Do I need a speed seal?

ShipsWoofy

ShipsWoofy

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Running the stbd engine t'other day, noted the water light flickering and buzzer pipping, no water, we had checked, but we had seen the gasses emptying residual water rather than a good flow, we were mistaken and thought all was good. We now knows what good flow actually looks like (I am trying not to shift blame here /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif).

Well, my 6 year old OEM impeller finally did a yanmar (1GM10) and spinning around the core, the condition of the impeller material was amazing good I thought, 430 hours. This was the original impeller, the other engine failed after only 10's of hours.

Those that know me, know I am not as agile as I might be, I set about swapping the impeller, and I had real trouble, especially replacing the top bolt, the one behind the pulley wheel. In the past this has not been such a problem for me and I have never considered a speed seal as I have twin engines, thus it is rarely an emergency.

My problem was not removing the plate, I have lots of mini spanners from my electronics toolbox, my problem was getting the bolt to take up a thread blind (to me) and I dropped it 3 times into the bilge (her outdoors had to fish it out).

Does anyone think I would have a problem if I fitted the knurled bolts, but not the speedseal, as I am happy not to need a speedseal complete? With the bolts, I don't put much pressure on them to tighten, they are only small and it is a bronze body, it also seems not to take much to seal the thing anyhow.

Also, would the speed seal knurled nuts be slightly longer (thicker plate) so I couldn't buy some from them as spares? Would I therefore have to source my own keeping the exact length of the yanmar bolts?

Another thought I had, I could put a stud into the top hole and use that as a line up and have a small nut on that one, keeping the bolts on the other two as they did not cause me any real problems?
 
Another idea.

Can you get hold of Allen or star drive bolts the same size? I know these pump cover bolts are very small (4 mm thread?) so not certain of availability. I find it much easier to fit one of these than a normal straight screw slot, as with a bit of grease pushed into the recess the screw will stick to the key or driver.
 
As the "problem" bolt is the top one. How about a lump of metal brazed on to the bolt to give you something to get hold of? Plus a slot cut in the pump cover so you don't have to undo the bolt completely.
 
Doesn't the speedseal also have an o-ring, which lowers the force needed to make a seal?
Loctiting in a bit of brass or even ss studding worked for me. The loctite is as much to avoid corrosion as to lock the stud.
I stuck the gasket to the pump body with golden hermatite, then greased the other side, so that the gasket has a good chance of being reusable. Brass screws and nuts widely available in the electronics dogalogues.
 
Yes, Yes a thousand times Yes! Once you have fitted a Speedseal on a 1GM you will wonder how you ever managed without it! As you need two you might get a discount to reduce the financial pain, but you will gain the benefit for ever.

No connection - just satsfied user on both my boats.
 
After having to do an impellor change mid-channel in a sloppy sea, a speed seal was my first purchase on reaching land.

Fabulous bits of kit. So much easier to use than the normal cover.

Can't comment on other alternatives as my mechanical skills would result in disaster.
 
80 odd quid for a pair (quick look on the website), it is a rather painful outlay, I would like to see one and change it before coughing up blind.

The slot idea is interesting, but the nut also goes through the gasket, I could of course snip the gasket, but would always worry that it might reduce the seal, I will have to have a good look... the fact that the top nut is on the 'thick' part of the body, so there is plenty of paper between the nut and the impeller. Interesting.

The allen key nut is also an idea, but I am not sure given the finger room behind the pulley how much if any gain it would have trying to get that first turn on threads..

I think I might go for the loctited thread stud, as said, once I had the thread it is not a problem to 'finger tighten' and finish off with a little spanner.

£80

I hate twin engines!

Thank you for the ideas..
 
[ QUOTE ]
As the "problem" bolt is the top one. How about a lump of metal brazed on to the bolt to give you something to get hold of? Plus a slot cut in the pump cover so you don't have to undo the bolt completely.

[/ QUOTE ]You know what, I think it would also be a possible solution to drill an inspection hole through the pulley wheel, I think it is well within the outer 'slot' area of the pulley wheel (if that makes sense)... I wonder; then I could wap it in with a socket on my 'screwdriver' handle.


hmmm

I like this one..
 
Low risk purchase. It is one of those products that does exactly what it says. You have given a graphic description of the problem it solves. Father Christmas is bored this time of year - give him an opportunity to do something kind!
 
Rather than fiddle about with small screws in what might be bad working conditions, [e.g. rough weather, bad light, feeling sick, running out of sea-room etc! /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif ], I have a complete spare pump, overhauled and ready to fit. All it needs is a few moments work with a nut-driver [for the hose clips] and a 13mm spanner, and the job's done.

That's on a BUKH DV10 where the pump is easily acessible; might not be as easy on your engine.
 
Would not work with a 1GM. Getting the pump off is way more difficult than changing the cover - that is one of the reasons why a Speedseal is so good on this application. On my other boat, the Volvo 2030 has 6 tiny screws, at least two of which always want to emigrate to the bilge. Once again the Speedseal makes a rotten job easy.
 
I don't know how long you expect your impeller to last, but I think that six years is pushing it a bit and maybe should have been replaced earlier as a piece of preventive maintenance. Maybe having two engines provides a bit of a comfort zone. I have only one in my boat and I replace the impeller every season. I'd rather do the job when I choose to do it rather than getting caught with an overheated engine off a lee shore in a seaway. I know you cannot cover every eventuality, but I subscribe to any effort that lengthens the odds. Do you need a Speedseal? If you only open up the pump every six years, I'd save your money.
 
One of my refit jobs in January was to Lockitite in some S/S studding, the cover to be secured with knurled nuts from Kev at A2A4. Dropping the one at the top is still a risk as working behind the pulley is still a problem but I think it's an improvement. The knurled nuts are bigger and easier to find when dropped than the teeny wee bolts and I have a couple of spares nestling alongside the spare impellers.
 
Yes you do! I had one on my previous boat and after being late getting on board I forgot to turn on the sea water inlet ball valve and immediately motored off to get out of the river - as I was wondering why the engine note sounded different I realised what I (hadn't) done, shot below and changed the impellor in about 30secs flat. I did have another impellor and pair of modified pliers immediately available. I haven't fitted one to my present boat as the cover only has 3 screws and the cover has an 'O' ring fitted.
 
[ QUOTE ]
six years is pushing it a bit and maybe should have been replaced earlier as a piece of preventive maintenance. Maybe having two engines provides a bit of a comfort zone.

[/ QUOTE ] Nail on head, 2 engines gives great piece of mind, but also, double bills. Swings and Roundabouts.
 
I'm ditching a terminally ill 1874 md6a (Volvo) on to which i fitted a speed seal last year. If you can work out if it will fit your impeller housing pm me if you want it and I'll post it to you.
 
Another idea. Replace the bolts with studs and use wing nuts to secure. Another tool less solution and much cheaper than a speedseal. For small nuts bolts etc try these people. No connection - just a satisfied customer
 
Another good idea. I should be at the NW jumble this weekend, I will visit A2A4 and get some stud from him with ss wingnuts.
 
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