EPIRB

[fireball]

1. They are typically unexpected and unforseen<snip> One of the disadvantages of EPIRB's is at the moment, the cost, well you are lucky in that respect.

Well - a radar could help forsee the unforseen so he can expect the unexpected?

All these pieces of kit are just multiple insurance policies ... you don't "need" any of it ... until it all goes wrong.

 

[jason -and the arguenauts]

Because it isn't cost effective?
An Epribs likely role in coastal waters is easily matched by DSC VHF and if you can get a few hundred quid for it then you could replace the lifejackets or put towards a liferaft?

We've got a manual EPRIB, but needs money spending on it to be able to register it - not worth the hassle for the sailing we do ...

If you cant buy the boat and also afford to equip it with the necessary lifejackets and raft without selling the epirb, then you are spending over your head IMO. The DSC radio doesnt duplicate the epirb, and doesnt transmit when the mother ship has sunk and you're drifitng in the raft. You need both.

 

[fireball]

You need both.

So what about those who don't have EPRIBS - are they spending over their head too?

 

[fishermantwo]

Epribs are compulory in Australia. Might be worth hanging on to in case the law in your country catches up.

 

[mocruising]

Ask the families of the poor victims of the Ouzo if they think there should have been an EPIRB on board. I think I am correct they all went into the water alive. IMHO liferafts and Epirbs should be compulsory on anything you can overnight or sleep on.

 

[toad_oftoadhall]

I am buying a boat that has a EPIRB ( 18 month old) fitted. As my sailing is very much limited to sort coastal trips is it worth keeping or is it something that can be sold?

Only you can answer that question. You know what the advantages of EPIRBS are. You know what other emergency communication kit you have. You've probably got some idea what the chances of needing it are.

For me, EPRIBS are close to the top of the spectrum of safety kit and it would be one of the last things I'd sell. Countless people come to a different conclusion and sail quite happily without.

Sailing's pretty safe of course, so you probably won't be making too big a mistake whatever you choose do.

All of the above IMHO, of course.

Good luck!

 

[bendyone]

If you cant buy the boat and also afford to equip it with the necessary lifejackets and raft without selling the epirb, then you are spending over your head IMO. The DSC radio doesnt duplicate the epirb, and doesnt transmit when the mother ship has sunk and you're drifitng in the raft. You need both.

As I said I have all the normal bits and pieces of safety equipment, Flares, Life-raft, Life jackets, harnesses, VHF , HH VHF etc. But sailing out of Calais fog and shipping are my main concern therefore my comment about radar. I guess I am never more than 3 miles from another ship, I just wonder how much use a Eperb would be.

 

[Blue5]

As I said I have all the normal bits and pieces of safety equipment, Flares, Life-raft, Life jackets, harnesses, VHF , HH VHF etc. But sailing out of Calais fog and shipping are my main concern therefore my comment about radar. I guess I am never more than 3 miles from another ship, I just wonder how much use a Eperb would be

I guess its like all safety gear, you hope you have wasted your money by never having to use it, peace of mind!!!!!

 

[bbg]

How much use will an EPIRB be?

As I said I have all the normal bits and pieces of safety equipment, Flares, Life-raft, Life jackets, harnesses, VHF , HH VHF etc. But sailing out of Calais fog and shipping are my main concern therefore my comment about radar. I guess I am never more than 3 miles from another ship, I just wonder how much use a Eperb would be.

It is almost certain it will be 100% useless. That is, the chance that you will ever need to use one is extremely low. Similar to all other safety kit - flares, liferaft etc. Even if the brown stuff does hit the fan, other equipment (e.g. DSC VHF) is probably as effective or even more effective to help you, particularly if you limit your sailing to coastal. As Toad said, you know the advantages and disadvantages. Only you can decide if it is worth keeping on board, or getting rid of it in exchange for a few £.

My personal choice would be to keep it (even if I might not buy one in your situation if I didn't have one), but if selling it means you can afford a radar - which you could not afford without selling it - then perhaps selling is the right choice for you.

 

[Blue5]

As I said I have all the normal bits and pieces of safety equipment, Flares, Life-raft, Life jackets, harnesses, VHF , HH VHF etc. But sailing out of Calais fog and shipping are my main concern therefore my comment about radar. I guess I am never more than 3 miles from another ship, I just wonder how much use a Eperb would be

I guess its like all safety gear, you hope you have wasted your money by never having to use it, peace of mind!!!!!

 

[photodog]

We have a Auto Release Epirb.... I bought it because I felt that if i was incapacitated or MOB.. then I wanted a easy way for whoever was left on board to attract help... and if we were run down ala ouzo, or had a sudden fire, then we would have some sort of chance.

If you are two up and one goes MOB... I think the workload will be too high for one person to keep an eye on the MOB, manouver the boat alongside, make the recovery... and at the same time be communicating with the CG on the VHF.....

