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Guest
Guest
Does anyone have a practical method of heaving-to (say for man overboard) on boats with self-tacking headsails? I would welcome any advice or conmment!
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Jacket
New member
If you have a traveller:
Roll the jib away. Pull the traveller up to windward and sheet the main in hard. Luff up into the wind until the speed comes off. The boat will then try to fall away from the wind. When this happens, put the helm hard over, as though you're trying to tack, and tie it off.
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Roll the jib away. Pull the traveller up to windward and sheet the main in hard. Luff up into the wind until the speed comes off. The boat will then try to fall away from the wind. When this happens, put the helm hard over, as though you're trying to tack, and tie it off.
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Peppermint
New member
You can haul the jib to windward and tie it off with a sail tie or you can tie the jib car to leeward with a sail tie then tack thus backing the jib then balance the boat with the main. Bit of a fuss for MOB though.
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AndrewB
Well-known member
Can't see its practical with a conventional self-tacking rig, unless you are sheeting the jib to a traveller, and the traveller is arranged so it can be made off very quickly before the immediate tack. (Don't know about an Aero rig though).
Perhaps you need to use a different procedure for MOB rather than the RYA's recommended 'crash-stop' method. 'Bear off and gybe' and the 'out, tack and back' (AKA 'figure of eight') methods are older alternatives that do not involve going into a hove-to position.
Perhaps you need to use a different procedure for MOB rather than the RYA's recommended 'crash-stop' method. 'Bear off and gybe' and the 'out, tack and back' (AKA 'figure of eight') methods are older alternatives that do not involve going into a hove-to position.
wpsalm
New member
heaving-to for a man in the water , get all your sails down quick as you can make sure no halyard ends or any other lines in the water start your engine. heaving to for bad weather jib boom and tiller to the same side....heaving to for really bad weather all sails down and stream warps.
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towlerg
New member
I don't want to start a big thing but
a. streaming warps is running off
b. do you have searoom to attempt this? is your crew up to helming accurately for the possible length of the storm? is your boat appropriate to this tactic? think long and hard about what happens if you broach to!
Rgds George
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a. streaming warps is running off
b. do you have searoom to attempt this? is your crew up to helming accurately for the possible length of the storm? is your boat appropriate to this tactic? think long and hard about what happens if you broach to!
Rgds George
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webcraft
Well-known member
Heaving-to - as far as I am aware - only has one meaning - using the sails and the rudder to minimise the boat speed while presenting a suitable aspect of the vessel to the sea - normally the forequarter.
Some yachts will heave to under main alone as described above, while others will never remain at peace no matter what you do.
The other techniques you mention are nothing to do with heaving to. Streaming warps is a technique to prevent the vessel sufring too fast when running before a storm.
Any sane person will take the five seconds necessary to start the engine in a MOB situation, while crash-tacking or reach-tack-reaching or whatever. If the first pickup under sail fails, I would suggest rolling the headsail away immediately and using the engine to ensure the second attempt is successful.
- Nick
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Some yachts will heave to under main alone as described above, while others will never remain at peace no matter what you do.
The other techniques you mention are nothing to do with heaving to. Streaming warps is a technique to prevent the vessel sufring too fast when running before a storm.
Any sane person will take the five seconds necessary to start the engine in a MOB situation, while crash-tacking or reach-tack-reaching or whatever. If the first pickup under sail fails, I would suggest rolling the headsail away immediately and using the engine to ensure the second attempt is successful.
- Nick
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wpsalm
New member
Yes your correct it is running off...or maybe walking off slowly at not much more than the speed as the sea which is still pretty fast but for all intents and purposes hove to....as for my crew being able to handle the helm in these conditions must disagree with you on that as feel no one should be on deck when conditions warant streaming warps or better yet a droug of some sort as for broaching under these conditions have experienced this and agree very unpleasant made a mess of the interior and broke the mast at the spreaders...
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wpsalm
New member
Yes agree , guess I stuck my nose in this one on the man overboard question every situation and boat is diferent but when a man is in the water is no time to be trying anything with sails and no doubt your RYA has something to say about proceedure but in real life situations you don,t often get a second chance....
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webcraft
Well-known member
I understand what you are saying about not mucking about with sails. However, a pick-up under engine is not necessarily any easier. There is the danger to the MOB from the propellor, plus the danger that a rope chucked at the man in the water may also get round the prop.
