First boat recommendations. Westerly Centaur, Cobra 750, Others?

J

jeffsnox

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Hi,

With a budget of up to about £10k, what would you say is the best first yacht?

I'm intending to cruise - not race.

I fancy the ability to explore rivers/inlets, so I'm tending towards bilge instead of fin keelers.

I'd _like_ my partner to come along on occasion, so I want the interior to be reasonably comfortable... and the loo to be private.

I'm not a big fan of DIY, so would like something which is likely to require the smallest amount of work.

While I know that sailing is a pretty expensive pastime, I don't want to have to spend TOO much in ongoing maintenance.

I'd REALLY like my first boat to be capable of coping with some serious seas. Partly for peace of mind, and partly so I can have at least the pipe-dream of knowing that I could head off and do something really adventurous at some point (I'm allowed to dream of crossing the Atlantic, right /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif )


I guess the above is a pretty common set of desires really.


Anyway, I've been drawn towards Westerly Centaurs and Cobra 750s as they seem to fit my requirements.

I've seen some great condition Centaurs - but they are circa 30 years old now... so am I better off with the slightly newer Cobras?

And which is more seaworthy?

Any other boat recommendations?

THANKS!
 
ive got a 40 year old searover 28...triple keel 3'draft...and copes well in dodgy situations...
the centaurs are good yachts, i had a look at a couple but they didnt have enough headroom for me...
 
We had a share in a Cobra 850 for 8 years .I am over 6 feet and found good headroom plus loads of storage .She was very heavily built as were most boats of this era and although 1979 I am sure she will be still going strong in another 20 years .We were caught out a few times in bad weather and she alsways felt safe although wasnt good to windward .Im not sure of prices relative to 750 s that you suggest but in any boat of this age condition is everything and will have a big bearing on on-going maintanance.Good luck
 
Or a slightly smaller boat built by the same people as the Sabre - the Tomahawk 25. Great fun to sail and very seaworthy, really enjoyed mine. Bugger to reverse under power though!
Rob
 
Macwester 27. Large cockpit, good cabin layout, bombproof construction(as I recall). Not exactly a racehorse, but excellent cruising and good in heavy weather.

My Granddad (ex skipper) had one for years when we were kids - he preferred this one to the Centaur. Recently was reminiscing about fitting a new transducer through the hull - was starting to doubt his sanity because the fibreglass was waaaay thicker than he was expecting.

Something like www.macwester.org... do the search.

Cheers
SmileyG
 
My macwester 26 was very cheap and is ideal for a drying (cheap) mooring and exploring creeks and rivers. She is very heavily built and bomb proof and a good sea boat. She's a solid, safe family cruising boat that does exactly what it says on the tin. I liken her to a sailing tugboat.I love her.

The down sides are; little headroom, not good to windward, slow by modern standards, a broad bow that can slam in waves, weather helm if not reefed early or if the main is old and baggy, old fashioned layout with not the best use of space below.

SWMBO wants to sell to get a bigger bilge keeler like a Cobra 850, leisure 29, Stag 28 etc but I'm quite happy with my old Macwester (and can't afford to up grade yet, anyway!)
 
A little more money but look at a Hunter horizon 26, one of the first "modern" layouts and sails well with twin keels.
 
I agree. We had a Horizon 26 for ten years. She was quick and a real pleasure to sail, a bit tender but she looked after us very well. Cross Channel,Brittany and so on.
 
Consider the Folkboat inspired designs (Contessa 26, Halcyon 27, etc). Outstanding sea boats and sail better than some others mentioned here. Might seem a bit tight on accommodation though with their narrow beam, but that's why they sail well!!
 
Cobra 750 against a Centaur - everyone talks about heavy build, Westerly, Macwester, Sabre - Laura Lee who want s hull an inch or more thick in places. We sailed out a hundred and more miles from land and felty v happy in ours. A Westerly Griffon is a v nice choice but £18000 so Cobra 750 it is
 
Quite a few Centaurs have full electronics - I sold mine with Radar, Autopilot, full instruments, Mikuni heating, tender, etc. for £13,000. We used to sail her regularly from Falmouth to the CIs and Brittany and all around the West Country. Excellent sea boat - never had a single moment's concern.

Also, lovely and warm as it is a heavy boat and keeps the heat in. Very easy to single-hand. Parts easy to get. Superb Owners Association. I was very pleased to have bought a Centaur and would buy again if we wanted a boat of that size etc.
 
[ QUOTE ]
I'm not a big fan of DIY, so would like something which is likely to require the smallest amount of work.

While I know that sailing is a pretty expensive pastime, I don't want to have to spend TOO much in ongoing maintenance.

