Carbon monoxide on board

bilbobaggins

bilbobaggins

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This evening's news regarding the deaths of two children in Corfu reminds me......

I spent a few days on board some friends' boat earlier this year, which had a gas-fired refrigerator in the galley area. Although there was an opening portlight in the hull above it, this vented inboard. Peeps will not be surprised to hear that I suffered powerful headaches while sleeping on board, not at all caused by the evening's social events.

On another boat, the Taylor's paraffin stove often saw yeoman service when anchored up safe in some loch, with the rain driving horizonatlly past....... we thot the headaches were due to the cheap whisky, until someone noticed the rubber cover on the flue pipe was still in place!

Does your installation need a second look?

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Luckily our sleeping cabins are separate, unlucky for winter runs to the bog in the night!

But the eber if it leaked might affect the berths. I use those spot cards and do check them regularly. Never run the heater over night and often open the hatch into the cockpit tent as the small cabin can get warm and damp at night (yeah yeah).

I do think about it though, I am especially careful about fenders near the eber exhaust after reading someones frightening account on here when a fender melted over the exhaust, he said he was so weak he could hardly climb the saloon steps to get out.

Thank you for the reminder though, always good to keep these things in mind.

I am also seriously paranoid if I get a headache on board, probably a good thing as it is the first symptom, even though it is a normal everyday headache.
 
My fridge vents inboard and has not been a problem in 25 years. I always have vents open though which provides enough ventilation. The amount of gas involved for a fridge is a bit more than a pilot light, yet people are quite happy to cook in a sealed cabin with all burners on the cooker flat out !!
 
I have a carbon monoxide detector fitted to my boat, but was suprised when it went off in the night with no obvious source of gases, it was a warm night so no heater on, but the hatches were closed. Mind you we had been on a heavy session that evening, maybe we were producing our own gases, if you know what I mean!
 
There is a story about the effects of CO. It is about a man stuck in a yacht in the frozen north with his cat. (less 1 ear) He slowly goes mad because of a leak in the generator exhaust. Anyone know the title?

Seriously CO is terrible. Normally more trouble when downdrafts occur or the air input is blocked. Very very sad.

We knew an Australian couple that while at sea, using a petrol generator in the cockpit, the lady went down below and immediately passed out. Thankfully he realized the problem before dashing after her.
 
<<maybe we were producing our own gases, if you know what I mean! >>

You would have to be seriously malfunctioning to produce CO. Mostly we produce CO2 or methane, depending on the orifice used. CO is a deadly poison, most of fumes from a cooker would be CO2 which "only" suffocates.

So, if you feel better as soon as you open the hatch you are probably only suffocating in CO2. If poisoned by CO, recovery is not that fast and your lips & fingernails will have started to go blue.
 
Sorry to bring up small aircraft again but they have very serious requirements for insp4ection and overhaul of the petrol powered heaters. like 100 hours operation and 3 years calender time. This is because they have been found to suffer from fatigue and cracking of the air jacket so allowing CO and other combustion gases into the warm air circuit. There is also concern about engine exhuast leakage into the cabin.
Frequently used are a black spot warning card which has a 1nch diameter chemical spot which changes colour in the presence of CO they are quite cheap and can be ordered from aircraft spares suppliers. Ort you can go for an electronic sensor warning very much like a gas alarm. be carefull in winter...olewill
 
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.... If poisoned by CO, recovery is not that fast and your lips & fingernails will have started to go blue.

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I thought CO poisoning turned you a "healthy" shade of pink - it's CO2 that would turn you blue?

Incidentally it also seems to me that most yachts have a very efficient CO generator, called an engine, and situated within the accommodation area. We do rely heavily on the integrity of the exhaust system. (And outboard users are not exempt - how often are you motoring in a light following wind which picks up the exhaust and stuffs it down the main hatch?)
My boat has an electronic CO detector which emits a piercing howl if it finds any. Cheap from B&Q, and you don't have to keep looking at a spot on a card. I thought most boats had one? and if not, why not?
Yachting - a pastime with hidden dangers ...
 
I agree with Blackbeard
A coloured spot on a card won`t wake you up.
I install Gas central heating for a living and we used to give the battery co detectors free to customers.
Whilst installing a boiler in an old lady house I told the apprentice to fit the CO detector in the lounge as she had a open flued gas fire which was turned on, within 10 minutes the alarm was going off I suspected that it was a faulty unit but on doing a spillage check on the fire the flue was found to be at fault as it terminated to close to an ajoining wall, it probably worked ok some times depending on the wind direction.
They are only around the £25 mark and it just might be the best money you ever spend !
Pete
 
I got mine from Homebase for about £30 after a work colleague's son nearly died from CO poisoning earlier this year. Apart from saying he was lucky to be alive, doctors were amazed that he recovered from almost complete paralysis several months after coming out of a coma. It really is very, very nasty.

Contrary to the instructions, I fitted mine near the galley (cos it was convenient) and it's comforting to see it registering about 10ppm when the stoves on. Extra pease of mind from seeing it working.

Go buy one today!
 
the big difference between cookers and fridges or heaters is that cookers arent generally left on unattended 24 hours a day.

a friend of mine and his partner ended up seriously ill in hospital due to a fridge emitting CO into the cabin. COpoisoning can accumulate slowly in the blood even from small concentrations in the air .

He woke up and was unable to use his legs .Dragged himself out into the cockpit then went back and pulled his girlfriend out. They were very lucky to say the least.

Please dont dismiss a fridge as safe because it doesnt use much gas. Thats not the way it works unfortunately.
 
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But the eber if it leaked might affect the berths.

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only if it's the petrol one

whilst not suggesting for one minute that the exhaust from a diesel is completely harmless the significant danger is suffocation from CO2 levels increasing and oxygen depletion. As many increase thier ventilation when running the heater anyway (as oposed to restricting it when they don't to maintain warmth) even that risk is mitigated - but still a risk.

It also follows that you should ensure you have the right detector alarm installed for your risk !
 
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only if it's the petrol one

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Now I am piqued...

Are you suggesting, even if lets say my exhaust was leaking into the locker and being sucked into the input of the eber it would not raise the the level of CO in the cabins?

Is this absolute?

J
 
What Duncan means is that CO is only produced by petrol engines not diesel engines, they use different hydorcarbons and have a different combustion process.
If you try to top yourself with a hosepipe from a diesel car you will be there a long time and with a bad headache no doubt, but you will eventually die of lack of oxygen as opposed to CO poisoning, CO affects the haemaglobin and prevents the red corpuscles from taking up oxygen in the lungs and destroys braincells. Diesel just suffocates you, both lethal but CO is odourless and more deadly.
 
Some CO alarms are one off units, so when battery runs out, the whole unit needs to be replaced- this happened recently to mine. Just got a new unit from Focus DIY which is a combined smoke & CO alarm for about £35. Not cheap, but I believe with replaceable batteries.
 
I have a carbon monoxide detector on board, but will this detect carbon dioxide? Or should I get a CO2 detector as well?

S.
 
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What Duncan means is that CO is only produced by petrol engines not diesel engines, they use different hydorcarbons and have a different combustion process.


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Comforting for those of us with inboard diesels, and I accept that a correctly functioning diesel isn't going to give as much CO as a petrol engine. But ... ANY hydrocarbon, or for that matter carbon, subject to incomplete combustion will produce CO (so says my O level Chemistry), so if the engine isn't working at peak efficiency for any reason ... say a blocked air filter, or a poorly functioning injector, or too much load from a fouled propellor ... it could give some CO? can anyone confirm this?
How far can I trust the mighty Yanmar 1GM?
 
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