Decisions, decisions- overwintering (southern spain portugal)

Carolwildbird

Carolwildbird

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Right. We're just spent an enjoyable time in the rias, and are about to drop into Portugal, getting into the Algarve by the end of September.

Where, or where to overwinter? We've met others who we are cruising with and have now got several ideas, and all sorts of things are swimming around in my head.

Almerimar.. was the original destination. Cheaper than most, but away from town.. how good is the social scene? Appeals because of proximity of alpajurras and sierra nevada (love walking and have a dog- don't want just to be on city pavements). Also, will there be space?

Cartagena... nice town.. so I hear. How many liveaboards there?

Vilamoura- know nothing about it..

Aguadulce ditto

Lagos- expensive relatively speaking. What are the benefits apart from proximity to a town?

Seville- not yet explored this possibility... but suggested by another cruiser.

Cadiz - pics of marina look like middle of container port.

thoughts anyone?

carol
 
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Have you considered the Rio Guadiana, boundary between Spain and Portugal? Like Hotel California, people just never leave . . .
A number of places, I think, before you even get to Gib, let alone Almerimar or Cartegena (lovely place).
 
Hi

Almerimar.. Cheaper as you said with many liveaboards. Not the best looking marina. If you need work doing and are on a small budget this is the place, but you will need to check for space, as you will for all the marinas.


Cartagena... nice town.. A few stay to winter very close to the town but can be a bumpy with wind and passing boats if your berth is on or near the entrance.

Vilamoura- Not cheap and we do not like Marina

Aguadulce ?

Lagos- expensive relatively speaking. Close to town and a number of liveaboards with a net and organised events. Nice marina. Used to be organised weekly? walks. Easy to return to UK from here train/bus/airport. We Like.

Seville- I enjoyed, but not sure where you could stay for the winter.

Cadiz - pics of marina look like middle of container port. Not all in the container port, but overall we would not winter here.

If on a tight Budget Almerimar has it all, but not as nice as Lagos if you could afford it. We stayed 2 winters in both and Lagos was worth the extra euros.

I am sure there will be a few more suggestion put forward.

David and Emma
s/y fiveflipflops

solomons Island Chesapeake Bay USA
 
Way off thread................. BUT, have been walking in the Alpajurras in summer - bloody marvellous - in winter, could be cold - very high. Some skiing there.
 
It's five years since we left the Algarve but I remember it fondly. We had a berth in Vilamoura for 18 months. It's big and pretty impersonal but well run. Noise from the disco's can get a bit overwhelming at times! The sound of 'My Way' from the Karaoke bar at 4am takes some ignoring!

The plus side is that it's lively, there's a great walk along the seashore to the down and dirty town of Quarteira which has a terrific market. One of the best we've found anywhere.

The Vilamoura cruising club has regular meetings, newsletters etc. The haulout facilities and tradesmen are excellent.

We spent 5 months on the River Guardiana and very nearly never left! No facilities except in the marina's near to the mouth. We stay in Vila Real ocassionally but there's one hell of a current flowing through there, up to eight knots at times! Great town though, good cultural centre, restaurants etc.

Another place we loved was Rota. On the face of it a pretty commercial town in the Bay of Cadiz. Spent some winter months there and had a ball. Quite a few liveaboards, close to a vibrant really Spanish town centre with every convenience you could want. Don't get a berth on the port side though as the swell can be horrendous, go for the other side, much calmer.

For what it's worth Portugal is the one country, so far, that I can see us returing to in years to come. Loved the people etc.
Have a look at www.martinnorthey.net He's a RYA examiner whose been on the Algarve for eaons and has some interesting articles on his site.

Have fun.

www.gerryantics.blogspot.com
 
Cartagena very few liveaboards but lots of Brits who go down regularly from their flats and homes locally. Proper town with working people, tourism 10% of GDP in Cartagena, I guess.

Almerimar fewer liveaboards than in the past lots of Brit flatdwellers, Brit cafés, Brit nights. Lots of Spanish, too. Mostly Spanish stick with Spanish, Brits with Brits and Germans, Dutch and other non-Spanish EU congregate with Brits. Tourism leisure 95% GDP in Almerimar.

Getting about. Cartagena busses and trains, can get to anywhere in Spain without a car. Almerimar, only a few busses a day to the local towns (El Ejido and Roquetas). If going somewhere far most people take a taxi at least to El Ejido if not to the airport or Almeria, or rent a car.

Things to do. Almerimar mostly bars and restaurants, golf, holidaymaker gatherings, yachtie get togethers, 'net' on VHF every morning. No cinema. Cartagena, Spanish town with normal things. No English language cinema (I didn't find one).

Very much a personal choice thing but for a liveaboard winter you will have more company in Almerimar. Could be quite lonely in Cartagena unless you talk to your other half or make Spanish friends = speaking Spanish.

Weather. About the same. Not much rain, mostly blue skies. T shirts and shorts in December but much cooler in mid Jan through Feb when you will want a jacket or a sweater most days and some heating.

