Cruising Chute

[claymore]

I was thinking about getting one for next year. I've been reading a back number of YM and Simon Jinks wrote a really good article about them. We sail off the wind whenever possible - we've poled out the genoa a lot this year and goosewinged a lot and sailed by the lee a lot too - I think the pole has made our downwind sailing more efficient as the main collapses the genoa quite soon after we've borne away from a beam reach. the thought of having a more powerful sail is tempting and Claymore is a heavy well mannered boat off the wind and quite predictable so we ought to benefit in terms of increased speed. -If we get one, I'd probably get a snuffer - my one reservation is that they are quite big sails and my question is does that make it easier to get yourself into a mess?

<hr width=100% size=1>regards
Claymore
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[Salty]

No - they're pretty easy to handle. I had one made a couple of years ago and it made a huge difference downwind and with the snuffer was a doddle to hoist/drop. To be honest its more difficult / stressful trying to keep white sails flying properly downwind than letting it all hang out with a cruising chute.

I can thoroughly recommend Sobstaad who were cheap, quick, good quality, and did it all from rig measurements I gave them over the phone.

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[claymore]

Thanks for that - Owen Sails are in my area and they valet the main and genoa in the winter.

<hr width=100% size=1>regards
Claymore
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[BlueSkyNick]

My experience is very limited, but I am convinced the cruising chute is worth having.

The first time we hoisted ours, I had the benefit of my brother's instructoring experience to set it up, and show us how to handle both the boat and the sail. This involved SWMBO on the sheet, and son keeping a steady course on the helm.

The next time we attempted it with SWMBO alone in the cockpit and myself on the foredeck. There was a twist in the snuffer lines, which caused problems so I decided that discretion was the better part of valour, and gave up until another time when we had additional crew. However, it can easily be done with the usual rules of thumb - preparation, practice and patience.

SWMBO is now pleased when we hoist the chute because she thinks it is very pretty, and when the sail is full the boat clearly picks up speed. Just need to be careful how we stow it, so there are no problems next time.

<hr width=100% size=1>Real stress is when you wake up in the night and realise you haven't been to sleep yet.

 

[roger]

Re: Cruising Chute handling

I've just got a second hand chute and so have to learn anew how to use it.
Advice given to me seems valuable - to make sure the snuffer line goes round a cleat or sonething so you have control when raising or lowering the snuffer. I got a nasty rope burn decades ago when a gust reinflated the chute and pushed up the snuffer making the line rip through my hands.


<hr width=100% size=1>Roger

 

[jimi]

If you ever come sailing with me I could show you how easy a chute and snuffer is .. could do it singlehanded ... unlike #@##!**!

<hr width=100% size=1>O wad some Power the giftie gie us
To see oursels as ithers see us!

 

[DavidBolger]

We got a cruising chute with snuffer and find it very easy to use even single handed. You should note that a crusing chute will be blanketed by the main just like a genoa and in the scenarios where you were poling out your genoa or sailing by the lee, the cruising chute will be a waste unless you pole it out. In that case why don't you go for a spinnaker with a snuffer and this will give you more options. A poled out chute does not have he correct shape particularil at the foot. If your nervous of a spinnaker, get a small one.

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[Gunfleet]

It works very well as a sort of large light air genoa. It's not really a spinnaker replacement. If you want to use one on a run (as opposed to beam reach or on the 1/4) you will need a pole and on this point of sail the whole arrangement works better with the main double reefed. Single handing can be achieved even by a duffer like me if you have a sock. Er.. and that's it.
ps I have both a cruising chute and a spinnaker, but one came with the boat.

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[ParaHandy]

.. you've got one already ... just unzip the patio back doors and lift them up ... !!

would fit one tomorrow but a) got to get up the mast (no mouse line) and feed a new halyard. not so difficult but fishing (which you know is one of my NVQ skills) inside the mast for the end won't be easy and b) the foot would be attached somewhere near the anchor roller but the structure of the pushpit above it might mean that the strop etc would, at times, be rubbing/applying force hard against it by the force of the sail. Ideally, I need to put a mini-bowsprit on which gets the foot away from the pushpit .... unless i'm prepared to put up with it which I think I will (if jimi's boat's doing 5 knots with 8-10kn wind as it was this afternoon .. although manky auld boats ....



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[BlueSkyNick]

... doing 5 knots ..

... I guess that included doing 5 knots backwards through the marina, 'cos he can't park it forwards !

<hr width=100% size=1>Real stress is when you wake up in the night and realise you haven't been to sleep yet.

 

[jimi]

Re: ... doing 5 knots ..

That's cos my berth is port side to on the port side of a fairly narrow fairway. Got to hammer down in reverse with plenty of way, stop and then drive forwards into the berth so the boat slides gently alonside the pontoon rather than the adjacent boat with the outboard fender ;-)

<hr width=100% size=1>O wad some Power the giftie gie us
To see oursels as ithers see us!

 

[ParaHandy]

Re: ... \'roo bars

(or kangaroo bars) you two need them in Hythe ... !!

