Expensive mistake

[LymingtonPugwash]

Whoaa! £10,200 in total for this mistake.... I wonder if his insurance policy covers it? Some hope....
One would have thought that between the 9 crew, they would have managed to keep track of what they were doing.
http://www.mcga.gov.uk/c4mca/mcga-newsro...;m=7&y=2007

Does anybody know if this fine is excessive, illustrating a clamp down on the leisure boat user, or a common occurance for private yachties?

 

[salamicollie]

It seems in line with fines levied on a number of high profile cases in the last few years - Grant Dalton in the run up to The Race and a French boat last year. these wer both high speed runs in the wrong direction.

The fines also seem to be the same level as applied to smaller merchant ships!

Don't know if there is a clamp down...

 

[peterb26]

I dont think Insurance ever covers fines for breaking the law?

 

[jamesjermain]

Equate that with fines in Magistrates' and Crown Courts for motoring offences and minor criminal offences and this seems disproportionate. £10,000 for a shipping operator is not going to break the bank but for the skipper of a small yacht it could be disastrous.

 

[BlueSkyNick]

take your point about disproporitionate fines compared to motoring offences. However the fine is not as disastrous as the potential outcome of drifting into a TSS without paying attention to the boat's position.

 

[mel80]

[ QUOTE ]
... £10,000 for a shipping operator is not going to break the bank but for the skipper of a small yacht it could be disastrous.

[/ QUOTE ]


Is 70ft small these days!! Do the magistrates take into account the effect of a fine on the individual in question when they decide on it? I imagine that 10 grand won't make too much difference to the skipper in this case.

 

[rickp]

Was the skipper the owner then?

Rick

 

[MoodySabre]

Problem is a question of affordability. Boy racer, already lost his licence, still driving and being caught in a police chase - no money, no job - what penalty can you impose? Rich boat owner with incompetent skipper - £10,000 is petty cash. You or I might get away with a smaller fine (not that we'd do it,of course).

I remember Paul McCartney getting fined £250 for possession in 1960s when it took me him 15 minutes to earn. My first speeding fine of £40 was a week's pay. Justice is difficult to apply with equality.

 

[mel80]

[ QUOTE ]
Was the skipper the owner then?


[/ QUOTE ]

Apparently so. See here

EDIT:
Actually, I'm wrong about that. The skipper and the owner share the same name though (father/ son?). Either way, it clearly isn't your average private yacht. A bit difficult to know what to make of it without a few more details.

 

[jamesjermain]

[ QUOTE ]
Is 70ft small these days!!

[/ QUOTE ]
No! But would the fine have been any less for a 26ft Westerly?

 

[mel80]

[ QUOTE ]

No! But would the fine have been any less for a 26ft Westerly?

[/ QUOTE ]

That's a good question. Have you ever heard of a small boat skipper ending up in court for breaches of the rules. I haven't, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I also don't know whether magistrates can tailor the fine to suit the personal circumstances of the individual.

I guess that the other distinction would be that the skipper in this case was (I presume) a profesional.

 

[jonjo]

On my small colour plotter the separation zones are poorly represented. At a 32 mile scale and above, all I get is a black and white wire diagram of the coast. Has anyone noticed this when using a vector based electronic chart?

 

[sambrunner]

The boat in question is a Volvo 70 - the old Pirates of the Caribbean, now sponsored by Mean Machine, who shouldn't find that £10,000 dents their bankroll for the 2008/09 Volvo Ocean Race too much! mel80 - Dirk de Ridder is no relation of team owner Peter de Ridder, confusingly.

 

[Andrew_Fanner]

How do they justify £4200 costs?

 

[bilbobaggins]

When I taught the ColRegs, I used to emphasize yotties keeping out of TSSs whenever possible, and when 'obliged to cross' ( different emphasis in different languages ), to do as specified - on a heading at right angles. Whenever practicable, go around the end.....

The example I'd use was Dartmouth - Guernsey, passing the Off Casquets TSS.

Many, quite bluntly, rejected this. "I'll do what I bl***y want. It's my boat!"

I'm aware that the French regularly stop and fine British yotties for infringing the Off Ouessant TSS ( now extended ). I'm also aware that there are 3 TSSs around the Isles of Scilly, and that the Fastnet fleet - most of them - infringe at least the westernmost in their scores. One day, there will be 'tears before bedtime' as the whole bunch of leading BigBoats are arrested and escorted into port.....



/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[Blueboatman]

An interesting presumption then that at all times a small boat will know exactly where it is,how times change !

 

[ChrisE]

Is it just me?

Why am I a bit suspicious about this 'was unaware that windshifts would put him in the TSS' bit?

A Volvo 70, I'd be surprised if it wasn't kitted out with all the latest techno stuff and would know exactly where it was, how fast it was going and probably whether the tea was too hot.

He got done for taking the p**s.

 

[mel80]

[ QUOTE ]
An interesting presumption then that at all times a small boat will know exactly where it is,how times change !

[/ QUOTE ]

I would look at it another way. No one is expected to know exactly where they are at all times. However, it isn't unreasonable to expect people to know where they are not. In other words, you should always navigate in such a way that you know that you are clear of danger (or a TSS in this case). That much is just common sense.

 

[Seven Spades]

James Jermain is quite correct.

There have been a couple of cases if I remember correctly one where a motor boat entered Dover or Folksstone and did not respond to repeated radio calls (His radio was probably not switched on) y he was fined about £10k as well. Then there was a skipper of a scool boat traveling the wrong way down a TSS on the French side who was fined a similar amount.

It seems that the courts use a little black book cointaining recommended tarrifs for offences and it is quite clear that the fines are compleatly out of proportion to the offence. What I am amazed at is that I can't see that anyone has appealed the level of the fines.

 

[graham]

Re: Is it just me?

[ QUOTE ]
He got done for taking the p**s.

[/ QUOTE ]

My thoughts exactly Chris,A racing yacht that didnt realize a windshift had occured....... /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Personally I think it was passing close ahead of a merchant ship is what scuppered them.Once the complaint was made by the ship they would be obliged to follow it up.