Fuel Cells

RobF

RobF

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Two questions...
a) why has no-one thought of running a fuel cell business. I suspect there are a number of us who are unwilling to pay £3000 for a new one, but might stump up £200 for the use of one over a month for a summer holiday or delivery passage
b) why is it that when I search for the Hyrdomax fuel cell, I get lots of search responses about 'questionable medical aids'.
 
An interesting idea, but would there be enough business? I'd worry that I'd have to have 5 or 6 units available which would all be wanted for the summer months then nothing for the winter = quite an outlay, but maybe it could work. I would add though that part of the advantage to me of having one is knowing that it's sat there monitoring the battery voltage all winter and chimes in to top up as and when they dip down.
 
My experience of fuel cells is that the one I tried was an absolute disaster. It failed after less than two weeks and the manufacturer stated that I had tried to run it inverted!

Wouldn't touch another one with a bargepole!

But a super idea, just not ready for a marine environment yet.

Tony
 
3000/200 = 15 months just to cover the capital cost of one cell. I have the answer to your question. When I looked at the price they were >4K.
 
Portable fuel cells are not yet able to deliver enough current to justify the capital cost or the fuel to run them. I keep looking at them as a quiet easy to install method of generating power but when I could buy several quiet Honda generators for the cost of a single fuel cell with a pretty pathetic output, I stop looking. If they drop significantly in price AND become more efficient then I will revisit them. Can't see much of a market for hiring them at the current state of the technology.
 
duncan99210 said:
... AND become more efficient ...
Click to expand...

Are you sure about this? Fuel cells oxidise Hydrogen to water, and do that at around 80% efficiency, so while some improvement will come along, it obviously can't be that enormous. The key issue is that they have to operate above the boiling point of water, so heat gets lost despite fancy heat exchangers, To put it in context, the best diesel generator is about 40% efficient, and this isn't going to improve for 2nd law of thermodynamics reasons.

BUT, and where I agree with you, the main issue is that we don't use Hydrogen in our marine fuel cells, but something containing Carbon, and probably Oxygen (Methanol = CH3OH), and this carbon is wasted: turned to CO2. Not that great. In my opinion, a fuel cell is a great thing potentially, but unless and until we have an infrastructure for distribution of Hydrogen, and therefore tanks which can safely hold Hydrogen, they'll never be mainstream.
 
jdc said:
BUT, and where I agree with you, the main issue is that we don't use Hydrogen in our marine fuel cells, but something containing Carbon, and probably Oxygen (Methanol = CH3OH), and this carbon is wasted: turned to CO2. Not that great...
Click to expand...

Surely the ancient uses of carbon as fuel all turn it into CO2 (unless faulty!). Whether any benefit is derived from burning carbon in this instance is another matter!

Mike.
 
mjcoon said:
Surely the ancient uses of carbon as fuel all turn it into CO2 (unless faulty!). Whether any benefit is derived from burning carbon in this instance is another matter!

Mike.
Click to expand...

Yes of course, but in the case of the ancient use, benefit is obtained from the exothermic reaction (i.e. heating / cooking) whereas in a fuel cell one just tosses that energy away as an undesirable by-product. I think this is the real achilles heel of fuel-cells. There are apparently research projects to use powdered solid carbon in fuel cells, at a mere 900°C, but research they remain!
 
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