fastnet 79 prog on TV

tcm

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Saw this via the Sky last nite. Quite good.

One chap (sheehan, i think) described watching his Dad drift away, very sad. Towards the end he described how he winces when he sees the t-shirts which say "better a bad day on the water than a good day in the office" - and he'd have swapped thqat day for a day in the office. I belive he still sails though some others who were involved don't.

I think they had enough real material (lots of '79 tv footage, interviews with survivors etc etc) to do a better job here, but it wd've cost a bit more on graphics and time to explain the story as it unfolded - a longer program i spose.

Just wondering if Peter Snow, an actual sailor and tv "bankable" could praps have done an Alan Whicker - started his own TV production company and make decent boating programs himself which would surely be better, more informed, more explanatory. Dunno.

imho 6/10, or praps 7/10 but only because of the "Zapruda" nature of the (small amount of) footage shown - regardless of how badly the program was put together the subject matter itself was such that they would have had to really work to make it very bad. Zapruda of course is the bloke who took the (quite crap) cine film of Kennedy assassination But with all that more professionally shot material of F'79, this could have been really thunderously good and informative documentary.

As usual, boatingwise, the major tv companies seem blind to boating whereas other subjects (eg snooker) they manage to make quite humdrum or dull events seem full of drama where none exists.

Worst bit: Edward Heath blowing his sailing credentials by decsribing how he was "down below with the maps". Oh dear.

all imho.




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ShipsWoofy

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I noticed the Ted Heath statement, I actually put it down to being used to talking to people on subjects they know nothing about, he is an after dinner speaker isn't he? I would think on many subjects he has to dumb down, might be second nature. Or he doesn't care about using the 'right' words?

I was actually looking for quite an interesting interview from him when he appeared, he actually seemed quite nonplussed about being asked about his experiences.

Although I think a tragic and horrific sequence of events, I wonder how many lives the 15 have gone on to save since. I.e. they really opened up the eyes of amateur sailors about liferafts and the fact they are not possibly the solution. I would like to think now, if I was caught, I would try to strap in and pray rather than jump into the 'kids paddling pool with a roof' as described by one survivor.

Scary watch, and thanks for the heads up about the regional BBC stations on sky, even though the menu was was wrong.

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Twister_Ken

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One 3rd person memory of Fastnet 79

Somebody I sailed with later was on the race on a bigger boat and in front of the worst of it. They had a genoa cleat let go, so that the sheet whipped off round the drum, before jamming in a riding turn. When they eventually sorted it, they found the nylon outer sheath of the sheet had glazed because of friction heat. Scary.

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tcm

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Re: saily talk on TV

oh, i wd have thort the general public is quite able even hungry for that sort of stuff - all the boaty words compare well with the (prior to Steve Davis) strange intricacies and rule of snooker which few play but lots know all about, no?

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jimi

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Walso thought ity a bit nothingy despite the potential. Shame really. Worst comes to the worst and Ill be sticking the hatchboards in, trying to sail and praying! Not jumping in the liferaft.

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kimhollamby

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Matt Sheahan

Matt Sheahan certainly is still sailing -- and often in some pretty extreme situations.

He is tech editor on Yachting World and you can also read some of his stuff on the Yachting World site (was recently at America's Cup in Marseille and also Olympics).

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2 things stuck out for me. The first was the Defence Secretary (John Nott) at the time saying "Man is going to go on pitting himself against the elements. Ocean racing will go on". Not sure such a statement would be made these days - they'd be finding some way to license/regulate/protect people from themselves.

The other thing was Chris Dunning saying "I don't think there were any of what I would call the core of ocean racers that suffered loss of life or loss of boat. To a man we were all okay but it was, with all respect, the weekend sailors who foregathered friends to do the fastnet as a bit of fun - those were the ones that got into difficulties".

Oh, and Ted Heath's 'maps' comment ;)

I can probably turn out a DVD if anyone who missed it wants to see it.

Rick

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StugeronSteve

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Re: hm, but

"unfortunately, the statistics show that ZERO beneteau 311's survived the '79 fastnet, which is pretty revealing, i reckon."

Quite an alarming statistic, probably due to a complete lack of foresight on behalf of the builders.

Often wondered whether the peeps that buy these "Bad Day on the Water" shirts have ever set foot on a boat (always seems like tempting fate). As one of nature's less than intrepid sailors I have never experienced anything like the 79 Fastnet conditions, and seriously hope and pray that I never will, but there has been more than one occasion when I have questioned the wisdom of being tossed about aboard a lump of plastic, rather than spending time gainfully in a nice warm office.

