Diesel stove question

[nmeyrick]

With the Webasto having broken down yet again, I'm determined not to rely on it as our sole source of heating next year. They are a great piece of kit for what they do, but just aren't designed for full time heating on board.

The alternative looks to be a drip feed diesel heater, and having searched on past posts here I'm leaning heaviy towards the Dickinson Newport for it's bulkhead fitting and visible fire which looks extremely cozy.

I see that there are a number of people on the forum who have these stoves or something similar, and would really appreciate some advice from first hand experience. My main concern is how good they are at heating the whole boat, rather than just the area around the heater? The only place I can really put one without major internal surgery on the boat is on the forward bulkhead over the foot of the sofa, with the botton about 28" above the sole. I know these are best fitted on the sole, but have seen people suggest a fan blowing across the pipe should prevent a pool of cold air below the level of the heater. Does anyone have experience of this sort of system and can comment on whether or not it works?

Equally important is that we have a centre cockpit 38' boat, and sleep in the aft cabin which is reached via a low walkthrough. Again does anyone have experience of a similar setup? I don't want to end up freezing in the back even though the cabin is toasty!

Any comments much appreciated

 

[Davy_S]

It may be worth googling Kabola drip fed normal draught stoves, plus the eco fan. I have used a Kabola (no leccy needed) it was very good, the eco fan is not cheap, about 70 europs, but blows the heat around the building or boat. It ran faultlesly plus a trained chimpanzee could have fixed and serviced it, unlike the more expensive (c)rap.

 

[SimonJ]

Heating

I ditched my Eberspacher long ago - expensive to fix and in my view made for trucks not the marine environment. They also need to be run regularly. Same no doubt true of the Webasto & both need electricity.
I replaced my heater with a Force 10 which runs on diesel from a tank pressurised by a cycle/tyre pump and is preheater with alcahol/meths. Simple, efficient & cheap to buy, fit and maintain & does not flatten the battery. In a 34ft boat it is fine although extremities of boat not so warm but a waist high bulkhead position for mounting works well. If I want more hot air circulation then I operate 2 low power fans originally fitted for cooling in the tropics. The heater has done me well in the chill of Canada and the lesser cold of UK.
Simple is good!

 

[swanny]

Stoves

Hi, if you've looked at older posts perhaps you saw mine regarding my Refleks Diesel stove. It's not wall mounted but they do one as an alternative. I can't comment on how effective wall mounted ones are apart from suggesting that it's the chimney height that will dictate where you site a stove. All stoves need a good length of chimney in order to work without downdraughts and difficult starting. Refleks if I remember correctly recommend at least six feet and that the top of the chimney be clear of obstructions i.e. cabin tops, masts etc. I don't live aboard but spend some good time aboard in the spring in Denmark so I am dealing with zero to five degrees in the night usually. I have an extension pipe which I fit to the deck fitting to lengthen the chimney and I have never had any downdraught yet. My chimney is quiet near the mast where it exits the boat but it appears to cause no ill effects perhaps due to the height of the chimney. Without the extension it is two metres and with it say two and a half. Being on the floor means it draws in cooler air and circulates this into hot air much better than if it were on the wall. I had the same issues with regard to space on my 36 centre cockpit boat but decided that if I was going to go down this road, I would go down it whole heartedly. I have no regrets, it's wonderful and part of the family. I certainly don't miss the 45cm of seating I discarded in order to fit it. I also looked at Dickinson and visited the Hamburg Boatshow where I was told by a supplier of all makes of stoves that if they had to choose they would pick the Refleks. Do they make more profit with Refleks's?? Dunno. What swung it for me was the simplicity of Refleks, the fact that nearly all the fishing fleet in the Baltic use them in all weathers and the construction inside makes it difficult to get any spillage. The factory speak good English and will accommodate most requests for small mods if necessary. I have to tell you with regard to the aft cabin tempreture it's not the same story. I also use a Caframo Eco Fan on the cook plate of my 2000k refleks and while it makes a difference in the foward cabin it makes very little difference in the aft cabin. Having said that, I don't have the stove set on very high levels and I don't use the aft cabin so much. I rarely have the stove on more than setting one and it goes up to six. I must try this season to pump it up more to see if this has an effect on the aft cabin. It's not freezing in the aft cabin but it's not cozy like in the main cabin. My boat is also not insulated. It's single skin (albeit heavy lay up) glassfibre for hull and deck but as I have said, I don't need the heater on high to make it very warm. I would suggest you get a stove with a water coil inside and connect up a radiator in the aft cabin and perahps one in the head. Flexible routing the water should not be too difficult to do. I wish I had done this also. But I was unsure as to how far I wanted to go with it. Also, stoves with a coil inside them produce less heat in the main area as it also has to constantly heat up the circulating water. Having said that and with my experience, I don't need the full output of my stove in the cabin anyway. If you buy a stove with a water coil inside you must use it! You cannot use the stove and say connect up radiators at a later date as the coil will be damaged by use without water inside it. Fitting a diesel drip feed stove is quite a commitment so I recommend going all the way and finding the floor space for a good powerful one with a coil. You won't regret it. A webasto is just another machine buried away in a locker somewhere, something to go wrong at the most inconvenient time. A stove is an addition which creates character and atmosphere within your boat. Find the space to site it and you'll never sail alone again. Ok, ok, I love my stove!!

