club imposed third party ins. cover level

[kieronriley]

we now have a third party liability ins. level required by our club of three million pounds,now this may seem ok,but.I know of a claim paid out not so long ago for seven million pounds(car accident)now if one of us,club members where to be involvede in an accident that cost over three million,who would be responsible for the excess,would it be the member, or could it be the club as it is the club that has instructed us to all be insured for three million.my big wory is that if the club was held liable we could all end up owing a share of the excess.The club have not asked us to be insured for a minimum of three million which could leave each individual responsible,rather they have told us we must be insured for three million pounds.Kieron

 

[NealB]

I'd have thought this would be a really good question to put to the RYA, as it could affect many clubs.

 

[davidej]

I suppose you could be liable if you were part of the incident which gave rise to the claim and you were negligent.

However, I don't think you would be liable as an ordinary club member. Most clubs are constituted a a company limited by guarantee and each members liability is usually limited to £1.

 

[ostell]

Are you sure that it is a specific figure? I don't think they would object, nor would they be in a position to, if you insured for a higher value.

 

[Momac]

I think you are talking about each individual boat being insured for £3Million third party liability cover?

£3M is the minimum sum insured required by BW for inland craft and , no surprise, it seems the normal sum included on a boat insurance policy.

What the club is insured for is up to the club - that's a seperate matter.

 

[Twister_Ken]

The club should be insured as well as members' boats. It could ask for whatever level it wanted. If an incident involving a member's boat racked up claim that bust the £3m barrier AND the club was in some way also in the frame, then the club's insurance would bear the brunt, not the rest of the members.

 

[2Tizwoz]

three million pounds,now this may seem ok,but.I know of a claim paid out not so long ago for seven million pounds(car accident)

Presumably, as it was paid out, the money was available. There's not much to be gained by pursuing a claim or making an order that cannot be met.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-135028/7-million-payout-Selby-victims.html This little car accident cost £50m. Where do you stop?

 

[kieronriley]

answers

yes MartynG you are correct it is for aech individual boat,
and yes Ostell i,m sure that they would not complain if i was to insure for more ,but i do wonder would it be better policy for the club not to be involved in telling us what we must be insured for (third party)as then any claim would fall solely on the boat owner rather than our situation where we are beeing told to insure for a sum which may not be enough and then any excess falling on the club ?and then on to its members i.e me Kieron

 

[theoldsalt]

If a claim is made against a club I believe it is usually the elected officers that may be liable. That is why it is essential for a club's constitution to include a rule that indemnifies all elected officers against such claims (implemented by suitable insurance).

I would not be an elected officer of any club whose constitution did not include this indemnity.

 

[Searush]

It's a recommended MINIMUM! I have had moorings authorities that only ask for a 1m minimum. If the claim against you came to more & you were liable then you would be made bankrupt I guess. Do you normally sail so dangerously that such a claim is even remotely likely?

I wouldn't worry your socks off about it, TBH.

 

[kieronriley]

minimum

Searush,it may be recomended to you,but it is an instruction to us,and no i dont usualy sail so badly as to end up causing that sort of damage,but i,m sure we all think that until !!!!
the point realy is i know that three million is recomended in fact most policies cover that automaticly,its the club involving itself in something that coud being the roof down on us.I am and have for some timebeen covered for that amount and agree totaly to having insurence to cover for accidents i just dont think that its not a good idea for the club to get so involved in numbers so as to open itself to possible action.i.e if they did not get involved in the figures then they could not be liable,well i dont think so.Kieron

 

[Momac]

yes MartynG you are correct it is for aech individual boat,

If you have insurance for your own boat the third party cover is to protect you in case you have an accident and you are found responsible for damage to someones property or person. Say you accidentally collide with another boat and damage it or cause someone an injury, it covers you for that.
Your own insurance will not cover the clubs liability.
Most likely the club simply wishes to see that everone has insurance which doesn't seem unreasonable.
Why would you not have insurance?

 

[rob2]

From the workings of our club my understanding is that the club insist on the individual boats using their facilities, yard and moorings, carrying insurance. This is pretty much a question of duty of care should an accident occur whilst the boat is on their property and by doing so the club pretty much absolves itself from liability for accidents for which they cannot be blamed (except by lawyers!). If they did not insist on third party insurance, then should somebody be hurt or killed then some portion of the blame may be passed onto the club as they did not raise the issue of risk and make the members responsible for their own actions, including act of god.

Rob.

 

[duncan99210]

There are 2 separate issues rasied by the OP.

Firstly, his Club has sensibly insisted that any member using their boat on the Club's facilities must carry £3m third party cover. This means that if a member is involved in an incident where damage is caused, then his own insurance will cover £3m worth of damages. This is a standard condition of use for most facilities and clubs that I've encountered and it covers, for example, the clean up involved if a boat were to sink at her moorings. It is a sensible precaution to take, so that the owner of a boat causing damage to or from the Club facilities has the means to meet any claims against him.

The second issue is whether by imposing a £3m limit the Club is openning the door to being persued as a defendant where an incident involving a Club member's boat where the £3m claim limit was breached. Unless the Club was proved to have in some way contributed to the incident, then the Club has no liability for damages caused, no matter what they have said about 3rd party liability limits.

In any case, the Club should hold its own insurance to cover the use of its facilities. I think that the OP is worrying about nothing, unless his Club has decided that by requiring members to have their own insurance they do not need their own, separate policy!

 

[Searush]

Searush,it may be recomended to you,but it is an instruction to us,and no i dont usualy sail so badly as to end up causing that sort of damage,but i,m sure we all think that until !!!!
the point realy is i know that three million is recomended in fact most policies cover that automaticly,its the club involving itself in something that coud being the roof down on us.I am and have for some timebeen covered for that amount and agree totaly to having insurence to cover for accidents i just dont think that its not a good idea for the club to get so involved in numbers so as to open itself to possible action.i.e if they did not get involved in the figures then they could not be liable,well i dont think so.Kieron

You have completely missed the point. They are insisting on a MINIMUM of 3m, (ie that is their recommended minimum) there is nothing to stop you insuring for 100m if you wish as long as you insure for not less han 3m. It's normal practice & very sensible, you have no need to worry.

While it is perfecly possible that you could run a supertanker on the rocks, it is a tad unlikely. I do not know of many multi-million yacht claims, do you? My two claims over the last 30 years have cost a total of about 800 quid, and none of it was 3rd party costs.

 

[oldharry]

I cant see how the club can be making itself in any way liable by insisting members carry adequate insurance. As other have pointed out most harbour authorities and boatyards insist on 3rd party insurance for boats in their jurisdiction. I cant see them doing that if there was even the remotest chance it lead to any sort of liability on their part.

 

[Tranona]

The recommended minimum third party has been steadily increasing over the years as the potential for really large claims have increased. However, the actual risk (that is the probability of it occuring) is very low and the impact on individul premiums is minimal.

Can't see what the OP is concerned about - it is just the club, like all providers of services for boats, bringing their requirements into line with best practice.