Mooring costs. Beware cost of electricity in the new marina in Cartagena. Over 13? 15? m they charge €0.30 per kWh, a horrible price. Almerimar is about €3 per day electric and water unlimited unmetered and if you want to save money just hand back the cable for that day and you don't pay the €3. Some people do that regularly when the weather is nice and take electric only every few days to fill water tanks, do the washing and top the batteries.

Safety. Cartagena can get quite rough mainly from pilot cutters and other boats but also from strong southerlies. The staff seem pretty average, not the best or the worst. Almerimar can be rough in the darsensas nearest to the sea. In the inner darsena (3) it is always flat calm even in gale conditions. Almerimar staff are the best I have every come across. Very professional, in bad weather they patrol constantly 24 hours a day and sort ropes and fenders out for any yacht that is not riding well.

Security. Cartagena new marina has CCTV and 24 hour security and an electric gate but anyone can gain access between the Internet hut and the fence, just walk through. So for those who know, Cartagena has no effective physical security.

Almerimar has CCTV round the clock and security staff but the berths are open to the public except one large pontoon which has card access control. But that pontoon is not the calmest in bad weather. There are a few thefts every year in Almerimar but it has not been common, most cases have been yachties stealing from yachties.

Work (yard). Cartagena, claim full facilities but I have not used. Almerimar, full facilities to a high standard, English speaking. Two chandleries.

Food shopping. Cartagena, five minute bus ride to Carrefour, Mercadona or El Corte Ingles (€0.50 per trip) or a thirty minute walk. Almerimar, Mercadona (the Spanish Waitrose) within five minutes walk of most berths. But Almerimar has no butcher, fishmonger other than Mercadonna but there is a greengrocer. Brit foods better in Cartagena from El Corte Ingles and Carrefour but a limited range in Almerimar from Mercadona.

Restaurants. Loads in Almerimar Spanish, Chinese (free wok buffet and trad), Irish bars, Brit bars, Spanish bars,...bars, cafés and coffee houses everywhere. Cartagena. Very Spanish. One or two places offer 'ze Eengleesh Brekfast' but you won't be impressed with it. McD and BK but with Spanish beef (frightened to death so rather tough) and the BK does not char-grill. Restaurants in Cartagena very disappointing, empty and rip-off. Almerimar mostly pretty good, go to busy places prices reasonable.

With what you save being in Almerimar you might be able to afford a long-term car hire. Then you are in a good position as Gib is only a few hours away, as is Cadiz, Huelva, etc.

BUT some people really detest Almerimar so suggest that you spend a fortnight before committing to a whole winter. About 20 hours by sea from Almerimar to Cartagena, round Cabo de Gata. Pretty easy passage and no real problem areas other that Gata where it chucks up badly at times, so avoid that.
 
If you can afford it, you wont be dissappointed with Lagos. Super place, with active marina life throughout the winter, and the town remains reasonably busy. Easy cheap access to UK from Faro. IIRC, water and electric are included, and there is a free wifi connection

Almerimar struck me as a place you might go if it was all you could afford. (Only spent 2 nights there, so no real experience of it).
 
Seville is lovely to visit, especially over winter, but not a place to liveaboard over winter I suspect. Limited number of places to put a boat, and while the city is very interesting, not enough to keep you occupied all winter long, and you'd need a car or lots of long public transport trips to see the things of interest in the region, as not much is actually close by the city, though you can get to the national park Parque de Doñana by bus or river, and is wonderful. Cordoba, Cadiz etc, are all train rides away, and I don't think would keep you occupied for a stayover. I saw as much as I wanted one February week with a hire car based in Seville.

The tapas bars in Seville are fantastic though!! Have one or two tasters in each place you visit, sort of like a food pub-crawl.

The old expo grounds were worth a visit, but seriously deserted when I visited.

I think this link probably says it all.....
http://www.gibraltaryachtcharter.com/page29.html
 
Just to add my two penneth to Manuel's comments.

We overwintered in Almerimar 07/08 and were very happy with our decision.

The plus points were: -
1. Low cost
2. Safe
3. Great liveaboard community (boats heading east and west overwinter there)
4. Good chandlers and boat yard
5. Cheap flights from Almeria
6. Always plenty of space
7. Supermakets and shops within 100 metres

Negatives

1. Its not based on an old town, so its a bit soul-less
2. It is an an oasis, in that once you have got out of Almerimar. you are surrounded by acres upon acres of polythene under which fruit and veg are grown in unbelievable quantitities!

On balance would I use it again? A definite yes; good value for money, good social life with interesting liveaboards from all over the planet. Also a good place to carry out all those repairs you have been meaning to do all summer.
 
We overwintered in Rota, which is across the bay from Cadiz. Cadiz itself is miles from the town and nowt there, so you wouldn't want to stop there for more than a few days. Rota is itself quite a sweet little town, kept alive all winter because of the big Naval base, and it has a jolly market and free wifi in the library. A couple/three other English liveaboards, French too, plus regularly visiting Spanish all winter, so enough of a life - but not the organised socialising of Lagos. Rota has buses to Jerez and ferries/buses to Cadiz, plus of course hire cars.

