boat you can (up to about 50ft), as space is going t be key for a family of 4.

 

[Toutvabien]

Another option is to join the Cruising Association and become part of their crewing programme. many CA members sail liveaboard type boats and are often looking for help to move or re-locate their boats. This can be a good option if you want to try a variety of boats and meet reasonably experienced skippers. https://www.theca.org.uk/public/crewing

 

[Bobc]

Another option is to join the Cruising Association and become part of their crewing programme. many CA members sail liveaboard type boats and are often looking for help to move or re-locate their boats. This can be a good option if you want to try a variety of boats and meet reasonably experienced skippers. https://www.theca.org.uk/public/crewing

That's an excellent thought. A great way for the OP to get some sea miles in too!

 

[Tranona]

That's an excellent thought. A great way for the OP to get some sea miles in too!

The problem with crewing is that only the skipper/dad gets the experience - and he is probably the one driving this. If it is just a couple then crewing as a couple has value. However this is a family, most of whom have no idea about sailing, let a lone living on a boat.

That is the value of chartering, as I said in my original response. Its purpose is to introduce the family to the idea - and at the same time be a holiday. as said if they don't like that, then the project is doomed anyway.

The OP does not say what age the children are, and while it might be easier to take pre school children on such an adventure, once they start school they also start building their own lives which makes it much more difficult to take them away. The fact that the OP (where is he I wonder?) is inevitably thinking long term suggests his children will not be pre school when they start.

Personally I think the fixation on the "right boat" is wrong. Rarely do such projects fail because the boat was wrong. it is almost always crew related issues that lead to the breakdown. so before investing in the boat and making a live changing decision, best to concentrate on trying to ensure all the family buys into it. Difficult enough when there are only two people involved, but committing your children to an unconventional life is very high risk.

 

[Toutvabien]

Personally I think the fixation on the "right boat" is wrong. Rarely do such projects fail because the boat was wrong. it is almost always crew related issues that lead to the breakdown. so before investing in the boat and making a live changing decision, best to concentrate on trying to ensure all the family buys into it. Difficult enough when there are only two people involved, but committing your children to an unconventional life is very high risk.

Agree absolutely, the obsession with should I buy an Oyster 435 or a Hurley 22 as the perfect blue water boat is often a distraction. While it enables dreamers to spend endless hours on the internet looking a possible bargains that will enable them to anchor comfortably in the Galapagos Islands the big issue is how do you know that the family will buy into it. It took us a few years to establish that the family were genuinely up for going cruising for a year, starting with a relatively modest boat and sailing it around the place. Our kids loved cruising for a year when they where 9 and 10, having been sailing since they were tiny, we met others where the kids seemed to be along for the ride; because mum and dad told them they were required on the voyage.

There are though lots of ways to get to the point of knowing if it will work for your family, but gentle persuasion and developing an enthusiasm may have merit for most families.

 

[andy2487]

all first thanks for all the thought .Just to clarify my kids are 6 & 8 and have been involved with all of this project from boat shows to endless watching you tube video about sailing tactic, live aboard life style the good and the bad to planing were we like to go . as to driving force i can say its a fair mix of the wife and kids just my youngest being 6 is not so sure .as to boat types I understand every boat is a compromise and we will need to adapted to the boat but my originals question was about way to try diffent boats and it seems there no Wright way I have put my name down on crew list but as we based in the UK atm not had any luck and as rightly said this will be great for me to get sea miles and learn from experience sailors it will not help in finding the best boat for a family as it will just be me .we don't have unlimited funds so chartering as a one off is nice but that's more about getting the family on the same page but taking on board that this has been a family decision from day one and it's only by simple common sense that I do a lot of traing that till now the rest of the family has not .My wife is next up to do her training up to day skipper and will also be doing other shore base training and my 8 year old can't wait to do some herself. I am looking at doing a one off charter before we commit to selling the house and everything to a boat just to make sure kids and adults understand as best we can the reality a bit more.
we are a seasoned Rv family so travel is nothing new to us.but best to be safe then sorry.also the though of renting a boat/ place by marina is a good one we are looking at airbnb at the moment .Thank you for the information and idea's.

 

[[3889]]

Don't discard production boats. There are lots of Bavarias, Beneteaus, and the like used as liveaboards. They are very spacious and good value, and don't believe all the talk that "they are only any good for coastal sailing", many have crossed the Atlantic, Pacific, etc., in comfort and safety.

Agreed, but my aversion to production boats for serious off grid liveaboarding is not their sailing capability but tankage and capacity for genny, watermaker etc. installation. Their interior volume is devoted to interior living space which, IME, is pretty redundant in warm climes.