Do a search for "No Questions, No Problems, just......! which was the title of my stove post and you will see pictures of my stove if you haven't already! I posted it on the 25/1/2010 Good luck!

 

[npf1]

If you want a used Force 10 Cozy Cabin Deisel/Kerosene Version - as described above by another poster - I have one that I was about to stick on fleBay. PM if you want details.

 

[freedom44]

Diesel Stove

I also chose a Dickinson Newport. I was impressed by the Reflex but what swung it for me was the sight of the flickering flames of the Newport. The Reflex with a water coil would be the answer to heating a boat throughout in really cold climates but we felt this was slightly OTT for us.

I took out the L shape end of a bunk to install it on the sole. I lost a seat around the table but even if I left it in, you would not be able to sit there as the fire would be at your back. The chimney doesn’t seem to intrude into the cabin too much and generates an enormous amount of heat.

Incidentally, it is not difficult to remove the fire and stow it elsewhere if you are not planning to use it for a length of time.

The installation is not difficult. An experience of AGA type units helps as basically they all operate on the same principle although without the wick.

I decided to make mine totally independent and installed a day tank. I am not sure I would bother to do this again as the tank was expensive and difficult to design a breather pipe which doesn’t leak when healed. I think the take off option with the small pump is probably easier.

We have only used it in UK spring/autumn when it has heated our 44ft boat well. Ours is an aft cockpit with our cabin separated off central line just before the companionway, so quite some distance from the fire. The heat permeates its way down there but there is a considerable temperature drop on the way. I need to perfect the control of the through draft as I am sure you could rig up the hatches to draw the heat to the stern more effectively.

I am a fan, but my only word of caution, is that it does seem to require continuous maintenance to keep the soot/canker down. This maybe my fault, but I have tried to follow the instructions carefully. I think part of the reason is that we don’t leave it on for long periods (i.e. 24/7) which I think it is designed to do. However, there are lots of instructions in the bumf “Not to be left unattended “ which slightly defeats the object. We do, as I reckon they are just protecting their liability.

Hope this helps

 

[FWB]

This is a Canadian made Sigmar 100 Diesel heater. Available from Kuranda.

It's a lot smaller than the Dickenson and is bulkhead mounted, with a visible flame.
It has a carburettor type control valve, similar to the Dickenson. The Taylors type is drip fed.

 

[tkomarine]

Reflecks

Hi all,
We have a Reflecks with a water coil as mentioned above. It runs three small radiators via a Jabsco circulation pump. All I can add to the discussion is that ours works well and has never been a problem.