Diving on anchors

Very specific to Australia, I think.
However the med has its dangers- boat propellers. Coming up 20 meters from the boat could be dangerous as you might be aware of prop noise but you have to come up.

Diving to free your anchor is not such a problem as you are above your anchor.
 
OK, I won't. There now, I didn't need much persuading, did I?:D Nothing to do with sharks - more the temperature.
I've always thought that those people who advocate diving down to see if their anchor is suitably embedded, would be better just using one of these screw-in holdfast things, instead of an anchor. :rolleyes: Just dive down, screw in, job done.
Me, I'll stay up top and trust my anchor to do its job all by itself.:D
 
NormanS said:
OK, I won't. There now, I didn't need much persuading, did I?:D Nothing to do with sharks - more the temperature.
I've always thought that those people who advocate diving down to see if their anchor is suitably embedded, would be better just using one of these screw-in holdfast things, instead of an anchor. :rolleyes: Just dive down, screw in, job done.
Me, I'll stay up top and trust my anchor to do its job all by itself.:D
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I do dive down, pretty much every time, although less so in Spring as the sea is colder.

Why? Well a couple of reasons, firstly that I have learnt a lot about how an anchor sets or doesn't, how much it drags before setting and before hoisting it then how it turns or resets when the wind changes, secondly because I like snorkelling in warm water and seeing the hull and keel, and thirdly and most importantly because it tells me when I am not properly set.

For example about 3 weeks ago I dropped in about 5m in what looked like a big sandy patch surrounded by weed. We laid out the chain, put on slow reverse then slowly built up to full reverse as is our habit. Apart from a bit of skittering in slow reverse it then held well under full. But it didn't feel right and as usual I went down to check and saw that it was flat rock with crevasses and the anchor was lying loose on the seabed but with chain caught around an outcrop and holding us firmly, but with a wind change would simply release.


I could also see a much bigger area of actual sand about 20 meters away which held us perfectly overnight and bedded in properly (as it felt when we set and confirmed when I snorkelled).

So it's just another extra check which is a pleasurable end to a sail and can be useful in unfamiliar or difficult anchorages.
Nothing to do with testing anchor and gear but a useful test of the seabed that reversing alone does not give
 
Sorry Rupert - but you must be younger and don't arrive in anchorage in uncivilised hours!

Tasmanian waters in the summer are cold, or I think so - and I shudder to think how cold they are in winter. I find as I am approaching the age of maturity from that of youthful stupidity my ability to swim in water, with ice on the edges, has reduced to zero - and it needs to be into the 20s before I feel comfortable. But more important we often arrive in an anchorage in the dark and the requirement to rely on diving to assure us the anchor is set is simply a non starter.

I also cannot believe that many high latitude yachtsmen dive on their anchors - but maybe they are made of much sterner stuff, than me (or not scared of polar bears).

Diving on anchors appears to be very fashionable - I don't recall it being forefront in anchor technique in the past - in the the era of old gen anchors. Diving seems to have grown with popularity at the same rate as the use of NG anchor - which to me is something of a contradiction.

Jonathan
 
I hope the people involved are OK. The rescue people did a great job.

Events such as this are tragic, but to visit the Whitsundays and not go in the water because you are afraid of sharks would be sad. Even in winter temperatures are around 23° C.

There is plenty of fish and coral to see and snorkelling with the gigantic groper, maori wrasse, turtles and especially manta rays, is wonderful experience. Hundreds of people do this everyday and there has only ever been three or four shark attacks in recorded history in the area so the risks are not high, but as always everyone needs to decide this for themselves.

Take some simple precautions such as not swimming early in the morning or late in the afternoon. Don’t splash around like a wounded fish. Snorkel rather than swim.

While you are cooling off and looking at the marine life and coral, if you are interested in how your anchor works in the real world take the trouble and you will learn a lot, although in recent years compulsory moorings in the Whitsundays limit the anchoring opportunities and most of the substrates you will see are soft sand or mud. In these ideal substrates most anchor designs work very well.

