Contemplating upsizing to 26ft shoal draft

[FairweatherDave]

As a very satisfied Jeanneau Sun 2000 owner I am contemplating a change. Although I love the big light dinghy feel my wife is not so happy, and that is not so good... And although we manage to squeeze six of us for overnighters using a cockpit tent more headroom would not go amiss and she would like more of a "caravan" feel... So suggestions/advice for a shoal draft stiffer handling boat between 24 and 28 feet would be really appreciated. Sailing inside Chichester Harbour 50% of the time off a swinging mooring. And comfortable to sail single-handed.

I would add my reasons for reluctance to change boat are fear/ignorance
1. of inboard motor maintenance costs
2. winter lay-up costs
3. trailerability (I do have access to a towing vehicle for up to 3 tonnes, big pick-up thing)
It maybe time to get over these fears

Budget up to 13k, but happy to spend much less.
Apologies if the questions are too broad but bottom line I want something I/we can enjoy sailing inside the harbour that ain't so tender. And I have read numerous threads here but want to develop my ideas a bit more before looking at real boats. Thanks for any replies

 

[DanTribe]

One boat I've always fancied in this bracket is the Super Seal 26.
I crewed on one several times a few years ago, the have a great performance but with a big boat feel, and float on a heavy dew.
I think they are border line legal for towing with a 4x4 but there are ways round it.

 

[PatrickB02]

Bilge keels..?

How do you feel about bilge (or twin) keels..? If you are not averse, then bilge keels would help:
a) with the maintenance side, as you can dry the boat out on a beach or hard for anti fouling etc, no need for expensive haul outs
b) with the family/caravanning side, as you can dry out on the beach for bucket and spade time
c) shoal draft

Most bilge keelers of that size (and there are many) would have inboard engines, but there are a few that have outboards either on the transom or in a well/locker. A Hunter Horizon 26, for instance, would seem to tick your boxes and should be (just about) within your budget. Don’t know about trailing something that size, though...

 

[FairweatherDave]

Thanks both so far. I am not averse to bilge keels. They are very popular on the swinging moorings in Chichester. I have never sailed one so I don't know how they compare with "big dinghys". The virtue of a lifting centreplate for 50% sailing inside the harbour is I am very happy to touch the sides and unstick myself, which is much harder with a bilge keeler. But if they sail more upright then they are under serious consideration. What I need is someone to tell me they are fun to sail inside the harbour as well as outside. Or that certain lifting centreplate boats in this size range are reasonably stiff performers.

 

[northwind]

Thanks both so far. I am not averse to bilge keels. They are very popular on the swinging moorings in Chichester. I have never sailed one so I don't know how they compare with "big dinghys". The virtue of a lifting centreplate for 50% sailing inside the harbour is I am very happy to touch the sides and unstick myself, which is much harder with a bilge keeler. But if they sail more upright then they are under serious consideration. What I need is someone to tell me they are fun to sail inside the harbour as well as outside. Or that certain lifting centreplate boats in this size range are reasonably stiff performers.

I have a super seal 26.. you are welcome to come and have a look, lifting plate, its a fast comfortable boat, and sleeps 5. Inboard is an option, I have an outboard one, but am considering converting it. And it sails really well, oh and did I mention its PY is 976!!

More on them here:
Yachtsnet
and here Parker Seal Assoc

Its a very safe feeling boat, and it even sails well with the crew on the leeward rail

If you want to have a look, it will be ashore over the winter in Emsworth, or if you want to try sailing it, its back in in April. - PM me. (I'm very attached, its definately not for sale!!)

 

[northwind]

One boat I've always fancied in this bracket is the Super Seal 26.
I crewed on one several times a few years ago, the have a great performance but with a big boat feel, and float on a heavy dew.
I think they are border line legal for towing with a 4x4 but there are ways round it.

I had mine moved down from Canvey Island to Chichester, the guy who moved it towed it with a Trooper. I'd recon it weighs a good 2.5+ Tons though.

 

[FairweatherDave]

Thanks Northwind. I've PM ed you.

 

[cid]

Lift keel

I had a hunter delta for over 20 years, had a great time with it. I am based in Dublin, I have sailed to Holyhead ,Isle of man,The Clyde.I had a proper road trailer and towed it home with a Ford Focus.Kept it on a swing mooring at Malahide which has a sand bar at enterance,depth at low tide around 2 /3 feet.I was always able to get in and out.It Had a 9.9 O/B.There are several for sale on the net within your budget.I changed as I am getting on in years and the o/b was a problem.I got a kelt 8.5 lift keel with inboard engine.You should look at the delta we had a great time with it.

 

[rwoofer]

And although we manage to squeeze six of us for overnighters

I remember your original thread inquiring about a 20ft boat for six, so very impressed that you did manage to make it work!

 

[FairweatherDave]

I remember your original thread inquiring about a 20ft boat for six, so very impressed that you did manage to make it work!

Thanks. Definitely a squeeze at night, lots of moving bags about when we have everyone but we have used her more as a day sailer. But as you can see I am re-assessing the importance of creature comforts below, the desire to get further afield for longer and the kids aren't shrinking. The beauty of the Sun 2000 is the monster cockpit.

 

[FairweatherDave]

I had a hunter delta for over 20 years, had a great time with it..

Definitely on my hit list. Big one's gone to uni so I beleive a Delta can sleep 5 ?

In the meantime no-one yet has said bilge keelers are fun to sail inside the harbour? I would genuinely consider one eg a Westerly Centaur and know at say 26ft sailing inside the harbour will be more limited.

