Contributors to these forae

[Iota]

Thinking about the recent fracas about a well-known insurance company and their slightly 'stiff' response to criticism...It’s all right Kim I am not about to pour petrol on the embers!!!! I see that several IPC journalists participate in the forums Messrs Jermain, Jinks and Snooks etc , the RYA came and faced the music, plus John Watson MD of MDL . I think participation by more people from the industry would be good even though at times it might be a chastening experience for them. What do you think and I wonder what the industry figures get out of it and how more could be encouraged to participate.

Thoughts?


<hr width=100% size=1>Courtesy is an iota but makes the world go round

 

[jwatson]

Answering from the MDL perspective, one if the best things we have done is to get involved in the various forums. To be frank, the reason it took me so long was that I knew once I started, I had to keep it up for ever and I was not sure of the amount of time this may take up.
Getting into dialogue with customers, existing or potential, can only be a good thing for a service business.
Apart from the 'public postings', I now also receive many 'private' emails with suggestions that have helped our business and our customer relations.
So, in summary, I would encourage any service provider to get involved, be prepared to take the rough with the smooth, and enjoy the exchanges.
Best wishes,
John Watson
MDL

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[Trevor_swfyc]

I somehow expect I am in the minority but fortunatly even a minority view has its place here.
What would concern me is that not all companies are prepared to take the rough with the smooth. If I report xxxx antifoul in my area was a complete waste of money a balance view would we hope come from other members of the forum. The temptation for the manufacturer of xxxx antifoul to come on and threaten me immediatly with loss of sales +++++ would spoil my use of the forum and I expect many others.
So while it may be a good idea for some companies I suspect on balance it would not be. If I have a problem with a product then I would rather get it delt with by the supplier, reverting to here to enter a dispute with the maufacturer would be an admission of a failure to do that.

Trevor


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[sailbadthesinner]

as an aside/ addition to that
might it also be possible, not withstanding the vary capable contributors already on these boards, to have an acknowledged industry' expert ' specialist. along the lines of a problem and answer forum.

eg outboards, and maybe a rep from each of the engine manufacturers?? It could be part problems from us on how to fix stuff. plus they could tell us the latest developments coming in near future???? this wouldbe be more practical problem solving than customer service problems.

i know i can be accused that this is covered in pbo.but that will only take on specific issuesthe forummay allow a widendedout discussion exchange??
just my twopenneth.

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=red>Ok brain let's just do this and I can get back to killing you with beer</font color=red>

 

[chriscallender]

I would imagine that one reason some companies would pefer not to get involved is that there is a danger that the forae participants will turn into the modern day equivalent of an angry lynch-mob. Of couse its possible that they deserve the angry lynch mob treatment, but also the situation may not be as black and white as it seems.

If I were running a commercial organisation I might be a bit concerned that I would not get a fair treatment on this kind of medium. So, maybe I would conclude that its better not to take the risk of public discussion of a complaint when it has some potential to backfire on me big time.

On the other hand, as you say some like RYA or John Watson have, as you put it "faced the music", and improved the public image of their organisation as a result of getting involved.

Suspect that you need to have the right kind of person dealing with internet discussions and its very different from normal customer services/communications/dealing with media. Probably all a bit daunting even if you do run a good company.

Chris

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[kimhollamby]

Companies on the ybw.com forums

In terms of encouraging or discouraging companies my policy is to do neither. Registration is open to all who agree to abide by the Ts and Cs. My reasons are simple:

a) if a company engages reluctantly it is unlikely to be successful in making its case because to do so requires a certain commitment and understanding of the bulletin board environment;

b) if a company engages as a result of a specific invitation it might possibly assume it was going to get favourable treatment.

I do welcome industry comment (as opposed to overt advertising and/or repetitive jumping in against each and every mildly related thread to offer products or services), and will attempt to ensure exactly the same level of respect that all other users enjoy.

After 17 years of working on various boating publications I am acutely aware that there is always a mirror side to any situation and believe that there should be a right to reply while understanding that not all businesses will want to exercise that right -- for valid reasons.

It is also a fact that many people in the marine industry are boatowners in their own right and indeed I am aware of people posting on the forum that hold roles in the marine industry but prefer to post here as private boatowners. Often they are among the most enthusiastic, for personal as opposed to commercial reasons. Very rarely do I see instances where the poster is being underhand by not declaring a vested interest when commenting on a subject close to home. You can be assured that any exceptions would be dealt with promptly.





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[kimhollamby]

Bang on the nail nm

*

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[kimhollamby]

Missing posts

A few users will see that I've chopped a few posts (forums/forae discussion) in this thread. Simple reason...I posted something myself that looks about as weary as I feel and it was open to misintepretation.

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[Gunfleet]

Re: Missing posts

That's all right old darling. The rest of you report to b pontoon for John M and Ken's Latin class!

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[jimi]

Re: Missing posts

Ah'll dae the doric yins!

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[poggy]

Re: Companies on the ybw.com forums

Hi,

As a public forum I agree you should be not be very active in trying to attract companies etc to make posts. However if I was a company I would certainly want to be involved as it is the leading site and magazine for the industry. What better way is there to see what consumers want and what there problems are.

As far as companies being unsure of how the internet works, as this is a very open site it is no different to posting something on a notice board so they shouldn' be too nervous. It is only the medium of the message which is different and the speed with which information is distributed. As far as arguments are concerned, you can't run any business without upsetting somebody or making mistakes. The difference between companies is how they deal with the problem when it happens and how they resolve it. If a company like MDL which has received a lot of stick takes the time to deal with a complaint in public then they must be fairly confident in their company or have the wish to change in response to the critics. This sort of attitude is the right sort to have in a customer driven environment and I am sure it will impress customers. I am sure it is also beneficial for the company to have the odd compaint as if you don't know about the problem, you can't fix it.