If you are anchoring in any coral areas, particularly on the Great Barrier Reef itself (although strictly speaking this is not part of the Whitsundays) it is important to check that your anchor and chain cannot do any damage to live coral. Snorkelling is the best way to do this. Here there are some risks, not from sharks but it is easy for currents to exceed your ability to swim even with fins, so make sure you understand what the currents are going to do. If you are swept away there is no land to swim for, but these problems are easily avoided.
 
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I can't see any point in diving to check the anchor if you are on a lunch stop and won't be leaving the boat unattended or where the anchorage is one well known to you with good holding on a sand, shingle or mud bottom.

However, where one is staying overnight or leaving the boat unattended and the bottom is unknown or known to be rocky and especially where a wind or tide change will occur, then I think it is a worthwhile precaution.

I have twice dived on my anchor in "unknown" anchorages to find the anchor is held physically against a rock with no penetration into the seabed whatsoever. With a 180 change in wind the boat would have simply pulled free. It might then have dug in or caught on another rock, but I'd rather know what I'm dealing with if possible.

Richard
 
Neeves said:
Diving on anchors appears to be very fashionable
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People in the UK do not generally dive on anchors.

Swimming at all at anchor is relatively uncommon, confined to a few months in late summer in anchorages without too much tide. And even if one were swimming, in most places the water isn't clear enough to see the bottom.

It's mostly a Mediterranean thing - if you're going snorkelling anyway, as we tended to at every lunch and evening stop on charter holidays, then you might as well head over to the anchor for a look, why not?

Pete
 
even in the Med, you often overnight with lines to shore in which case slack lines later in the evening means you're dragging or something's wrong.
With the old bruce copy, I used to send the son at the beginning with his mask to have a look if the anchor is set, now with the Mantus and up to 6-7m if I can see the rollbar + part of the main body, I'm worried, if the chain just disappears in the seabed then it's fine :D
This year in twenty days onboard I haven't bothered once (and temps were 26+ )

V.
 
RupertW said:
Why? Well a couple of reasons, firstly that I have learnt a lot about how an anchor sets or doesn't, how much it drags before setting and before hoisting it then how it turns or resets when the wind changes, secondly because I like snorkelling in warm water and seeing the hull and keel, and thirdly and most importantly because it tells me when I am not properly set.

For example about 3 weeks ago I dropped in about 5m in what looked like a big sandy patch surrounded by weed. We laid out the chain, put on slow reverse then slowly built up to full reverse as is our habit. Apart from a bit of skittering in slow reverse it then held well under full. But it didn't feel right and as usual I went down to check and saw that it was flat rock with crevasses and the anchor was lying loose on the seabed but with chain caught around an outcrop and holding us firmly, but with a wind change would simply release.
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+1 Rupert.

I think the main advantage is learning how anchors perform, but diving does help identify those rare occasions when the anchor is hooked on rock or debris, as you have described. These sets can be quite solid with the anchor holding full reverse, but with a slight change in wind direction the anchor can break out.

Sometimes this sort of substrate can be identified by how the anchor and chain performs when setting, but not always.

This photo is an example. This Delta anchor could well hold full reverse, but could easily break free in only light wind if there was a change in direction of pull. This has nothing to do with quality of the anchor design. No design is secure in this type of substrate.

D6DNsl9.jpg



It is not possible to dive on the anchor in many locations, and it certainly not essential, but if the conditions permit, and you are confident in the water, you will learn a lot about anchor performance.

Edit:
I see Richard has also the described the same sort of situation as shown in photo.
 
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Neeves said:
Sorry Rupert - but you must be younger and don't arrive in anchorage in uncivilised hours!

Tasmanian waters in the summer are cold, or I think so - and I shudder to think how cold they are in winter. I find as I am approaching the age of maturity from that of youthful stupidity my ability to swim in water, with ice on the edges, has reduced to zero - and it needs to be into the 20s before I feel comfortable. But more important we often arrive in an anchorage in the dark and the requirement to rely on diving to assure us the anchor is set is simply a non starter.