If this happens then you have no option but to raise the sails again. Also, just dropping the sails in a hurry is likely to lead to a fankle and confusion of enormous proportions on most boats - if you don't have lazyjacks then a main spilling all over the deck and flapping wildly is not going to help with the pick-up. I think I would always leave the main up if possible.
I think it is worth keeping the sails up and having a go under sail - with the engine running in neutral for when you don't quite get it right. I would suggest having someone standing by the engine controls while you are on the helm, and someone else ready to furl the genny away - assuming you have a roller reefing headsail.
Of course, every situation is different, and things are much harder when there are only two of you and one of you is in the water.
On my own boat (Vega) the combi gearbox means the prop is always going round even in 'neutral' , so perhaps I am more conscious of the danger from it to a casualty in the water - but mistakes are easily made in the heat of the moment on any boat.
Does anyone have any true MOB stories to add now this thread has wandered away from the original subject?
- Nick
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If this happens then you have no option but to raise the sails again. Also, just dropping the sails in a hurry is likely to lead to a fankle and confusion of enormous proportions on most boats - if you don't have lazyjacks then a main spilling all over the deck and flapping wildly is not going to help with the pick-up. I think I would always leave the main up if possible.
I think it is worth keeping the sails up and having a go under sail - with the engine running in neutral for when you don't quite get it right. I would suggest having someone standing by the engine controls while you are on the helm, and someone else ready to furl the genny away - assuming you have a roller reefing headsail.
Of course, every situation is different, and things are much harder when there are only two of you and one of you is in the water.
On my own boat (Vega) the combi gearbox means the prop is always going round even in 'neutral' , so perhaps I am more conscious of the danger from it to a casualty in the water - but mistakes are easily made in the heat of the moment on any boat.
Does anyone have any true MOB stories to add now this thread has wandered away from the original subject?
- Nick
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towlerg
New member
Having streamed warps, do you lash the tiller?
Rgs George
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Rgs George
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qsiv
New member
I have to say I wouldnt ordinarily try it under sail - I dont usually have enough strong crew to manage the boat in such a scenario - maybe if it was very calm, but otherwise the loads in a big rig are just too great to risk in a panic situation.
FWIW, if the weather conditions indicate I give on watch crew a PLB, and we have a 121.5 PLB direction finder on board. As long as we stay within a mile of the casualty we can home in after getting sails off.
To me, the biggest downside to taking the sails off isnt just the engine (although our prop is too far away for a man on the surface to reach), but the way in which the boat would be rolling - but I'd rather that than have someones head ripped off by the mainsheet ...
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FWIW, if the weather conditions indicate I give on watch crew a PLB, and we have a 121.5 PLB direction finder on board. As long as we stay within a mile of the casualty we can home in after getting sails off.
To me, the biggest downside to taking the sails off isnt just the engine (although our prop is too far away for a man on the surface to reach), but the way in which the boat would be rolling - but I'd rather that than have someones head ripped off by the mainsheet ...
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wpsalm
New member
I lash the tiller when laying-a-hull ,that is all sails down and not enough sea room waiting for daylight or an improvment in the weather... very uncomfortable, sleep on the cabin sole..for streaming warps (or a couple of old tires and a bit of chain) I leave the Aries in command,does an excelent job in high winds...
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vyv_cox
Well-known member
Picking up casualties
<I would suggest having someone standing by the engine controls while you are on the helm, and someone else ready to furl the genny away - assuming you have a roller reefing headsail>
Might be OK on your boat but definitely not on mine. In the first place there are normally only two on board, so everything will be done by one of us. Hopefully me, as I really don't think that Jill has the skill to operate the engine well enough. Anyone standing by the engine controls will be on top of the helm, so that's definitely not possible. Someone else furling the genoa would be a luxury - once again there is only one person available. All this need to be borne in mind when planning the layout - all must be possible from the helm position.
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<I would suggest having someone standing by the engine controls while you are on the helm, and someone else ready to furl the genny away - assuming you have a roller reefing headsail>
Might be OK on your boat but definitely not on mine. In the first place there are normally only two on board, so everything will be done by one of us. Hopefully me, as I really don't think that Jill has the skill to operate the engine well enough. Anyone standing by the engine controls will be on top of the helm, so that's definitely not possible. Someone else furling the genoa would be a luxury - once again there is only one person available. All this need to be borne in mind when planning the layout - all must be possible from the helm position.
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