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[charles_reed]

The sailmakers who assure yachties that a cruising chute is a substitute for a spinnaker should be done under the Trades Descriptions Act.

It is a sorry cross between a genniker and a spinnaker and (IMHO) good for neither task, as a reacher or a downwind sail. The advantage compared to a poled out 150% genoa, in anything but the lightest breeze on calm seas is negligible.

If you already have the pole and gear why not go direct to the spinnaker, the costs are little different and the results are in a different order of magnitude.

Next to the 150% roller genoa my spinnaker is my second most-used sail,last season (admittedly in the W Med where it either blows too much or not at all) were:-
1. Solent 26hrs
2. Spinnaker 56hrs
3. Genoa 166hrs (+124hrs motorsailing)
4. Motor 288hrs (including motorsailing and recharging batteries).

Total hrs under way 536; Distance run by mendacious log 2770Nm

I do have a genniker (called, I believe, a Code 5 now) which is just great as a reacher, allowing the same hull speed as true wind speed, but that has a regrettable tendency to break or distort bowsprits and awaits final solution this winter.

Nearly all my sailing is single-handed, I don't use a snuffer that being 2 lines too many, but my spinnaker is only 720 ft2 on a fractional rig boat.

Spinnakers have an underserved reputation for "risk", with a good guy/sheet system they're easily controllable and in anything but bastardised IOR2 rule boats handle well under them. To bring in blanket them with the main and then repack under the boom ready for the next lift. The secret for keeping control when lifting is to do it quickly and not let the kite fill before you've got it up.

Forget the cruising chute - go for a decent tri-radial GP spinnaker, it'll even let you close reach in light airs.

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[charles_reed]

Sobstad ;-)

Make the best cut spinnakers in the world - I'm surprised Jeremy descended to the depths of selling a cruising chute.

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[Chris_Robb]

I totally agree

I went thorugh this desicion a couple of years back - and decided to by a second hand spinnaker. I agree with everything Charles has said.

I ended up buying a second hand one, which fitted perfectly and cost only "£200. There were no cruising shoots available S/H.

Go for it - they really are much simpler than people make out.

Charles - would you recommend a double sheet/guy system above 35 foot?

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[jimi]

Re: I totally agree

Interesting! I've got a cruising chute and have tended recently when the wind is aft of the quarter to fly it as a spinnaker. However I would have thought that when close reaching a cruising chute with the tack hauled down to tension the luff would be more effective than a spinnaker. Really appreciate your thoughts

<hr width=100% size=1>O wad some Power the giftie gie us
To see oursels as ithers see us!

 

[ParaHandy]

... well, i don't have a 150% genoa so does that exclude me from your sweeping conclusions?

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[Twister_Ken]

Re: Sobstad ;-)

Sobstad > -Make the best cut spinnakers in the world. <

Do they now? Used to Bruce Banks when I was interested in such things. Remarkable how many boats were sailing around with fore and aft sails from Hood or North, but with Banks' kites.

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.writeforweb.com/twister1>Let's Twist Again</A>

 

[vyv_cox]

Me too

I no longer carry a cruising chute, although at one time I sailed with it and a spinnaker. The cruising chute can take wind from a little further forward than the spinnaker, although in winds above about F3 there is little advantage in doing so, but in winds from aft there is no comparison. The spinnaker can be flown in winds from any direction beam-to-beam through astern, whereas the cruising chute has a hole of 60 - 90 degrees where it is blanketed. Poling it out needs an extended length spinnaker pole, about 1.5xJ seems to be the accepted figure, for which it really needs to be telescopic if it is to be stowed easily. It is possible to fly the tack from the pole as if it was a spinnaker, although the cut is less effective in this case.

I have used a double sheet/guy system on each boat above 29 ft that I have owned. Short- or single-handed this makes gybing considerably easier.

I'd agree with you - particularly for a stable, heavier boat, a spinnaker seems a far more sensible alternative. Beware though - once you are intending to fly a spinnaker the wind has an uncanny reluctance to be astern of you. In my last three summer cruises, 14 weeks sailing in all, I have flown mine a total of six times! After beating all the way to Jersey three years ago, as expected, we then beat all the way back to Holland in the next two weeks. Our Baltic trip was beset by fresh winds on the nose throughout all the passage making. This year winds were mostly so light that we motored anyway, but still they were on the nose!

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[juspeepin]

Re: I totally agree

When we've tried using a cruising chute close reaching, we've found it fills nicely, heels the boat, produces more leeway... and makes you go slower (than using the genoa). It just isn't shaped much like an aerofoil, and so doesn't help upwind.

Without a pole, it has a pretty narrow range; beyond a broad reach, it stalls (unless goosewinged), and much above a broad reach, you're better with the genoa. We got a cruising chute 'cos it was easy, but we're planning to ditch it now in favour of a spinnaker. In Round The Island and Cowes Week, ISC rate a cruising chute and spinnaker as equal; we tried the chute in Round The Island, but decided we were better off without it in Cowes, for the 1% it gave us in handicap. (In reading this advice, take note that we came not far from last in both events!)

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