Fire! Fire!

[petery]

I got a call from a friend whose flat overlooks my mooring to tell me that my boat had smoke pouring out of every orifice and I should get down to it quickly.

When I got there, true enough, the whole boat was filled with an acrid smoke. I spent 30 minutes seeking the cause - must be electrical.. or could it be that a powder extinguisher had been triggered.

I was about to give up when I opened a cockpit locker again and saw that the lid of my flare pack had melted. On closer inspection it was apparent that a parachute flare had decided to fire itself and that was the cause of the smoke. Amazingly the plastic diesel tank in the locker didn't melt and catch fire and the 5 other flares in the pack did not ignite!

On inspection, the flare still had its protective cap on - yet it had fired. The flares were vertical in the tub with the 'firing end' downwards. In any case they are a ring pull type

There was no source of heat in the locker and the engine hadn't been run for 24 hours. Can the motion of a boat in a heavy wash from a passing craft set off a flare? I'm a bit groggy from the fumes so I haven't yet taken a long look at the locker - and at this stage I don't think it fair to mention the make of flare - but has anybody else had this kind of problem?

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[Rob_Webb]

Bloomin heck, how frightening! Never heard of it before and I'm sure that motion alone can't cause it otherwise there would be untold other examples and warnings as well. One question, how old is/was it and when's the expiry date? And visually what kind of condition was the flare in beforehand? I used to keep all mine together in one of the supplier's own containers - what a drama if one of those had ignited and taken the rest of the tub with it.....

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[Magic_Sailor]

Sorry to hear this Peter. It must have been really frightening. I think you should tell us the name of the supplier.

I expect you'll be contacting them. Perhaps you could keep us all informed.

Magic

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://practical-business.co.uk>Click for website!</A>

 

[LeytonC]

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>

I'm a bit groggy from the fumes

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might be worth seeing a doctor about this, the fumes could be nasty!!



<hr width=100% size=1>Thanks

Leyton
(EXTAR Solutions - Software that works for you)

 

[petery]

Went down early this pm and checked a few things. Flares in date and were kept in an 'air tight' supplier's bucket. Perhaps lack of oxygen prevented a more dramatic burn.

Base and sides of plastic bucket untouched .. just top melted by flare - so no external heat from electrical fault or exhaust. Other flares in 'perfect' condition.

Ring pull for the flare that ignited was still in the base covered by the protective cap.

Feel I should contact supplier before naming - but I doubt if they would admit that this kind of thing happens regularly ... and, yes, I'm going to visit the quack today.

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[Twister_Ken]

I'm amazed he called you and not 999. In this case lucky he didn't because Fireman Fred would probably have hatcheted his way into the boat and filled it with foam.

It's a huge concern that a flare has self ignited and it would seem that only a great degree of luck prevented something much worse happening.

Please keep us in touch with the response from the flare manufacturer.

Meanwhile, on a lighter note, standby to <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.writeforweb.com/twister1>Let's Twist Again

 

[cameronke]

Thanks Ken

There goes todays productivity

Regards

Cameron

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[Metabarca]

How did you manage to hack into the Pentagon's strategic centralised fire-control computer?!


On a more serious note, please do tell us what else you discover; this puts me in mind to keep my flares in a bucket of water or on a line overboard!

<hr width=100% size=1>Adriatic links here: <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.comoy.com/saillinks.html>http://www.comoy.com/saillinks.html</A>

 

[penfold]

Flares contain their own oxidant, so the closed flare pack will not have helped much. You can amuse yourself by proving this fact; try lighting a flare and dropping it in the water straight away. Very entertaining disco light effects if you do it at night!

Note: I do not condone this sort of behaviour and have never witnessed or practised it. In the hypothetical scenario where I did do it, I would:-

a) tie a piece of string to the flare so it can be retrieved after it goes out; littering is environmentally unsound.

b) make a point of being in the waters of a country where this sort of anti-social behaviour is either encouraged, or at least ignored. Like Djibouti, for example. Or Greece, where flares are often used interchangibly with fireworks because:-

1)they forgot to buy fireworks
2)the firework shop was shut
3)they couldn't be bothered buying fireworks anyway
4)the flare they were carrying became unbearably heavy
5)It's somebody's birthday/anniversary/wedding/funeral, or it's christmas/new year/easter/some local holiday.

cheers,
David

<hr width=100% size=1>What we are dealin' with here is a complete lack of respect for the law....

