Etap 28i additional keel ballast

[Cohoe]

I'm considering adding 300kg extra ballast by a 0.1m lead shoe on the bottom of my shallow draught keel. Etap have said the keel bolts are the same as that of the 1.6m draught version. Quote Thnks for Your mail. 1.Bolts are the same. 2.We guess you can do what you propose, only this is a boat from more than 17 years ago, so we do not know further all consequences, but we suggest you try that. Nice greetings, etap Unquote

The fin is 0.7m for my 895kg keel and 1.15m for the 840kg deeper keel. By my calculation the deep keel has a moment of 1.15m x 840kg=966kgm. So assuming the shoe adds 0.1m draught then 966kgm/0.8m=1207.5kg. So in theory the same force would be experienced on the bolts if we added upto 312.5kg. We have 9 x 15mm studs. I believe the hull design is particularly strong with double skin and foam. Please tell me if I'm wrong !!!

The boat needs to be reefed early probabely due to the lack of leverage of the shallow keel. 300kg extra ballast would increase the ballast ratio by 5% and marginally increase the wetted area by about a couple of cm but improve the righting moment by ballast over 30%. I hope this will improve the boat stability and stand up to a little more wind. I'd appreciate some opinions. I would rather have a deep keel if one was available. Anyone have one and want to swap ? I believe some owners added extra ballast in this way in the Sigma class, did it work well ?

To be honest I probably need a bigger heavier boat but I like the Etap design features. The under 30ft size keeps the bills down and the lack of condensation, dry bilge and relatively spacious cabin and modern saloon are attractive. So whilst I should be considering a different boat for my needs I find myself wanting to get the best out of what I have. I suppose it's the time and investment already spent too. New rigging, new deck paint, new tiller pilot, new seame transponder, new sail, modified one line reefing. etc.

We sail the South coast as a couple. 37 days so far this year. Once out of the Solent we can tolerate the rolling swell better than stopping in the short slamming chop. But it was off Portland in a Force 6 with both deep reefs and 1/3 rd of Genoa I realised how little sail we had and seemed to be struggling leaning 30 degrees with 15deg leeway making for the harbour. Then this 40ft beauty sails past to Weymouth with a full sail plan and a friendly wave. So I'm thinking why is my boat so fragile and not standing up to a bigger sail plan.

A couple of weeks ago we came back on a run around Portland Bill race gusting 30 knots with a scrap of Genoa and engine at 1500rpm for better directional control at 6 knots. We were using a lot of rudder with a 2 to 3m swell on the quarter and the tiller pilot couldn't cope with the range despite being upgraded to a rate gyro stabilised design. So again I was thinking why is this boat so unstable. I'm sure there are more sea kindly small yachts but probably longer keel higher displacement.

Attracted by the Etap features and my investment to date I don't want to give up. Hence I was considering more ballast equivalent to 3 crew sitting on the windward rail if we had room for them. We do have a radar and large blimp pretty far up the mast. I suspect they need to be offset. What with our cruising gear, tools, spare anchor, tackle, fuel, water etc we are nearer 3500kg gross than the unladen 2850kg unladen displacement advertised.

Any thoughts?

D

 

[William_H]

Ballast on the keel

The additional ballast at the bottom of the keel will be most useful at improving self righting moment ie at 90 degrees of heel.
You seem to speak of wanting stiffness (at small heel angles) which comes come overall ballast working with the shape of the hull. (It is called form factor). So if you find that the boat is good at self righting from a knockdown then ballast on the tip of the keel is adequate. Ballast can be added under the floor with nearly as good a result.
However of course ballast can be added under floor more easily and in a way that can be added to or subtracted as you find the end effect of course ballast here can be water fuel or other stores.
So I would suggest try under floor first or at least try a smaller amount of additional ballast on keel tip.

Bear in mind the additional ballast will reduce light wind performance. Good luck anyway with the mods. Yes I do support redesign of boats because there are so many compromises in boat design. So if comfort and stability are your priorities gp for it. olewill

 

[Sans Bateau]

As a previous owner of an Etap 28i, I know exactly where you are coming from. Adding addition ballast is something which I contemplated, but never carried out.

Adding extra ballast will improve the righting capability, however, with a shallow keel (is it the Scheel keel?) you will still suffer the leeway you describe and the benefit in a blow would be questionable. The Etap 28i is a light boat and a F6 is probably its limit, the 40ftr you mention would have been in her stride in those conditions. The 2 - 3m quartering sea would challenge many boats, so dont be downhearted by that!

Add the extra ballast, but dont expect huge changes.

 

[Cohoe]

Additional ballast

Ballast can be added under the floor with nearly as good a result. So I would suggest try under floor first or at least try a smaller amount of additional ballast on keel tip. [Unquote]

I didn't think internal ballast would be so effective. There is an inch or two under the floorboards and then we wouldn't have to worry about the strength of the keel bolts either. I suppose if we put lead shot in some shallow canvas bags and strapped it down with some steel plates tapped into the frames that would keep it in place in case of a knockdown. I could retrim with more on the port side as we already lean to starboard with the weight of the fuel tank and cruising gear stowage in the only lockers to starboard.

You suggest adding less weight to the tip of the keel. What figure have you observed makes a difference. How much have others tried and what performance difference has been observed. ?

Regards Dave C

 

[Cohoe]

Additional ballast

As a previous owner of an Etap 28i, I know exactly where you are coming from. Adding addition ballast is something which I contemplated, but never carried out.

Adding extra ballast will improve the righting capability, however, with a shallow keel (is it the Scheel keel?) you will still suffer the leeway you describe and the benefit in a blow would be questionable.QUOTE]

The 1.15m draught version ( fin to hull 0.7m ) I was hoping someone in the owners association might want to swap their deep keel for my shallow draught but the association forum is very quiet. Yes we suffer a lot of leeway as soon as we lean over and have to reef very early. Then we are under powered slam and stop in the chop. A 1.6m keel would seem a good compromise for our Solent Creeks and harbours versis performance in a future boat. I do love Beaulieu, Bembridge and Newtown Rivers. Shoal draught (0.45m less) isn't as useful as I thought. So you seem to think I won't be able to get Cohoe to stand up to her canvas any better ? Its going to cost over two grand to find out ! Ouch !

I guess a Contessa shape is better to cut through with nearly 2 Tons of ballast to power through the chop. But I'm still hoping to make the best of what I have for a few years yet.

Rgds DC

 

[Jamespask]

This is well out of time but I wondered if you did fit the extra ballast and if it made any difference ?

 

[Sans Bateau]

No I didnt, we had already moved onto an Etap 35i in 2004 when this was posted.

 

[LittleSister]

I imagine that any insurer would wish to be notified of any such modification, and to have professional confirmation (naval architect, surveyor or w.h.y. report) of its soundness.