Confusion Confession

Wiggo

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I have obviously misunderstood Wind over tide for years. Please rank the following in order of unpleasantness in an arbitrary planing mobo:

a) Running with the wind and tide (wind over tide)
b) Running with the wind into the tide (wind against tide)
c) Running into the wind with the tide (wind against tide)
d) Running into the wind and the tide (wind over tide)

Pick the conditions to suit your chosen size of mobo. No trick questions, no tide races.

I assume that d) is worst followed by b)...
 

gcwhite

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Maybe I haven't been interpreting my radar correctly. I noticed that you agreed with me on an earlier post, so is it really you?
 

[2068]

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You've confused me.

Outside Chi harbour entrance, if the tide is going out (heading S), and the wind is coming in (heading N), then there will big holes and towering 4-foot waves that my small mobo will fall into.

It matters not whether I am coming in or going out, the holes and waves will be the same size, although there will be louder and more frequent "crashing banging hull breaking up" type sounds on the way out, and more "occasional huge splash as wave comes over windscreen" type sounds on the way in. Both are best avoided.

(b and c from your list)

dv.
 

Wiggo

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That's what I assumed, but I always thought the conditions you describe were 'wind over tide'. It seems to be not the case, and that a southerly wind with the tide ebbing out of Chi would be wind against tide, not wind over tide.

Now, I grant you, I would not want to punch into the ebb and a northerly wind, but I always assumed that coming out on the ebb with the wind up your jacksie would be OK. Except it appears from my learned colleagues (or Google, or both) that this is Wind Over Tide, and Not A Good Thing.
 

[2068]

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>
>coming out on the ebb with the wind up your jacksie would be OK.
>

It is. Unless you're on a lilo, in which case, next stop Cherbourg.

dv.
 

Nauti Fox

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[ QUOTE ]
a) Running with the wind and tide (wind over tide)
d) Running into the wind and the tide (wind over tide)

Oi, Wiggo, you having a senior moment, you've got em both wind over tide.
Personally I prefer Daz.
 

Wiggo

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Errm no. I don't think so, anyway. If the wind and the tide are going in the same direction, I think I read Brendan and mjf as saying that was wind over tide. Haydn says the opposite, and I agree with him (but confusingly adopted Brendan/mjf's definition in this thread). Which direction the boat's going makes no difference (but may do to the boat, obviously).
 

D3B

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If i remember correctly its shown quite clearly in the RYA day skipper booklet...........which i have given to SWMBO as homework.........well she will be new crew this season so she can learn herself!!......so i cant tell you the answer /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif
wind over tide=wind and tide in same direction=comfy
wind against tide=wind and tide in opposite direction= not so comfy.

doesnt Powerskipper have something to say on the subject or has she gone to play on a nice new sealine already?
 

hlb

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O6T - 2001 Sydney-Hobart yacht race
... the core as we beat into a difficult wind over tide set in 30 kts of breeze.
... The wind over tide was producing some steep seas. Its a difficult call, ...
www.conradhumphreys.com/index.cfm?articleid=22 - 22k - Cached - Similar pages

TNC On Tour 2003 Page 12
... It now began to get a bit choppy, a nasty wind over tide short sea, ...
This was due to the NW (wind over Spring tide) Force 4 now not having much flood ...
www.tuesdaynightclub.co.uk/Tour_03/Tour03_12.html - 31k - Cached - Similar pages

TNC On Tour 2002 Page 10
... It was wind over tide, so slightly bumpy on the exposed sections of the river.
... Wind over tide can make it a bit bumpy even this far up. ...
www.tuesdaynightclub.co.uk/Tour_02/Tour02_10.html - 13k - 2 Apr 2005 - Cached - Similar pages

Alderney | Yachts & Cruisers
... strong tidal streams (up to 9 knots in the Swinge and 11 knots in the Race)
can create dangerous overfalls, especially with the wind over tide. ...
www.alderney.gov.gg/index.php/pid/43 - 83k - Cached - Similar pages

Tidal River Ouse
... The lower Ouse also has its fair share of wind-over-tide problems – particularly
at Trent Falls and at Sandhall Reach (just above Goole) where a ...
www.battleoffulford.org.uk/ev_tidal_ouse.htm - 29k - 2 Apr 2005 - Cached - Similar pages

Portishead Cruising Club - Pilotage
... The apparent wind is now nearly force 8, the wind over tide conditions kick
the waves up into short choppy seas the bow is regularly scooping solid ...
www.portisheadcruisingclub.org.uk/Pilotage.htm - 19k - Cached - Similar pages

lymington_nationals_final
... at 1.00 pm into a brisk south-westerly force 5 and with the spring tide ebbing
there was a substantial amount of lumpy water because of wind over tide. ...
www.wanderer.org.uk/Racing%20Reports%202002/ lymington_nationals02/lymington_nationals_final.htm - 22k - Cached - Similar pages

X-99 World Cup 2000
... but due to a strong wind over tide situation the committee boat could not hold
their anchor and we returned to the marina to wait until the tide turned ...
www.northsails.co.uk/media/reports/x99-wc.htm - 23k - 2 Apr 2005 - Cached - Similar pages

Sailing Round Ireland Summer 2004 - Donegal
... The pilot warns that a 'steep and dangerous sea' can be raised here very
quickly in a wind over tide situation, which we now had. ...
www.bluemoment.com/ireland/27.html - 15k - Cached - Similar pages

Secret Spot - Cornwall- [swellchaser.co.uk]
... Cove: Sheltered from southerly winds, good from low to 3/4 high tide. Good right
hand break over rocks, hollow at low tide. Works on any wind from E to ...
cgi.plankrider.plus.com/cgi-bin/betsie/wollparser.pl/ www.swellchaser.co.uk/barrel/breaktips/kernow.htm - 16k - 2 Apr 2005 - Cached - Similar pages
 
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Deleted User YDKXO

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Seems we're in a minority here, Wiggo. I agree with your definitions and rate them a) b) d) c) from pleasant to unpleasant
c) is worse than d) because c) is wind against tide and that always leads to worse sea conditions whereas in d) the sea conditions will be reduced by the wind over tide situation even though you are running into both. b) is better than d) because you're running with the wind even though the wind is against tide
 

Wiggo

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I think you may be in a minority of one less, Mike. I have always believed that wind over tide was wind in the opposite direction to the tide. Now perhaps you appreciate my confusion, though I think Brendan may still be part of your clique...
 

D3B

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Thanks Haydn /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
need to get that book back and do some more reading.

more to the point though is the Tidal trent link, which i am doing in a couple of weeks with an experieced skipper. its given me lots more info than anywhere else so far

Doug
 
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