Col Regs: Conclusion

[gcwhite]

I have been away for a week so I have only just reviewed the replies.

Some were intelligent and encouraging. others illustrated why there is still an attitude problem. The proposition was one of basic seamanship and cannot be defended. If you did, then challenge your integrity and ask yourself the obvious, but painful question, should you be a yachtsman or have you fundamentally let down your responsible cousins?.

To the person who asked "could I handle a 53 ft yacht"; I assume you were the culprit.

Just in case you take some satisfaction from answering in an aggressive manner, I wont be reading the replies to this message, I have heard enough.


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[Sybarite]

I have no idea which thread you are referring to.

However when I read that you wont read the responses because you have had enough (having first made your own point) then you should question the utility of your continuing presence on this forum.

John



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[halcyon]

Should we start adding an outline of responses to posings we require.
No bio either

Brian

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[Neraida]

I have just scanned the thread you mention. (John, its <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.ybw.com/cgi-bin/forums/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=ym&Number=539388&page=2&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=14&part=1&vc=1> here </A> )

Consider this. You walk into a biker pub, having arrived in your, say Honda PanEuropean, (The current bike favoured by the Police) stand on a table and declare that you have just been cut up by some bloke in a Harley, and that all harley drivers are idiots. How do you expect that they would respond to you?


As somebody said in the thread, the Sail/Motor devide has been done to death. People make mistakes, people don't like other types of people. You have posted in Yachting Monthly's Scuttlebutt, which is inhabited mainly by yachtsmen and women. Life is much to short to be so small minded and petty surely?

I dont mind that you wont be reading this, my friends here will, and I hope that they will see my point.


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[mirabriani]

Oooooooooooohhhhh!

We're all a bit tetchy on this thread are we not?

Simmer down there is sailing to look forward to tomorrow

Briani

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[Neraida]

You shurrup you. I'm cross.

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[Victorious]

Power gives way to sail.
It is as simple as that.

sounds like you consider yourself above such simple rules.
there is indeed an attitude problem.

As for your claim that you wont be reading these replies..... I simply dont belive you.
Thus your implication that the yacht did not give you sufficient opportunty to keep clear... could also be suspect....... ?
<snigger>

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[mirabriani]

Deathly hush!

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[Joe_Cole]

You're right there is an attitude problem. The question is, whose?

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[Solitaire]

Power gives way to sail! As simple as that is it? Oh dear! I saw a yacht gaily believing in that while crossing in front of a large tanker in the the Thorne Channel the other week. Rule 9 section B for example - " A vessel of less than 20 metres in length or a sailing vessel shall not impede the passage of a vessel which can safely navigate only within a narrow channel or fairway."



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[Mike21]

"Power gives way to sail."
"It is as simple as that."
You'll also find bylaws like on the Hamble river that state any vessel entering or crossing the fairway MUST giveway, so it's not really so simple.
Unfortunately there are a few raggies who believe that rule although luckily they only seem to come out a weekends, but that kind of belief tends to suggest that maybe there should be compulsory training for raggies/forums/images/icons/wink.gif


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[snowleopard]

so let\'s just clarify...

you were right

there was no other possible interpretation of the situation.

you were able to determine not only what the other party did but his reasons for doing so

anyone who questions the above is lacking in integrity and should stay off the water

a forum is for people to inform the world of their views which must not be challenged.

anything i missed?

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[Mizzenrabble]

He apparently pilots a Sunseeker Manhattan 50, 22 tons. So you Solent Yotties had better beware.....Or sharpen your bowsprits???

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[Peppermint]

Re: I learnt a lot about sailing

from motorcycling. Trust no one, you are invisible, expect the unexpected, the most ridiculous outcome will probably occur, don't crash into other vehicles. Be wary of the rule of the road.

The situation you described was a complex one. A mixture of interpretation of rules, draught, wind and attitude. From listening to your "powerful" bretheren it appears that a yacht tacking across your bows is not exactly unusual or unexpected. Nobody was hurt. In fact it was such a non event I'm amazed you are so outraged.

Hey but you won't read this so we'll never know. Will we?

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[Joe_Cole]

From his other postings it looks as if he was out for a test drive in a Manhatten (his current boat is smaller, he is buying the Manhatten at the moment). To give him the benefit of the doubt I suspect that his problem was a result of being a little nervous in an unfamiliar boat. It's quite likely that there wasn't a problem at all, but he was being over cautious. We'll never know though, will we?!!!

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[l'escargot]

Perhaps a belief that byelaws over-ride col regs indicates that there should be compulsory training for some stinkies........

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[Mike21]

You've lost me there, if a byelaw states ALL vessels MUST give way entering or crossing a fairway, what makes a raggie think it doesn't apply to them?
Byelaw as far as I know overrides colreg
Would be pointless having compulsory training for powerboaters if raggies ignore all the rules anyway as we'd expect raggies to abide by the rules and be rather annoyed when they didn't.
Bit like now really, isn't it?/forums/images/icons/smile.gif


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[peterb]

Rule 1(b):

"Nothing in these Rules shall interfere with the operation of special rules made by an appropriate authority for roadsteads, harbours, lakes or inland waterways connected with the high seas and navigable by seagoing vessels. Such special rules shall conform as closely as possible to these rules."

So if the harbour byelaws do differ from colregs, then byelaws take precedence.

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[l'escargot]

I think you are very prone to over generalisation.

I still think if you lined up 12 random raggies and 12 random stinkies and asked about colregs, you would get more blank stares from the stinkies. Inexperienced raggies don't get very far because they can't make the boat go. You see inexperienced stinkies careering all over the place as most manage to point it towards open water.

There does seem to be an absolute refusal to accept that the broad principle still stands (subject to many variables most of which are covered in colregs) that power will give way to sail. I think it is a macho thing with some stinkies - someone with a smaller engine than them gets priority and they haven't even got it turned on! /forums/images/icons/wink.gif

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[Mike21]

Refusal seem to be on part of some raggies to accept that power giving way to sail is not absolute, in fact many seem to think all power craft give way to sailing boats regardless whether the raggies are under power or sail or in some cases both.

Speaking to some yachting friends, it appears they have more problems with ignorance from other raggies than with moboers, and going by number of collisions there are between sailing craft............../forums/images/icons/crazy.gif

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