Greek Boat Tax

[charles_reed]

Without starting another hare running about the justice or morals of the above Circulation Tax, I had a demand for my DEKPA from a PP in Limnos.

We couldn't reach an amicable settlement, being 9.45m I've never had a DEKPA, I'd passed through 4 PP offices already and none had asked for one.
So I left as I'd reported @ 06:40 the following morning, having had my offer of payment refused.

It may be that he was not as bird-brained as he appeared.

As a result of the new tax, not yet being collected, all vessels of >7m will need to have a document - this could be confused with a DEKPA.

I just publish this in case anyone else has such a request.

PS The delay in implementation is, apparently, mainly down to queries and foot-dragging by the PP department in the Ministry of Marine. Probably want more money/staff/leave/pension.

PPS I shall go to my mate in Chania who has 4-rings and a very good line in raki and enquire from him!!

 

[daveg45]

When I visited the PP at Preveza at the start of the season they told me I only need one stamp for the year now. Are you finding a different story?

 

[Steve C Cronin]

When I visited the PP at Preveza at the start of the season they told me I only need one stamp for the year now. Are you finding a different story?

Of course he is!

There are as many "different stories" as there are PP offices!

 

[macd]

When I visited the PP at Preveza at the start of the season they told me I only need one stamp for the year now. Are you finding a different story?

Surely Charles is just saying that he has nothing for anyone to stamp over any time frame.

It was self-evident that when the Greek authorities told the CA that the DEKPA would be used to register a boat for the tax, that all those vessels between seven and ten metres which had never previously needed one, henceforth would do so. If they ever get to the point of actually collecting the tax, presumably their thinking will be a little more joined up (but don't hold your breath).

 

[spencerd]

No one knows

Having produced the DEKPA from Levkas to Galaxidi to Zanteo to Epidavros to Kilini well lets say many times. I had three stamps by some jobsworth in Epidavros BUT not one of the PP have heard of the tax when mentioned????? What does this tell us?

 

[duncan99210]

Having produced the DEKPA from Levkas to Galaxidi to Zanteo to Epidavros to Kilini well lets say many times. I had three stamps by some jobsworth in Epidavros BUT not one of the PP have heard of the tax when mentioned????? What does this tell us?

That the tax has not yet been implemented and therefore the PP have no call to know anything about it.

 

[sailaboutvic]

That the tax has not yet been implemented and therefore the PP have no call to know anything about it.

That's a bit surprising as almost everyone else have heard of it , I think if the truth is known they trying to keep it low key , and like everyone else are hoping it just goes away .

www.bluewatersailorcroatia.webs.com

 

[daveg45]

This is strange. I have had one stamp in Preveza only because I chose to go to the port police at the start of the season. I was informed that only one stamp a year is now required. Since then I have not been approached by port police even though I parked right outside their door on a few occasions. So what is happening? Do you guys with all the stamps voluntarily go to the PP or wait for them to finf you?

 

[vyv_cox]

This is strange. I have had one stamp in Preveza only because I chose to go to the port police at the start of the season. I was informed that only one stamp a year is now required. Since then I have not been approached by port police even though I parked right outside their door on a few occasions. So what is happening? Do you guys with all the stamps voluntarily go to the PP or wait for them to finf you?

You raise a couple of points. Firstly, Preveza PP have always been more clued up than most others and may well be aware of the current ruling. Secondly, whether you are approached by them or not is entirely up to individual PP. A few weeks ago at Nisyros a lady PP asked the 'captains' of eight of the 30 or so boats in the port to take their papers to the office. No others were asked. After she had seen about four of them she packed up and shut the office.

We have been asked in half a dozen ports to take papers to the office but have not had the DEKPA stamped. However, we have read that Kos PP gave a skipper a dressing down for not having his stamped in the last port and insisted on stamping it themselves.

 

[daveg45]

You raise a couple of points. Firstly, Preveza PP have always been more clued up than most others and may well be aware of the current ruling. Secondly, whether you are approached by them or not is entirely up to individual PP. A few weeks ago at Nisyros a lady PP asked the 'captains' of eight of the 30 or so boats in the port to take their papers to the office. No others were asked. After she had seen about four of them she packed up and shut the office.

We have been asked in half a dozen ports to take papers to the office but have not had the DEKPA stamped. However, we have read that Kos PP gave a skipper a dressing down for not having his stamped in the last port and insisted on stamping it themselves.

Wouldn't you think that current requirements for PP would be circulated by email to each office? There must be some kind of chain of command surely!

 

[Steve C Cronin]

You raise a couple of points. Firstly, Preveza PP have always been more clued up than most others and may well be aware of the current ruling. Secondly, whether you are approached by them or not is entirely up to individual PP. A few weeks ago at Nisyros a lady PP asked the 'captains' of eight of the 30 or so boats in the port to take their papers to the office. No others were asked. After she had seen about four of them she packed up and shut the office.