We also have had for a number of years a PLB which we used on charter etc.... This has now been moved to the grab bag...

A bit OTT Im sure... But the CG seems to take Epirb signals seriously....

 

[Woodlouse]

In my opinion, auto release EPIRB's are fine, but only if the boat sinks. How is an auto release going to help you in a capsize? Presumably it works on a hydrostatic release, so if you've turned turtle then it probably won't be far enough under to be activated. Secondly, even if it does release then what are the odds of it floating free of the upturned hull?

Finally, when the coastguard gets a signal from an activated EPIRB the first 15-20 minutes of their response is taken up with phone calls to confirm that the boats at sea, where it should be, and whether it's likely to be in trouble. This is something that's necessary due to the many, many false alarms caused by EPIRB's going off accidentally.

So, if you have to call in a Mayday almost anywhere around our coast, doing so on the VHF will have a Helicopter or Lifeboat scrambled probably before the Coastguards had time to pick up the phone to authenticate your EPIRB signal.


As for the little aside about upturned cats, all cruising cats/multihulls have escape hatches for the even of a capsize. As they actually float slightly better upside down, it stands to reason if you can get out of the upturned hull, then you can get back in to retrieve your safety equipment.

 

[oceanfroggie]

Fireball ironically you forget one: a major fire, so no electrics, no VHF, no time, just jump into the life raft, dingy or water, just time to grap the EPIRB or PLB

 

[fireball]

Or HH VHF and Mobile ... not forgetting the flares

The causes of fire are gas, electric, engine or someone being a pillock with a fag ... we don't have the last problem so only need to concentrate on the first 3.
Electric - everything is protected by fuses - little chance of getting a fire there - but if the domestic bank did go bang then yup - we'd have no main VHF.
Gas - well away from the electrics - so would be time to hit the DSC button.
Engine - again, not in the same compartment as the batteries - so time to hit the DSC button.

Sorry - as "good" as EPRIBs may seem to be, they are just one part of an arsenal of safety kit and are as likely to be required as a liferaft .. tbh - if you're not sailing in isolated waters then it won't be long before you're picked up from a liferaft as your burning boat is gonna make one heck of a good alert system!

Having argued against the nessesity of a LR we've got one - because we intend to sail further from our normal grounds. Whilst an EPRIB is "on the list" ... it wouldn't be above Radar ...but still don't know if I'd sell an Eprib to enable the purchase of a radar - for the little money you'd get against replacement value it may not be worth it.

 

[oceanfroggie]

Fires like this are rare, but this took only 240 seconds. No time for anything had they been on their own. Had they had to jump into the water an EPIRB or PLB would have been a great option. Luckily there were other boats around.

Major Boat Fire

 

[nct1]

Well - a radar could help forsee the unforseen so he can expect the unexpected?
QUOTE]

If a I could buy a £1K Radar that could predict the future, I would be happy to give up me flares

Bad news for the online poker industry though :-(

 

[jason -and the arguenauts]

So- let's go through the "catestrophic failures" ...

1) Get seriously holed by a) hitting something (I'll know about it pdq and be able to do something immeadiately) or b) something hitting me - again, I'll know about it - and probably before it happens

2) Mast falls down - use VHF on pushpit antenna

3) Keel falls off and capsise - flares, HH VHF, Phone, Liferaft ... not in that order - although that is the one time an automatic epirb would come into its own.

Chances of 1 are reasonable - plenty of rubbish floating around - and some of them have engines!!

Chance of 2 again - reasonable - no reason to put 100% faith in the rigging

Chance of 3 - highly unlikely although not impossible - production boat, been inspected no signs of movement.

Situation 1 - are you really going to go down below to use the VHF when you see a tramp steamer looming out of the mist at you 25 yards away? You'd be a bit more noble than me if you did.

situation 2 - why do you need to call for help at all? You dont unless you are holed or without fuel

situation 3 - capsize is unlikely but I agree. An epirb comes into its own here

but situation 4 - fire. If you're trapped down below you can use the VHF before you die. If it happens when you're on deck then the epirb is your fiend.

In reality a fixed DSC vhf is only really of use in a minor emergency when you can safely go below. Or when you have the vhf control in the cockpit. On every occasion the epirb is useful

 

[fireball]

1, 3 & 4 - get a VHF with remote fist mike - it's at the wheel in the cockpit ... takes 5 seconds to press and hold the red button ...

It would be the first thing I did before abandoning ship ....

2 - erm, if my mast went over the side then yes I would alert the CG - prob as a panpan, but I'd rather get the contact in place just incase I can't get the engine working or it gets entagled with the rigging.

 

[fireball]

On every occasion the epirb is useful

Not really ... because you can't tell the CG what the problem is.