 

[Seajet]

Another boat to consider would be the Anderson 26, lift keel, solidly built, very seaworthy & rather fast in a well mannered sort of way,inboard engine, 'unsinkable', designed with the Fastnet 1979 conclusions in mind, though she's a cruiser not racer.

They are rare however, Andersons only made about 14 of the '26's ( at least 1 other firm made a few afterwards ) before losing their MOD contract and going bust.

There's some info' at www.anderson22class.co.uk

Good examples are in demand, guestimate £ 12,000 ish; if you should find a much cheaper one you'd have to ask why.

Twin keelers are not usually as rewarding on the helm even if overall performance is OK; a Sadler 26 or 29 twin or maybe Seawolf 26 twin would be good though, if they have enough room.

 

[KristiferColumbus]

Another boat to consider would be the Anderson 26, lift keel, solidly built, very seaworthy & rather fast in a well mannered sort of way,inboard engine, 'unsinkable', designed with the Fastnet 1979 conclusions in mind, though she's a cruiser not racer.

They are rare however, Andersons only made about 14 of the '26's ( at least 1 other firm made a few afterwards ) before losing their MOD contract and going bust.

There's some info' at www.anderson22class.co.uk

Good examples are in demand, guestimate £ 12,000 ish; if you should find a much cheaper one you'd have to ask why.

Twin keelers are not usually as rewarding on the helm even if overall performance is OK; a Sadler 26 or 29 twin or maybe Seawolf 26 twin would be good though, if they have enough room.

That rudder looks vulnerable to grounding.
If the op has only sailed inside Chichester Harbour then something like a Centaur would seem ideal to me.Bilge keelers can go where others fear to tread

 

[Seajet]

That rudder looks vulnerable to grounding.
If the op has only sailed inside Chichester Harbour then something like a Centaur would seem ideal to me.Bilge keelers can go where others fear to tread

Kristifer,

if you're referring to the Anderson 26, she was particularly designed for drying out - the rudder lifts vertically, a lot stronger than a dinghy-style pivotted blade.

All the A26's I know are on drying ( mud ) moorings - and no, I haven't got one but a chum has, no not for sale...

In this ( rather unflattering angle ) shot the rudder is fully down, it rises up a full transom - height stainless pintle so the tiller is nudging the pushpit.

 

[seumask]

I rember posting on your origional thread many moons ago and I strongly second the Hunter Delta again having just sold one we loved it to bits for the 5 years we had it and cruised it mainly from Chichester to Pool but went down to the Salcombe twice in it and to the Channel Islands once. PM me if you want to know more. Excellent review in the current edition of "Sailing today", its on the front cover!

 

[FairweatherDave]

Just PMed you Seumask. Sounds like a good review to read! Won't help with any haggling tho'.

Seems like I need two boats, one shoal draft for a drying mooring, keeping the family happy, comfortable and getting out to sea, the other for enjoying inside the harbour....

 

[KristiferColumbus]

Kristifer,

if you're referring to the Anderson 26, she was particularly designed for drying out - the rudder lifts vertically, a lot stronger than a dinghy-style pivotted blade.

All the A26's I know are on drying ( mud ) moorings - and no, I haven't got one but a chum has, no not for sale...

In this ( rather unflattering angle ) shot the rudder is fully down, it rises up a full transom - height stainless pintle so the tiller is nudging the pushpit.

Fair enough seajet that does look like a good practical solution.Although,she will still crank over a bit & that propeller looks a bit vulnerable.

 

[prv]

Although,she will still crank over a bit & that propeller looks a bit vulnerable.

Ought to be ok on both counts in reasonably soft mud, but I agree parking on the beach like I do in KS would be less than ideal.

Pete

 

[Seajet]

Kristifer & PRV,

just for possible interest as I think the OP has decided on another boat, the Anderson 26 settles completely upright in soft mud as mentioned; my A22 has a ballast bulb which remains below the hull when the keel is up, but she usually settles a lot more upright than the surrounding twin keelers due to the inconsistency of the mud.

I agree both A22 & 26 will heel over if dried out on sand, but I'd only do that in very controlled conditions, having felt the pounding a boat gets on sand when just afloat even in tiny waves.

In fact the A26 had integral grounding legs, which can be lowered from on deck; they have small feet which fair in with the hull when raised.

Of very limited use I suspect, as of course any permanent mooring should be mud not sand.

Personally I'd worry about the potential for damage if one leg went into softer ground, it might put awful loads on the hull; I don't think anyone uses them.

The A26' may not be quite as good a 26' as the A22 is a 22' if you see what I mean, but she is a solid, deceptively fast boat, designed to be seaworthy with bulwarks around the decks etc; some owners have clocked up impressive race wins and long distance passages.

 

[prv]

In fact the A26 had integral grounding legs, which can be lowered from on deck; they have small feet which fair in with the hull when raised.

Ooh, good point, I remember seeing pictures a while ago. A clever idea.

I too would be wary of using them unattended, but having dried out on sand in Bembridge and Langstone for pleasure purposes, and on hard mud/gravel near Netley for underwater maintenance, I think being able to park on the beach on an occasional basis is a very useful trick. I would probably make sure the boat was firmly aground before lowering the legs, rather than running onto the beach with them already down, to minimise landing stresses.

I also take the point about pounding, and certainly wouldn't want to be on the bottom in more than ripples, but under control on a sloping bottom big ripples can be dealt with by continuing to power forwards up the beach. Each time you lift you come forwards a bit, with less water and less scope for being lifted by the next wave. Very soon you're hard aground and not lifting at all. Similar in reverse by keeping tension on the stern anchor.

Pete