cctv and privacy

[Csail]

Was away at a marina and they had cctv cameras looking at every pontoon, if you go on their website you can look at one live picture looking out to sea but i wanted to look at the camera facing our boat but was told they couldn't because of privacy law. Is that right.

 

[GlennG]

Privacy policy; not sure about privacy law as it's a public place - or is it?

Makes sense for the marina to offer restricted access to the webcams for owners though. IMHO would be quite a differentiator between other marinas.

 

[Csail]

Probably classed as public, for example we were at a campsite a few weeks ago and in the evening had a few beers but i was happy to drive across the field but got told i couldn't as its public access therefore same as highway laws.

 

[Rigger Mortice]

I've certainly seen marina webcams that allow people to look at their, and others, boats.
Our club has a webcam which lets anyone select and look at any of the boats on the river. The club has prevented certain shots from being seen though. It's not possible for people to look in through the bedroom windows of nearby flats. It's no longer possible to examine trains at the nearby station. The former was done for obvious reasons, the latter was done because trainspotters were hogging the webcam. However, the restrictions were not made because of legal reasons, just common sense.

I suspect that your marina has made the rule because of some pen pusher somewhere rather than as a result of real legal advice. Privacy and H&S seem, these days, to be the most popular reasons that bureaucrats and pen pushers give to impose petty restrictions to make themselves feel important.

 

[mikemanor]

Release of CCTV images and recordings is subject to the Information Commissioners Office's Code of Practice

http://www.ico.gov.uk/upload/docume...iled_specialist_guides/ico_cctvfinal_2301.pdf

 

[Rigger Mortice]

A Code of Practice is advisory, no more. It is not legally enforcable.

 

[bedouin]

A Code of Practice is advisory, no more. It is not legally enforcable.

Images/video recorded via CCTV are covered by the Data Protection Act so are legally enforceable, and the ICO have the responsibility to enforce the act.

AFAIK there is less legislation around live images, but they will be covered by general privacy legislation such as the Human Rights Act (although this of course is not enforceable except against state bodies).

 

[Rigger Mortice]

Images/video recorded via CCTV are covered by the Data Protection Act so are legally enforceable, and the ICO have the responsibility to enforce the act.

Correct. The point I was making is that the Code of Practice is not the law, the DPA is.
A code may give additional advice, but it does not become law simply by being included in the code.

 

[Seajet]

Privacy

While not subject to any adulterous wrong-doing myself ( honest ! ) after seeing some antics at marinas & sailing clubs I wonder when divorce lawyers will get hold of certain images of people being 'entertained' ?!

On the other hand I once tried for a sailing job with a chap who turned out to be decidedly dodgy, he insisted on launching the dinghy in a CCTV blind spot he knew of, in a marina he hadn't paid; I took that as 'Red Alert, Shields Up' so didn't pursue the job, this was years ago so the chap - and the marina - were quite clued up ahead of their time.

Now my sailing club has an extensive CCTV security system, as I'm not a committee type I wonder what the operators get to see and how 'rumour control' works !

 

[Ex-SolentBoy]

Seems like a load of b******s to me, and if that is the law, the law is an ass.

The marina puts up a webcam.
All their employees and any visitors probably, can see the images.
I see no problem with others looking at them as well.

Heres a very nice webcam.
http://www.webcams.travel/webcam/1242575353-Weather-Falmouth-Harbour-Falmouth

When my boat was there the guys that run it were kind enough to move it a bit so I could keep an eye on my boat!

 

[savageseadog]

Definitely restricted by Data Protection Act. There will be circumstances where third parties may be allowed to view but the decision is that of the data controller who may refer to a written policy that policy will in turn have to comply with the Act. Otherwise it's possible to obtain a court order. Many organisations just operate a blanket ban, it's easier and less chance of being sued or being taken to court by the information commissioner.

 

[XP_Dude]

Seems like a load of b******s to me, and if that is the law, the law is an ass.

The marina puts up a webcam.
All their employees and any visitors probably, can see the images.
I see no problem with others looking at them as well.

Heres a very nice webcam.
http://www.webcams.travel/webcam/1242575353-Weather-Falmouth-Harbour-Falmouth

When my boat was there the guys that run it were kind enough to move it a bit so I could keep an eye on my boat!

That is the worst webcam I have ever seen, I can't see anything!

 

[Rigger Mortice]

Definitely restricted by Data Protection Act. .

Are you sure about that? If you're right there are at least 5 different webcams around my mooring which are illegal. One is supported by the local council.

The little I've seen about CCTV makes me understand that "recorded" and "live" pictures are treated differently with "live" pictures being a lot easier to handle.

 

[savageseadog]

Are you sure about that? If you're right there are at least 5 different webcams around my mooring which are illegal. One is supported by the local council.

The little I've seen about CCTV makes me understand that "recorded" and "live" pictures are treated differently with "live" pictures being a lot easier to handle.

CCTV means recorded to me but I know many CCTV installation won't allow any kind of viewing, live or recorded. It's simply down to the policy operated by the organisation. I think the general rule is there should be an appointed data controller, a policy compliant with the data protection act and signs and that's about it.
A webcam is operated with a policy of open access to live images and possibly recorded ones (although I don't know of any that have recorded images) and they probably are illegal on the basis that there are no signs, data controller or policy.

 

[Rigger Mortice]

So the webcams that I was thinking of (Simply sending pictures down the internet. AFAIK no recording) are all OK?

But if a Marina has CCTV (i.e recorded, presumably for security reasons) all the DPA systems need to be in place with all the resulting problems of releasing the pictures?

If it is a webcam which is also recorded then DPA applies too?

Daft really. But that doesn't surprise me.

 

[bedouin]

So the webcams that I was thinking of (Simply sending pictures down the internet. AFAIK no recording) are all OK?

But if a Marina has CCTV (i.e recorded, presumably for security reasons) all the DPA systems need to be in place with all the resulting problems of releasing the pictures?

If it is a webcam which is also recorded then DPA applies too?

Daft really. But that doesn't surprise me.

DPA is purely about storing data - so only applies to recorded images / video. In fact its application to CCTV may well not have been intentional, but rather a consequence of the wording of the directive.

In fact I think DPA works pretty well with CCTV.

DPA does not cover live distribution - but other privacy legislation does apply.

 

[pvb]

I like marina webcams; the one in the marina where I keep my boat shows it quite well - reassuring to be able to see it's still happily afloat!

 

[savageseadog]

DPA is purely about storing data - so only applies to recorded images / video. .

But what if some people record the webcam images?

 

[Pete R]

Was away at a marina and they had cctv cameras looking at every pontoon, if you go on their website you can look at one live picture looking out to sea but i wanted to look at the camera facing our boat but was told they couldn't because of privacy law. Is that right.

The web cam is ok for all to look at as it is not recorded and is just a general view and is not being used to identify someone.

The CCTV is regulated under DPA and as such you wouldn't be able to look at it live. You are allowed to ask for any images of you that they have captured but there maybe a fee.

 

[Pete R]

I suspect that your marina has made the rule because of some pen pusher somewhere rather than as a result of real legal advice. Privacy and H&S seem, these days, to be the most popular reasons that bureaucrats and pen pushers give to impose petty restrictions to make themselves feel important.

The web cam he could view. It was the CCTV he couldn't. I think you may be getting upset for nothing.