It is not that easy (or wasn't in 06/07) to get a winter berth - we ended up going month to month, which was a bit hair-raising but in fact we left well before the probs began in May. Don't assume you can take your pirck.

After Rota we spent two months anchored off Gelves outside Seville, for Feria and Easter. fantastic. We do know people who winter on the hook there, but it is quite challenging. Having said that, it's very sociable and a great spot. In Seville itself, definitely go for the Yacht Club rather than the other one.

HTH
 
Hello ladies.

Lots of advice given for your original question. Almerimar would probably suit your needs admirably. Bear in mind taking dogs on public transport in Spain is a no-no so getting to the mountains without hiring a car might cause problems. Almerimar has good walking along the beaches. Local Vet in El Ejido is excellent.

Have a good winter.
 
We went through the same decision process this year, so we decided to visit places on our list (not as comprehensie as yours).

Almerimar. Good liveaboard scene and yacht facilities but yet another unpleasant Spanish concrete jungle with 'all day English breakfasts'. The whole Costa del Sol is like that, not our scene.

Gibralter. Not safe in swells.

Cadiz. As you say near the container port, miles from town and supermarkets, although the city and the long walk to it along the sea/city wall are nice.

Rota (our original choice). Proper Spanish village, great restaurants, but no internet access except the public library for one hour a day. We couldn't believe it, the local telco doesn't even offer wifi.

Villamoura. Another concrete jungle.

Lagos. Good liveaboard community. Shops close by, lots of restaurants. Nice town. Good chandler and boatyard. Lots of cheap flights from Faro. Water and electricity are free - no winter heating bills.

We chose Lagos.
 
No one has mentioned Albufeira,not as expensive prob as Lagos dont know but town OK in winter and 30 mins from aeroporto but comments on Almerimar sound like that would be up my street or Guardiana and we havent even started yet havig spent the last 2 months rooted to the spot in Leros
 
When we were on our way to Madeira, we stopped in Povoa de Vazim, it is north of Lexios. A very sheltered marina and in 2006 costs to overwinter included a haulout. Costs were incredibly cheap and most folks who stopped there (usually by accident) stayed. very friendly people and staff and great rail links to Porto and Porto airport. We stayed about two weeks but bought a month's stay for 90 euros. Our boat is 47ft.

S/Y Be-Bop-A-Lula
Baltimore, MD
 
suebabsthenoo said:
No one has mentioned Albufeira,not as expensive prob as Lagos dont know but town OK in winter and 30 mins from aeroporto but comments on Almerimar sound like that would be up my street or Guardiana and we havent even started yet havig spent the last 2 months rooted to the spot in Leros
Click to expand...

Certainly Albufeira is cheaper and very sheltered too, but the marina is a bit of a walk from anything. Also there used to be permanent piped music from the bars under the flats and very few local shops. Of course things might have perked up but I suspect it was built just the wrong side of the credit crunch.
 
Just a wild card - not far from Cartagena is Torrevieja.We spent 18 months there.Its not everyone's cup of tea but it is part of the town which has 3 Lidls,Carrefour,2 good chandleries,liftouts (but storage ashore limited). is ideally located for Alicante airport (40 mins.) and has huge market every week.Bit like a Spanish version of Weston-super-Mare in terms of market it caters for.Has beaches adjacent to marina for dog.Fair amount of liveaboards plus ex-pats living ashore who keep their boats there.Availabilty might not be such a problem as elsewhere but it might pay you to hire a car do a recce and sort somewhere fairly soon wherever you go for on Spanish coast IMHO.

4 years ago we could not prebook at Almerimar.You had to turn up to get a berth - don't know if that is still the same.They don't let you work on your boat yourself there (in common with many places in Spain) but someone with more recent info may be able to advise.
 
Another wild card. We enjoyed Estepona one winter. The town centre has a reasonable amount of character, and we had no diffculty working on the, 'cos the could only accept you on the hard for a maximum of three weeks. But that was four years ago, and I suspect the new haul out facilities and nearby developments will have changed things.
 
have chartered out of Gibraltar a few times and spent quite a bit of time in Estepona.I liked it.Just down the coast from there is La Duquesa (provided entrance is not too silted?).Read an article in PBO a few years ago by a couple who wintered there and enjoyed it but from memory it is a bit isolated so its a longish walk to the shops or the bus.Main advantage with either Estepona or La Duquesa is its easy to get to Gib for essential English vittals.:)
 
Quite a few liveaboards in Duquesa and very big expat land based population. Lots of Brit- ish bars and restaurants in port, but Spanish villages a short walk away. Quite a few local supermarkets within comfortable walking distance. Good walking country nearby. Harbour entrance not silted. Bus to Gib/Estepona. Boat lift/repairs plus work on your own boat on hard.
 
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