To hide behind contracts or flex legal muscle is in my opinion not going to win many friends even if there is no foundation to the original complaint.

Perhaps we should also take the time to praise companies as a lot do deserve it.

Poggy

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[sailbadthesinner]

Re: Companies on the ybw.com forums

the risk remains however of anyone going over the top getting clobbered by posters bigtime. which whilst it may not in the long run do them any harm you can see why it may not be attractive. to qualify my last comment i mean people may clobber them but i believe respect will be given to those willing to come and engage their customers, detractors and all the lurkers.

.mdl come on here in the open, the rya was a more moderated affair. the reason maybe in part the fact that john watson has gained a reputation for taking time to answer specific queries. he will even try and address general 'slagging' about marinas and does not sulk when people occasionally poke mdl in the ribs. i think people respect him for that.

the rya were newbies, if you like, and kim moderated and edited to allow the most quesitons to be answered and prevent drifting and ranting.

i can really only see this being the way ahead unless whoever out there has a 'feel' for the boards and its many moods. unfortunately the kim option means his time and resources and so we cannot just expect that as none of us paydirectly for this madness.

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=red>Ok brain let's just do this and I can get back to killing you with beer</font color=red>

 

[Guest]

MDL's involvement with the forums is indeed to be applauded so here's a question John,

I don't want to re-open any debate about pricing, supply and demand with this thread. We all have to face the fact that MDL has a market dominant position in the most popular sailing areas in Southern England and is the pricing leader, setting margins for the industry. My questions pertains to how MDL can seek to retain its customers' goodwill, if not its ciustomers.

Given the high costs of mooring in Southern England marinas, why is that MDL takes direct debit payments from its customers over 8 months only. Paying for a marina berth is, theoretically, exactly the same as renting a house. With my own bill on a direct debit scheme costing £4k p.a., an 8 month direct debit for £4k is just too great a strain on monthly cash flow. Despite the excellent service I have received from MDL staff at Shamrock Quay and Saxon Wharf, I have regretably found moorings elsewhere which I can afford. I can think of no good reason why a 12 month direct debit scheme does not operate.

Over to you John?

Thanks

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[Bergman]

I think it really depends on the business, and the individual.

Certainly all credit to John Watson, MDL are not everyones favourite company and he has shown very good sense and judgement in his dealings on this forum.

But

Each of his customers is worth a significant sum, perhaps £4k or £5k pa. Anyone in his position has to manage time very carefully and retaining a £5k pa customer is worth some time.

Very different from a company where revenue per customer is much less. It becomes a much more difficult question as to whether or not worthwhile. Also, I suspect, John enjoys the cut and thrust but not everyone has that inclination.



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[Observer]

I think that's a brilliant suggestion. Manufacturers/dealers/service providers of all sorts would win excellent PR by providing a sort of 'on-line surgery' staffed by a technically competent person. Is it not the case that some run technical help service by e-mail? This would be similar except it would be a public exposition of problems/solutions/features etc.

What would make the suggestion impractical/unachievable? Participants would have to be willing to take some stick but, if they have confidence in their product/service, why should they fear that. As is often said, it's the good service received when things go wrong which makes for customer loyalty. JGW has proved the benefit for his company.

Could we have a comment from Kim?

Sorry. Didn't read down far enough. Just seen the comment from Kim.

<hr width=100% size=1><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Observer on 07/03/2003 18:28 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[jwatson]

There is an explanation on the 8 month direct debit issue which I will post just as soon as I can compose the words correctly!
Cheers,
john

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[ArthurWood]

What a revelation!!

<<Getting into dialogue with customers, existing or potential, can only be a good thing for a service business>>

 

[nicho]

The boss of Sealine once ventured onto Motor Boat Chat to answer something about his products and got completely hammered!! He disappeared, and to the best of my knowledge has never popped his head above the parapet again! I go along with those who welcome contributions from the the likes of John Watson (MDL) who often puts his head on the line. The anonymity of the forum makes it easy for contributers to "vent their spleen" far more than they would in a face to face situation - reasoned argument is shoved to one side. It's that kind of aggression that will put these guys off (as I'm sure happened with Gerard Wainwright of Sealine).

So, lets get our points over in a polite way, and encourage more of the likes of John to participate. Be gentle with them and they will stay involved.

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[poggy]

Hi,

You should only be worried about legal threats if the information you provide is not accurate. If you have had a genuine problem that you post on the forum then you shouldn't fear legal action.

Poggy

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[poggy]

The council do the same with council tax, we only pay over 10 months in Hampshire.

As regards pricing for MDL, we all try to charge as much as the market will stand for our products. If the price becomes too high then customers will just not pay and you have reached the upper price level. Perhaps the only problem with MDL's position is it's dominance in the local market. You have to give them credit for having a strong business, even though it is perhaps reaching a state of monopoly. Normally competitors would spring up to offer lower cost alternatives and balance prices, but unfortunately there is insufficient land on the south coast and Hamble to offer alternative sites. I guess it is a bit like house prices, they are more expensive where lots of people want to live.

If you look at the supermarkets and stores like Currys, Comet etc, they all have a real monopoly as well. Their threat is the internet supply.

A crane lift and power wash in Wales cost me £99.00 and for just a 1 hour lift (without power wash) on the Hamble cost £160.00. This is a huge difference as well for the same service.

Poggy

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