I also cannot believe that many high latitude yachtsmen dive on their anchors - but maybe they are made of much sterner stuff, than me (or not scared of polar bears).

Diving on anchors appears to be very fashionable - I don't recall it being forefront in anchor technique in the past - in the the era of old gen anchors. Diving seems to have grown with popularity at the same rate as the use of NG anchor - which to me is something of a contradiction.

Jonathan
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I wouldn't dive on the anchor in cold water or the dark either and don't much in the Spring or if we arrive at night, but it's a nice extra check and I sleep very soundly indeed with the recent image in my head of the anchor nicely buried.

It actually adds extra safety (eg in the rocky situations) maybe once or twice a year and in those situations it may not always matter if the wind didn't change.
 
I used to (Scuba) dive before I had kids. Many times I've dived and not been able to see my hand at the end of my arm due to poor viz. IME on the south coast it's rare that the viz is great. I'm afraid I have absolutely no intention of trying to snorkel on my anchor in the UK. Indeed I'd argue (because I'm contrary and like a good debate) that if you're only getting in to dive your anchor, you're adding *more* risk by getting into the water rather than staying safe and warm on board and taking transits/setting an anchor alarm.

If we ever find a nice clear bay to anchor in (say if we make the Scillies next year) then of course I'll snorkel on my anchor, but:

a) I don't think it's necessary
b) Its often simply not practical in the UK
c) I doubt I'll have to worry about shark attack in my normal cruising grounds!

I'll just stick this here https://www.mja.com.au/journal/2012/197/4/snorkelling-related-deaths-australia-1994-2006 there are risks associated with breath-hold diving. Small, but then what's the risk if your anchor drags and you have an appropriate system of actions prepared to deal with it.

Note:- I don't believe for a minute that snorkelling is inherently dangerous for someone as good looking and talented as myself.:cool: But as a way of stimulating debate, I thought it quite an interesting point to make - that by trying to reduce one risk you may be introducing another.
 
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RupertW said:
I wouldn't dive on the anchor in cold water or the dark either and don't much in the Spring or if we arrive at night, but it's a nice extra check and I sleep very soundly indeed with the recent image in my head of the anchor nicely buried.

It actually adds extra safety (eg in the rocky situations) maybe once or twice a year and in those situations it may not always matter if the wind didn't change.
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Big :encouragement:

If it's not cold and murky why not, you'll never come back knowing less.

"Fashionable" seems to come across as "people following some new fad" rather than an opportunity to learn more, noelex's pics and panope videos are gold dust for the most of us who rarely see what's actually going on down there and just hope for the best (which nearly always works) :cool:
 
TopBanana said:
Wise words Balbas
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I think he's right, there is a new risk but some risks are fun and some are not. So the risk of being woken up from a drunken sleep by an anchor not properly set is weighed against the risk of a warm swim, seeing sea life and risking cramp or jellyfish or whatever. And the chances are I'll want to have a swim or two at the anchorage anyway.

But the risk of going snorkelling in the dark to check the anchor is no fun at all so I take the slight risk of not checking it.
 
GHA said:
...... an opportunity to learn more, noelex's pics and panope videos are gold dust for the most of us who rarely see what's actually going on down there and just hope for the best (which nearly always works) :cool:
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Way before the internet and NGAs, most folks could work out how an anchor system worked if they took time to think about it. It really did not require videos and diving on our anchors to establish that. There was also ways in which one could establish and test the holding capability of their anchor. Experience was also gained from the effort required when weighing anchor, looking at the quality of the bottom from charts and inspecting what came up with the hook. All in all, diving was not considered relevant to understand how our anchors worked. Reading about such stuff was not weird before the internet and undersea videos became routine and when they did, it confirmed what many thought, improved understanding and dispelled some myths. The thing about diving is that it is a risk that is not required to be realised just to check an anchor.
 
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