Colregs question 2 ( genuine but not crucial )

[bilbobaggins]

During the 2003 Fastnet Race, a trimaran was anchored ( kedged a la Adlard Coles' 'Cohoe' ) ) in very light northerly breeze a dozen miles off St Alban's Head, in about 259 feet of water - with anchor ball. The young flood was making strongly, and shortly a far larger trimaran slowly appeared from the murk right ahead, sailing west but making east over the ground due to the tide stream.

A 'risk of collision' existed.

The breeze was so light that a substantial change to sail trim or heading on the big trimaran would probably 'stall' the sails, with complete loss of control. This was obvious to all. Five blasts on the Plastimo horn were heard.

Who should do what, with what, and to whom - besides getting out the camera?

Answers to Pantaenius on a postcard, please......


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[jimi]

The unanchored vessel should take avoiding action.

 

[moondancer]

[ QUOTE ]


A 'risk of collision' existed.

The breeze was so light that a substantial change to sail trim or heading on the big trimaran would probably 'stall' the sails, with complete loss of control. This was obvious to all. Five blasts on the Plastimo horn were heard.






[/ QUOTE ]

Isn't that a bit like saying 'there were some rocks in the way and we sailed over them because we would lose control otherwise' , or is this a trick question?

 

[wetndry]

Couldn't the trimaran have gybed?

 

[DJE]

With that much scope and a strong stream can't the anchored boat use her rudder(s) to shear out of the way? The difficulty I presume is in telling the other chap which way you're going to move.

 

[dom]

What is all this about losing control? On a fully crewed racing yacht!
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This seems to me some fig leaf invented by the tri after discussing the matter with their lawyers..

It reminds me of a story. My sister in law managed a branch of a Building Society. Bloke tried to steal something from shop next door and escape -usual thing. Police chased him so he dropped the bag. They caught him and charged him. He pleaded innocent on the basis that whilst he had left the store with the goods he had no intention of stealing anything. He only ran away because he spotted an old friend walking by and he wanted to say hello. Well guess what? The jury bought it!

 

[Superstrath]

Who was doing the tooting?

Presumably the big Tri has auxiliary power, and could simply use this to move itself off the course that risks collision by a few hundred feet. If it's trying to reach westwards, then even in a light northerly breeze it should be able to put enough south in it's course to avoid the smaller boat, even if that means gybing.

Or, open communications. By negotiation, the kedged boat could lift the pick far enough to start off with the tide, long enough to remove the risk and possibly for the breeze to rise in order to get the big boat moving in the right direction again.

I don't know. Is this a real occurance, and if so, what was the outcome?

 

[caol]

If the smaller boat was genuinely at anchor and showing the correct signal, then its a non question. The boat under weigh has to keep clear. Any difficulty involved in doing so is irrelevant.

 

[fireball]

But if they are both racing they are subject to racing rules and not the colregs .... which then precludes any use of auxiliary engine. However, if the contact is going to be light then it may be easier to just touch and then do a 720 when past.

 

[Pinnacle]

I think I am correct in saying that in the ISAF rules, "if possible" a yacht underway shall keep clear of a yacht which is anchored. So it looks like the give way yacht is the yacht underway - even if she is going backwards over the bottom.

 

[bilbobaggins]

Real occurrence.

And for the avoidance of any confusion, both sets of rules applied - the RRS by choice and IRPCS by international treaty.

The guys on the big, fast, 'look-at-us' racing tri were very miffed that t'other had anchored - and got ahead of them. There was some suggestion that this was cheating somehow, until someone else pointed out that Adlard Coles had used the trick successfully in his 'Cohoe' many decades before.

As has been said elsewhere, that race is not about straight-line speed - it's about weather guile and working your tides at the many headlands.

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[fireball]

[ QUOTE ]
RRS by choice

[/ QUOTE ] ?? I thought if they are both racing then they are bound by these rules, colregs then apply when not covered by the RRS .. so unless one retired then the RRS are not in force by choice (unless by choice you are meaning that it was their choice to race and not retire ...)

 

[HoratioHB]

Did this in a Sigma 38 some years ago when becalmed racing in the Channel (Service Offshore Regatta) just North of Alderney. We lost the wind just as the tide turned and put a kedge down with every spare line on board. It held with up to 4 knots showing at times and took 45 minutes to grind in on a main winch. We ended up miles ahead when the wind came back and won the race - no-one complained. Mind you not sure what would have happened it we had been in the main shipping lanes!!!

 

[Superstrath]

Sorry Bilbo, I thought the question was about collision avoidance. Turns out to be about racing.

In that case, well done the wee boat, get out the fenders, and watch the "out of control" big tri atempting to perform pirhouettes after the hopefully light contact.

 

[gandy]

So what happened? Did they change course to pass to leeward as the tide swept them past?

 

[caol]

RRS Rule 21

[ QUOTE ]
But if they are both racing they are subject to racing rules and not the colregs .... which then precludes any use of auxiliary engine. However, if the contact is going to be light then it may be easier to just touch and then do a 720 when past.

[/ QUOTE ]

A boat under weigh shall avoid a boat at anchor. Anything else would be clearly unpractical.

 

[graham]

Its a while sinse I did any racing but Im sure the rules allowed a yacht to use its engine to avoid a dangerous situation provided they didnt gain any advantage??

 

[fireball]

It was last night since I did any racing ... but I don't have an engine in that boat!

 

[jb2006]

Re: RRS Rule 21

[ QUOTE ]

A boat under weigh shall avoid a boat at anchor. Anything else would be clearly unpractical.

[/ QUOTE ]

Under weigh ? That sounds like a disqualification under IRC rules /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[bilbobaggins]

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry Bilbo, I thought the question was about collision avoidance.

[/ QUOTE ]

Nope. Collision avoidance was certainly what was on everyone's minds. The fact that both boats were also racing - and in the same class - just added some extra degrees of confusion. I believe most were concerned to avoid 'oles in the 'ulls.

In the heated debate several days later, Rule 2 was intoned, as was Rule 8. So also was the question of who was under way; who was making way; and who wasn't. We never did determine whether a vessel, in a 'risk of collision' situation, could be at once 'not under way ( anchored ) but making way' ( through the water ) as defined in the Rules.

As no actual harm was done, honour was satisfied with a token beer, as most of these infractions should be.



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