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brianhumber

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Re: saily talk on TV

Whats wrong with describing charts as maps to non sailors? Had 4 peope new to boating out last weekend and its much quicker and easier to keep to a left, right, front ,back, pull the green string langauge. They understood and did what I was asking them to do straight away which made the trip a lot more enjoyable for all.

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Robin

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I was at sea returning from Guernsey to Poole with the family as this began to unfold and complaining bitterly that the forecast winds for our bit of sea were just not there, we were motoring and in very poor visibility too. The disaster that then followed is pretty well etched on the brain and that is just as an interested observer rather than as a participant, this was the stuff of nightmares.

As for the BBC film, yes there were some strange inclusions and they certainly had much more news footage than we got to see unless it wasn't kept. Kingfisher and Ellen were certainly not in the 1979 Fastnet (but appeared in a shot of the racing) and Simon Le Bon's 'Drum' which lost it's keel and was pictured with crew sitting on the upturned hull did not do that on this Fastnet either.

Ted Heath did well IMO for his age, he has a very dry sense of humour and his comment may have been part of some wry understatement on his part taken from his after dinner speech scripts. Remember too that he has his own nightmares from the loss of an earlier Morning Cloud and the loss of I believe 2 of the delivery crew that were bringing her back from East to South Coast, memory is fading but I believe one of those drowned was a relative of his.

One thing was very clear from this disaster and sadly others since, NEVER leave a big boat for a small liferaft unless you have to step UP into it. Five of the abandoned boats remained afloat even without hatchboards in and too many of the lives lost were from liferafts (5 I believe trying to climb from raft to the guard vessel Overjissel). That so many boats and crews came through this disaster is also a tribute IMO to the skill of their crews, that so many were lost we should remember for ever.


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Robin

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Chris Dunning must have missed the fact that 'Golden Apple' was abandoned whilst still afloat. (Irish AC boat?) There were a few boats in those days that would 'do' the Fastnet like entering the Round The Island, that is why the rules for needing to complete qualifying distance races offshore beforehand were introduced.

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halcyon

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Missed the start, but found it a bit thin on content.

Have a copy of three TV progs that wre current to the 1998 Sidney - Hobart race, re-run of the Fastnet, but with modern TV coverage. The seas were ( still trying to think of a word or words to fit here ), lives and boat loss were in the same magnitude as the Fastnet, and some decissions very odd. Some clips from that would have shown graphically what it must have been like on that Fastnet.

Any one watch the following prog on the life boats? bought back memories of the Penlee disaster.

Brian

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Robin

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Penlee

Yes I watched it too and also remember it at the time. I believe there was some 'discussion' between the Captain and the owners about costs of a tug if required (memory is hazy on the facts) and this delayed the mayday and lifeboat launch, perhaps enough to have contributed to the disasterous loss of Lifeboat and Ship's Crews. The Ship's Captain had his family on board too.

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robp

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Agree re the potential lost.
When Matt Sheahan or maybe another colleague was on the radio yesterday morning though, he said he watched their washboards fold up and collapse under a poop that day. Ouch!

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AlexL

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<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>

and some decisions very odd

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To an objective observer some of the decisions made in the Fastnet and especially the sydney-hobart (forewarned as they were because of the events of the fastnet some 20 years befre) may seem odd. However I cannot even begin to contemplate the effects of waves as tall as an 8 storey building on my decision making abilites, so I'm not sure its ever really fair to comment on decisions made after the event - although most enquiries and politicians do all the time.

FWIW I thought the book 'Fatal Storm' was a fantastic read and really bought home alot of the events of the sydney-hobart that day.

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halcyon

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My odd comment was directed shore side, not to boats on the water.
It appeared that a lot more could have been done to advise crews of weather, in the light of what happend in the Fastnet.
The seas were bad enough from the helicopter, what they were like at sea level !!!

Brian

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Gunfleet

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Re: saily talk on TV

So which way were they facing when you told them to pull the strings on the left hand side?

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tcm

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Core v weekenders

The prog gave no real detail of a timeline - merely that one boat was near the scillies when the water began to ripple. Also, that Ted Heaths boat frexample "limped in to Plymouth" (cue pic of morning cloud whamming in at quite a decent clip, not very much limping at all) .

Did the faster boats miss the bad stuff? Had they turned the fastnet already. Or wot?

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racingron

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I thought the Chris Dunning comment very harsh.

My feeling was that it was just awful weather. I would really hate to see what would happen if that sort of weather came in again, say next year. Regardless of the lessons learnt etc, it can be frightening in those conditions, add in the sleep deprivation, sea sickness etc. and bad decisions can still be made. It could be catasprophic.

Having been in just those kind of conditions myself, I have seen very experienced people go to pieces and make bad decisions.

250 boats do this race these days, how many have real experience?



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