We have been asked in half a dozen ports to take papers to the office but have not had the DEKPA stamped. However, we have read that Kos PP gave a skipper a dressing down for not having his stamped in the last port and insisted on stamping it themselves.

The whole of the PP service is ruled by a combination of confusion, lack of internal communication and justification of existence. Bit like the whole of the Greek bureaucratic infrastructure, really!

 

[macd]

Wouldn't you think that current requirements for PP would be circulated by email to each office? There must be some kind of chain of command surely!

I daresay there is a chain, but you wouldn't want to anchor with it. My impression from dealing with them this year is that the lower ranks know nothing about it, whilst higher up the chain they may or may not know something about it but what the hell, we get paid either way. They're civil servants, skilled to the nth degree at staring out of windows. What do you expect?

 

[duncan99210]

Wouldn't you think that current requirements for PP would be circulated by email to each office? There must be some kind of chain of command surely!

This is Greece. Each PP office has it's own way of doing things and it's own approach to the implementation of any dictats from Athens. So far this season we've been asked to prove that we'd paid our marina fees (Agios Nikolaos), been ignored for a week and the asked to visit the office before we left (Ios, but no DEPKA stamp) been asked to visit the office at Monemvasia (where we were asked why we had no stamp from Ios, were then told we only needed one stamp a month and then had our DEPKA stamped....). Oh, and totally ignored in Pilos, Kiparrisia and Poros on Kephalonia. There may well be a chain of command for the PP but it doesn't work.....

If and when the new tax is implemented be prepared for lots of different ways for it to be interpreted and imposed, as each office will have its own take on the topic.

 

[scoty]

EU

Of course he is!

There are as many "different stories" as there are PP offices!

How can anyone vote to join the EU......croatia, turkey, greese what they are doing now will become the norm in ALL EU countries

 

[macd]

How can anyone vote to join the EU......croatia, turkey, greese what they are doing now will become the norm in ALL EU countries

It's really too easy to get out of touch when living aboard. I completely missed the news of Turkey joining the EU.

 

[vyv_cox]

I daresay there is a chain, but you wouldn't want to anchor with it. My impression from dealing with them this year is that the lower ranks know nothing about it, whilst higher up the chain they may or may not know something about it but what the hell, we get paid either way. They're civil servants, skilled to the nth degree at staring out of windows. What do you expect?

I'm sure this is the case. Knowledge is power, after all. Don't tell the lower ranks anything until you have to. One of our forumites found at one Aegean port that the senior officer knew about it but had not shown the info to his junior.

 

[charles_reed]

The Theory will be (or so I'm assured)

New DEKPA - cost €30, stamped once, when you pay the TTE, meanwhile PP all over Greece are having great fun filling the lack of official guidance with their own rules.
In Mythimna, when we went to pay our dues, instead of the old stand alone computer (with no software for issuing berthing receipts) they were having a new PC network put in which is supposed to be modem connected to the main PP server in Piraeus.
The whole thing appears to be an attempt to copy the Douanes Francais centralised system operating out of Toulouse.
Looking at the general calibre of PP personnel and with bitter experience of the inherent SNAFUs in any computerisation programme, I very much doubt that the system will be operational during 2014 or 2015.
Meanwhile we can all expect to be thoroughly confused by a resentful and confused Limenikos Soma, until all the young (and educated) girls that they've been recruiting for their charm offensive (and that's very apparent here in the Aegean) replace all the old warhorses hiding in their offices.

 

[duncan99210]

Well, there are computers in all the PP offices but they still record all the details in a nice book with photocopies of documents in another folder plus a duplicate book for receipts. The computers seem to be there for show or playing games. They certainly aren't being used for core business as far as I can see. Ah well, perhaps they'll sort it out someday.

 

[Steve C Cronin]

The Theory will be (or so I'm assured)

New DEKPA - cost €30, stamped once, when you pay the TTE, meanwhile PP all over Greece are having great fun filling the lack of official guidance with their own rules.
In Mythimna, when we went to pay our dues, instead of the old stand alone computer (with no software for issuing berthing receipts) they were having a new PC network put in which is supposed to be modem connected to the main PP server in Piraeus.
The whole thing appears to be an attempt to copy the Douanes Francais centralised system operating out of Toulouse.
Looking at the general calibre of PP personnel and with bitter experience of the inherent SNAFUs in any computerisation programme, I very much doubt that the system will be operational during 2014 or 2015.
Meanwhile we can all expect to be thoroughly confused by a resentful and confused Limenikos Soma, until all the young (and educated) girls that they've been recruiting for their charm offensive (and that's very apparent here in the Aegean) replace all the old warhorses hiding in their offices.

Charles, old boy, with the GREATEST of respect, THAT, was as helpful as a chocolate enema!

 

[charles_reed]

Charles, old boy, with the GREATEST of respect, THAT, was as helpful as a chocolate enema!

Interesting you should mention that - cocoa-butter enemas ARE widely used, especially in France. I'd never have expected such deep medical erudition from you, Steve ;-)