Delivery Trip!! Looking back?

MaltaBob

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Bought the P360 from RYB Windsor 3 years ago and they agreed to get it to Malta. Finally it was decided the most cost effective route was truck to La Grand Motte in s.w.France and then motor down the med to our new base in the Grand Harbour, Valletta, Malta. This was done early in the year, April and the conditions were not ideal.
We arrived, myself from Malta and a pal from the UK and made our way to the agreed hotel that evening and found a note from the delivery skipper confirming the boats location and departure time of 5.30 am the following morning. Full of eager anticipation we trundled off the following morning down to the boat and said our hello's and off we went. The skipper was very emphatic that we did not need to do anything, he'd arranged 'everything'. Fair enough, and he made it very clear that his word was law. Again, fair enough.
However, whilst the boat had a VHF it did not work, my pal and I were not happy about this and it was agreed we could try to fix it - silver foil from a chocolate wrapper did the job as the fuse had blow and there was a dry joint at the back of the set. Sorted.
The weather was bl**dy awful, frequently lifting the stern out to the sound of two unhappy propellors! The weather continued pretty much like this for the next 8 days.
We had no flares, no life raft and only our trusty Avon dingy.
During the trip both compressor belts failed at different times thankfully, and numerous other repairs , which were listed in the survey and subsequently in the purchase process required on-route attention. When I challenged the skipper who worked full time for the company in a sales capacity, he simply said " we always pass on the info to the workshop, but they always let us down ".
My pal and I both jumped ship south of Naples, when it appeared the belt and alternator on the s/b engine had several days TLC heading their way. It was April , every where was deserted, and the trip had been longer than my friend had allowed for and he had other commitments back in the UK.
The radio produced some very interesting weather information, on one occassion F9 as we headed to Corsica. We got out of the way and changed course, credit to Bill the skipper, he was a bit of a cunning old fox and could handle a boat no doubt at all!
All in all, I do feel we should have been much better prepared, maybe we trusted his experience too much, but he was very insistant and said he would do every thing required.All we had to do was turn up. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Well, we're alive to tell the tale , but what views do you have?
 

sarabande

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You are the owner; he's a paid hand, basically. It's a bit irresponsible to to take three persons out on a longish trip without adequate safety kit.

If something had gone seriously wrong it would be your head on the block, not his. I suggest you get the survey details attended to in a sensible prioritised order, and then find a check list of what a well-found boat should have, and implement it according to your disposable budget.


The delivery company should have a list of checks and kit, and a clear contract for what they were going to do.

Otherwise you'll never be able to take the boat out to sea without wishing that you had got a set of wooden plugs, spare fuses, standby drinking water, big torch, or all theother items that a safe and efficent boat needs to cope with being at large and in cheerful use at sea.
 

Whitelighter

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I think this forum continues to show that long delivery trips in newly purchased boats are a bad idea /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif
 

MaltaBob

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The trip was 3 years ago, as I said" looking back" My friend and I were relative novices, RYB as those will know, were a main boat dealer and it was not unreasonable for us to expect
some input from them.More over, the skipper was totally insistant we were to do nothing - he'd taken care or everything !! RYB even emailed me his CV which was very impressive after delivering oo's of boats to the med and skippering boats all over the world. We trusted them.
I even suggested I could bring a first aid kit, and a good set of tools. My company used to supply high quality hand tools to many other tool companies, he declined the offer? His Tesco bag of rubbish bits was all he needed, he said !
Yes, the faults prior to delivery were listed, I even flew from Malta for 2 days to ensure they were ' on with it ', and whilst all the work was not complete they promised to do all works. Needless to say, all was put right by me the owner at the earliest opportunity, but my trust was sadly misplaced in the boat dealer! Surprise , surprise
 

peterb26

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[ QUOTE ]
I think this forum continues to show that long delivery trips in newly purchased boats are a bad idea /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd agree with that Jez but go even further and say "long delivery trips in brand new boats" are possibly a bad idea as well.

My last two Volvo-propelled new boats boat had warranty problems withing the first 30 hours that would have almost certainly been catastrophic on a delivery trip.
 

rickp

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Yeah, some guy called Jez Banks makes exactly that point in this months MBY /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Rick
 

peterb26

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Apologies Rick - we dont get MBY in Portugal! The most recent one I can find is Oct 2006 in the local Marina Bar......

By "delivery trip" I didnt mean a 100 mile dash along the coast - I mean a decent 1000 mile jobbie.
 

Hurricane

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I know this guy.
We bought our boat from RYB and part of the deal was to help us on our first trip from Gosport to the Hamble. I'm sure that this is the same skipper you had - he also skippered our boat on her sea trials.
I just couldnt get on with the guy - they let me down by putting the initial trip off by a week as well so didnt start off on the right foot either. There were some plans for them to give me some extra tuition but after our initial trip, I simply didnt ask them and decided to go it alone. They were supposed to give me an introduction to the various systems on board - our boat is packed full of extras and systems that I hadnt seen before but I still decided to learn it all myself because when I asked even simple questions it was clear to me that they didnt understand the systems either.