 

[graham]

What worries me is at night I keep a couple of white para lume flares near the companionway hatch in the saloon.

The potential effect of one flying around the occupied cabin is worrying.

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[TheBoatman]

Contact the manufacturer a.s.a.p and if you still have the flare container send it to them. If they can identify the batch number they will almost certainly withdraw the entire batch. As a RNLI sea check advisor, I was recently at a flare demo update and it was mentioned that if any flare fails to go off (in date ones only lads) you should remove the top foil and shake the contents into the sea retaining the cylinder, which you send back to the manufacturer. I know yours went off in unexplained circumstances but if you have the cylinder and batch number send it back. It could save someones life?

Peter.

PS
It did cross my mind at the time that this flare that didn't go off might be my one and only red para and sending it back might not be an option open to me as I drowned because I couldn't raise the alarm<s>.

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[Trevethan]

I think you are quite lucky. Some prat let off awhite para flare they nicked off a boat while lived in Exeter (they let it off right by my flat)

The flare floated down and settled on the road where it burned a 2 inch hole into the tarmac.

Magnesium tends to burn very fast and very hot and if the thing had gone off properly it would probably have burned right through the bottom of the locker.

You need to get in touch witht eh manufacture asap -- if this a batch fault others might have more serous incidents.

Glad the boat is OK though and a properly worded letter should also earn you at the very least a steam cleaning of the interior and replacement of anything damaged.

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[petery]

Update

I have contacted the manufacturer and he is collecting the bucket, discharged flare and the other 5 flares that were in the pack and didn't catch fire. I also found the remains of the parachute in the locker.

I'm in a little bit of a quandry (never had to spell that word before!!!). I don't want to reveal the name of the manufacturer until he has had a chance to examine the bucket (pristine except where the flare burnt through the lid) but I do want to find out if any others have had a similar experience. I'll drop a line to PBO and YM to see if they can publish a letter - omitting the manufacturers name.

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[TheBoatman]

Re: Update

That's a toughy. You could ring him and ask if he minded you asking if anyone else had the same batch numbers. After all if there's a fault he will have to put out a general recall anyway.

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[janie]

Happened before

One of our club's boats had it happen last summer in the hot weather. Flare ricocheted all round the interior of his new boat - doing quite a lot of damage. Fortunately, everybody was on deck. I'm pretty sure that the manufacturer took the pack back to investigate.

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[Dave_Snelson]

Excellent game - my wife thinks I'm bonkers!!

<hr width=100% size=1>Madoc Yacht Club
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.madocyachtclub.co.uk>http://www.madocyachtclub.co.uk</A>

 

[petery]

Re: Happened before

Perhaps you could PM me in confidence if you know the name of manufacturer.

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[BobE]

Re: Happened before

Hi Peterey.
Any more news on the flare problem ??
I'm still thinking of enlarging my little fridge??
Cheers Bob E..

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[petery]

Flares were XM-Yachting Brand

I contacted XM-Yachting immediately after the incident and asked them to collect the flares ; return them to the manufacturers and let me have a report on why they thought the flare had spontaneously ignited.

They replaced the pack with a Paines-Wessex pack within days, but despite a call and a couple of e-mails, the old tub with the 'used' flare and the 5 other flares still awaits collection by them.

I think XM-Yachting have missed the point - I couldn't give a * about having the flares replaced - I wanted to know why I nearly lost my boat through - what I believe IMHO - was a faulty product.

Let's hope that it was, in some way, my fault and your XM-Yachting flares are not waiting to surprise you.

A couple of pics

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://uk.f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/stangate@btinternet.com/>http://uk.f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/stangate@btinternet.com/</A>


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[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

Re: Flares were XM-Yachting Brand

photo's don't show ?

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.topcatsail.co.uk>

</A>