Deben to Ore (or vice versa)

[bobdoughty]

Having enormously enjoyed the Orwell and Stour last summer, I'd like to explore the next two Suffolk rivers, the Deben and the Ore this year. Naturally I've been checking eastcoastrivers.com, reading up on their (infamous) bars and trying to figure out the best times for entry and exit. Reeds suggests entering the Deben after half-flood and leaving on the flood and entering the Ore after half-flood (it makes no mention of leaving!).

Is it possible to leave one river and get into the next on the same tide (either way) or must I either hang about or go back to Harwich and return the next day? I'm in a Hurley 22 bilge keeler drawing about 1 metre with an 8hp outboard which pushes along quite well but as I may be up against springs I wouldn't want to take on too much of flood or ebb. All advice gratefully received!

 

[neale]

Defo doable, they are only a few miles apart so you hit one bar just before HW and enter the other around HW. Trouble is you will be punching tide coming down to the bar on the river you are leaving. If you make the Ore your second river, you should be able to carry the tide up as HW Aldeburgh is quite a bit later than HW at the bar.

 

[Rivers & creeks]

Last boat had .9m draft so it was similar. The key issues are that (currently) you can leave he Deben anytime but can't reliably enter the Ore before LW+2. We ran aground for an hour at the Ore entrance two years ago. Getting out of the Deben on the flood means punching a four knot stream (at leat) and it seems our trick of hugging the shingle banks is no longer recommended. Plus to add to the mix, going up the long and rather boring early Ore against the tide is a bit grim.

The upshot is I would leave the Deben at LW +1.5 that way you will have enough water and if you make a mistake you'll lift straight away but the tidal stream will be much slacker. Then punch the flood to the Ore entrance and get there about LW +3 where there's enough water and you'll make either Orford or Aldeburugh on the tide. Needless to say its a damn sight harder going from the Ore to the Deben.

 

[Jean]

I crossed the Deban bar, around ½ tide springs (going out), several weeks ago, with 1.5 m draft, and surprised to see plenty of water under the keel this year.

 

[Marmalade]

I would go into the Ore first. Then you can leave the river at half tide, carry the flood down to the Deben bar and enter the Deben at high water or just before.

 

[PeterR]

Having enormously enjoyed the Orwell and Stour last summer, I'd like to explore the next two Suffolk rivers, the Deben and the Ore this year. Naturally I've been checking eastcoastrivers.com, reading up on their (infamous) bars and trying to figure out the best times for entry and exit. Reeds suggests entering the Deben after half-flood and leaving on the flood and entering the Ore after half-flood (it makes no mention of leaving!).

Is it possible to leave one river and get into the next on the same tide (either way) or must I either hang about or go back to Harwich and return the next day? I'm in a Hurley 22 bilge keeler drawing about 1 metre with an 8hp outboard which pushes along quite well but as I may be up against springs I wouldn't want to take on too much of flood or ebb. All advice gratefully received!

Assuming you can motor at somewhere between 5 and 6 knots you will be able to leave the Deben at anytime on the flood - albeit very slowly. However, you need to cross the Alde bar no later than one hour before HW. You simply will not get in against the ebb and even if you enter at HW slack you won't get far enough up the river before the ebb sets in. Its a long way up the river before the tide eases and the holding is poor in that stretch.

As for leaving, do that on the flood as well. It isn't as strong as the ebb. Leaving on the ebb you are likely to be washed onto the shingle and even if you avoid that you then have the ebb to face all the way down the coast.

 

[sailorman]

Assuming you can motor at somewhere between 5 and 6 knots you will be able to leave the Deben at anytime on the flood - albeit very slowly. However, you need to cross the Alde bar no later than one hour before HW. You simply will not get in against the ebb and even if you enter at HW slack you won't get far enough up the river before the ebb sets in. Its a long way up the river before the tide eases and the holding is poor in that stretch.

As for leaving, do that on the flood as well. It isn't as strong as the ebb. Leaving on the ebb you are likely to be washed onto the shingle and even if you avoid that you then have the ebb to face all the way down the coast.

on leaving the Deben keep well up the beach on the Bawdsey side ( close enough to walk ashore ) there is much less tide there & only cross to the main channel once passed the Martello Tr.
coming out of the Ore we leave as soon a the tide has turned @ Orford.
proceed down river & once passed Havergate Island keep right up to your
port hand as shallow as you dare to keep out of the tide. its great sailing in a S.westerly hasrdish on the wind following your depth sounder, with yachts thrashing their motors out in the tideway. near the entrance you will get a back eddy doubling your sog & you will have already left those motoring for dead

 

[dylanwinter]

few films of the Ale, Ore and Butley

there are a few more films on te website but these are the main ones I have put up on youtube

how much do you draw -can you take the mud - or do you have a sailing dinghy - there are some wonderful nooks and corners to explore


KTL 117 Ore spit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlsfWiGMl0w

ktl 118 the Butley River

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Xh9bJxJAFk

ktl 121 Ore Mud

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsceLiE3lXw

ktl 122 Abrahams Bosom

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-ygoZJdZwg

ktl 124 Orford

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39cdmQvEou8

ktl 126 autumn sailing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9OD5WOxKYc

ktl 130 coming off the mud

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Zf27g8nJoY

ktl 131 aldburgh

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfFPVTyKeSE

ktl 133 slaughden quay

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1faB-vY7QE

ktl 134 winter sailing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUs1VDR2kkQ

ktl 136 lower alde

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zhtpRXt54A

ktl 138 troublesome reach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJaAvF1lPG4

ktl 140 upper alde

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myZz6yfegZ0

 

[bobdoughty]

KTL on the Ore

there are a few more films on te website but these are the main ones I have put up on youtube

how much do you draw -can you take the mud - or do you have a sailing dinghy - there are some wonderful nooks and corners to explore


Thanks for pulling all the links together Dylan; it was your films that started me off poking around in East Coast rivers last year (I'm based in Folkestone) and I became hooked. I sail a Hurley 22 bilge keeler so I can take the mud OK (frequently at an angle but never mind) and with all the cruising junk on board I draw about 1 metre

 

[dylanwinter]

perfik

there are a few more films on te website but these are the main ones I have put up on youtube

how much do you draw -can you take the mud - or do you have a sailing dinghy - there are some wonderful nooks and corners to explore


Thanks for pulling all the links together Dylan; it was your films that started me off poking around in East Coast rivers last year (I'm based in Folkestone) and I became hooked. I sail a Hurley 22 bilge keeler so I can take the mud OK (frequently at an angle but never mind) and with all the cruising junk on board I draw about 1 metre

ideal then...

D

 

[Malish]

Assuming a reasonably early departure from the Deben with the ebb tide you could always treat yourself to a few hours of sailing before entering the Ore on the flood?

 

[Rivers & creeks]

on leaving the Deben keep well up the beach on the Bawdsey side ( close enough to walk ashore ) there is much less tide there & only cross to the main channel once passed the Martello Tr.

That's what many of us do but check the East Coast Sailing site, I had heard a shallow patch prevented that tidal flow cheat.

 

[bobdoughty]

Excellent advice

many thanks everyone for the excellent local knowledge