I dont regret my decision.

Thankfully, the boat turned out to be great and hasnt let me down - not ever!!! but this whole experience has given me a very sceptic view of (so called) professional skippers.
 

tcm

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I'd qualify that by saying long delivery trips in *unproven* newly bought boats. That sailing cat was new to me transat - but had already done transat just 2 months earlier. Tho mebbe also mobos need to be in better shape - mobo's set out in a condition that sailing boats would be calling for help - no mast, no sails, just engine.
 

sarabande

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Sorry, I didn't realise that the trip was hostory, but it's been a very usefulposting and has brought up some issues with the professional standards of deliveries.


Perhaps some of the pros here could give us some insight into what they expect from owners when contracted to undertake a delivery. Are there "standard" terms and conditions ? Do you have a check list without which you will decline to set sail ?
 

Whitelighter

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Good point TCM - your cat example is a good one. Though even you had issues with the vibration on one engine which restricted usability. How comfy would you have been in a Mobo on 1 engine?

I think you are right, MOBO perhaps are a bit more delicate than Saily boats
 

MaltaBob

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Thanks Hurricane, he was a ' one off Dutchman ' but he could definately handle a boat.
My pal and I had to eat the food HE bought , which eventually he gave me the bill for ! So, one day at the fuel stop we nipped of for bacon & bread , he went potty- " I told you I had everything we need, don't know why I bother " We fancied a bacon buttie , guess what , when we asked him if he'd like one Oh yes please; It sure made a change from Edam cheese and cereals.
Seriously though, the story was a reflective anecdote, he was a bit awkward before the trip via email, and a retired friend in Malta said he didn't like the sound of him from his emails - salutory lesson learnt. Guess it makes me all the more careful , as they say " 3P's"
Cheers all.
 

powerskipper

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this is opening a can of worms!!!


Safety is everything,
for personal safety the skipper need to carry
enough life jackets or make sure everyone has their own.
flairs, in date
handheld vhf,
first aid kit,
life raft
charts of the whole trip
almanac
and held GPS [ I carry 2]
some basic tool,
for longer trip provisions will be needed.


the boat
need to have had a successful no problem sea trail. if faults occurred they should be fixed and re sea trailed.
all electronics working if possible but VHF a must.
A full service kit for both engines is wonderful but unlikely.
full fuel tanks, and for longer trip agreement on fuel payment, if payed by skipper expenses repaid quickly,


other things to think about,
if the trip is get there quick,
you will need crew,
1 fairy competent that can take helm to let skipper rest and poss 1 or 2 others to take watches, that is running 24hr just fuel stops.
understanding that some times it is just not possible to get the boat there due to weather.

these are just some of the stuff I could go on a bit but will leave it at that.
 

tcm

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Skippers and 3 p\'s

He sounds very weird,possibly dangerous if he brooks no discussion and yethas no vhf or liferaft.

There is a lot of this in the med tho, with gung-ho deliveries of perhaps-flaky boats with little or no safety gear - i asked our boat to be moved once and the deliv skipper (i wasn't onboard) was v complimentary afterwards about having liferaft! and tools too! and flares! So obviously not always the norm.

Anyway,of course being skipper isn't about flinging orders around and crew doing everything he says - including eating skipper's choice of food for crissakes!

So what's the 3 P's ?
 

MaltaBob

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Sorry me again ! My kids live in the Reading area, we're there from the 19thDec. till whenever? Son and daughter in law expecting their first. Do you guys meet in a pub in Wokingham, wouldn't my buying you a pint , if that isn't too foolish- can you let me know
/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gifBob.
 

djefabs

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Hi Jez
I obviously don't agree with that. I certainly would NOT take a brand new boat on any sort of delivery trip but was happy to bring Ocean Tigress home. Everything was checked, double checked and then checked again to ensure that the trip home was going to be safe and uneventful. I would also never take a crew that I did not know and trust. The delivery trip home was very laid back and had lots of fun but it was treated with a great deal of respect from all concerned. I would do it again tommorow.
 

Divemaster1

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[ QUOTE ]
I think this forum continues to show that long delivery trips in newly purchased boats are a bad idea /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

In principle I'd agree, but also want to say that with good planning, knowledgable crew and understanding of the potential issues mitigates a lot of the "unforseen" incidents. Main problems are;

1) Owner / Crew inexperienced and not knowing their limitations.
2) Owner / Crew not knowing the mechanics and spares requiremens
3) Owner / Crew not knowing the area they are operating within and the limitations they have with access to secondary ports, and communications and protocols within the area.
4) Not enough contingency planning
5) Time restrictions

I am not saying it is plain sailing ... we took our 20 odd year old purchase from South Italy to NE Scotland on the 1200 miles journey. Some minor hickups, but nothing major we could not handle en-route. Nothing dangerous happened, but we did accept a week or two delays due to weather etc. I seem to recall that I wrote about the trip a couple of years back..... (but then again we do have "proper" engines onboard in a different shade of green and well tested equipment.... /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif )
 
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