[/ QUOTE ]

On a different tack to the good advice already supplied:

I would venture to suggest that (for the ubiquitous GRP sloop) the amount of initial and ongoing maintenance depends almost entirely on how well the (any) boat has been maintained to date. (Hey, feel free to disagree /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif) It is my impression that *asking* prices don't reflect these differences particularly well, so you need to look at as many candidate boats as you can. Some will be bone dry, with neat and logical wiring, well maintained / new replacement engine, tidy upholstery, recent sails, standing rigging < 10 yrs old, recent, matching instruments, hatches / windows free from crazing, etc, yet others advertised at a similar price will have every one of these faults. The cost of getting the second one up to the standard of the first will probably be similar to your budget (no exaggeration).

The moral of this rambling is not to narrow yourself down to one 'perfect' type of boat, but to stay flexible and wait for a good example of one of your candidates to come up. The 'look and feel' of the interior, also depends a lot on how clean / dry / tidy it is - It's easy to dismiss a whole class of suitable boats after seeing one bad example.

HTH

Andy
 
Have a look at a Seamaster 815. They are not as well know as Centaur etc but very well built by Seamaster and good design from Holman and Pye. £10k should get you a good one. Good accommodation and better sailing than most 26 footers.

www.seamasterclub.co.uk

Ian
 
[ QUOTE ]

I would venture to suggest that (for the ubiquitous GRP sloop) the amount of initial and ongoing maintenance depends almost entirely on how well the (any) boat has been maintained to date. (Hey, feel free to disagree /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif) It is my impression that *asking* prices don't reflect these differences particularly well, so you need to look at as many candidate boats as you can. Some will be bone dry, with neat and logical wiring, well maintained / new replacement engine, tidy upholstery, recent sails, standing rigging < 10 yrs old, recent, matching instruments, hatches / windows free from crazing, etc, yet others advertised at a similar price will have every one of these faults. The cost of getting the second one up to the standard of the first will probably be similar to your budget (no exaggeration).

The moral of this rambling is not to narrow yourself down to one 'perfect' type of boat, but to stay flexible and wait for a good example of one of your candidates to come up. The 'look and feel' of the interior, also depends a lot on how clean / dry / tidy it is - It's easy to dismiss a whole class of suitable boats after seeing one bad example.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is probably the best piece of advice so far. There is often little difference in price between a well maintained boat of this of age and price bracket, and a real dog that's going to cost you thousands. The reason is because there's a ceiling above which even the "best example in the country" can't go. If you can find one of these, it'll be the best deal you ever did..but they are rare. Tie yourself down to one model and it'll take forever. I'm going through the same thought process right now in drawing-up a short list of candidate models. I also know that I'll never get the true value of my current boat vs. the "average" ones out there. Somebody will get a really good buy.

Oh...forgot to say, if you're not a big fan of DIY then honestly you might want to forget the whole plan!! Any boat with offshore capability in this price bracket is going to be old. Even the best in the country is going to need constant maintenance to keep it this way, and there's no way you're going to pay boatyard labour rates on something in this category. Just bear it in mind...
 
Have had a Cobra 750 for 2 seasons now. Built 1979, got it in excellent condition. So far it has been from Hamble to DunMore East (home), and from there to west Cork (twice), Milford, North Cornwall and home again. Ours is fin keel. Not great to wind, but roomy and loo is private. Really solid. Probably sell next winter, as we want a bigger boat for longer distances. However, had weather been kinder this summer we would have gone to France, quite a distance from Dunmore.

We use it for 2 people, occasionally a third person. Pilot berth is storage, otherwise little room for large items without having to shift from forecabin to saloon and back.

However, very happy with it. Cost us £10,500 plus £1000 for new rigging.
 
I agree. Look at as many boats in your price range as you can find. Don't tie yourself down to one type. Eventually you will find a boat which 'feels right', just like buying a house. If a boat looks well looked after, it is more likely to be well-maintained than one that looks a mess. You will be extremely fortunate to find a boat that doesn't need anything doing to it. So allocate some sort of budget for repairs.

After looking at dozens of dirty, poorly maintained and unloved boats, I finally found one I really liked. But it was out of my price range. So I looked around until I found a boat of the same type, but which was offered cheaply because it was in bit of a sorry state.

At least I knew where I was starting from. I did as much of the work as I possibly could myself. By the time I had finished I had learned a great deal about boat engines, electrics, epoxy, fibreglass, woodwork, boat plumbing, canvas work and all manner of other stuff. I not only knew every nook and cranny of my boat, but I also felt I had a fair chance of making another repair or sorting a problem if necessary. And I knew once I'd done all the repairs, I had a sound boat. And the satisfaction of doing something I never thought possible before.

However, it did cost a lot of money. On the face of it, it might have been better to buy that boat I couldn't afford. But if I had, it might have had 'hidden' problems which I would then have had to find additional money to fix, and I wouldn't have learned all the skills.
 
Serious food for though. Many thanks for an awesome number of really helpful responses!

I've mulled and pondered etc etc... and booked a survey on a Centaur I saw over the weekend which really amazed me with its condition.

Thanks again!
 
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