Calling ships when crossing shipping lane?

[RJJ]

For me, colregs, but at the same time willingness to consider all tools in the bag.

Crossing Calais - Dover last March, in a F4 with wind up chuff at 3am, in my new-to-me yacht....a Maersk container ship >300m was indicating a CPA less than 250m and travelling at 18 knots. So I buzzed them at range 5 miles and glad I did. I proposed I would take their stern, they came back very firmly that no, they had already started turning to pass astern of me and they wanted me to stand on, which I did. Hardening up to a reach would have meant us turning towards each other at a closing speed of >25 knots, in the dark.

Two minutes later the angle started to open out and we crossed about a mile ahead.

I called them on 16. With two of us on watch, the other chap was a decent helm, but I didn't want to spend five minutes fiddling around to enter an MMSI. I don't know if there's a setup to copy an MMSI from the plotter to the VHF, but it could help in that department.

 

[ryanroberts]

At what range?

If significantly less than five miles he was probably doing you a favour as his options for course correction could still have left a small CPA. A "bloody great Maersk job" does not handle like your boat and has to make even small alterations of course well in advance.

As a general rule merchant vessels will have identified potential close quarters situations at five mile range and made appropriate course corrections by 3 miles range from the 'target'.

Make sure you can be clearly identified by radar and/or AIS at five plus miles if you wish to avoid hairy close quarters situations.

Was further than 5 miles out, course may have been unpredictable as it was a tad lumpy? 6-7 and a beamy sea. Have an effective passive reflector and AIS RX which unfortunately doesn't display on the inside helm for some reason. They politely asked for a 5 degree correction so I went up 10. Passed behind with a couple of miles clearance.

 

[prv]

I don't know if there's a setup to copy an MMSI from the plotter to the VHF, but it could help in that department.

There is, but support for it in radios and plotters is a bit hit and miss. Vesper used to maintain a list of radios that worked.

In practice, the name from AIS and a voice call on 16 is easier all round, if you’re going to do it.

Pete

 

[Catalina36]

Do as you would do while trying to run across the M6. Expect no mercy and just keep out of the way. The Colregs work well for two ships doing 20 knots or two yachts doing 5. When one is doing 20 and the other is doing 5, just make sure you go behind them. They probably won't notice if you don't.

 

[john_morris_uk]

John, I would not normally contemplate disagreeing with you but in the circumstances you might note that I say “in my experience”. As that is my experience then my statement is hard to argue with.
Also, ”if in doubt”; if you were in doubt about your vessels ability to cross cleanly in front of a vessel constrained by draft, would you charge ahead? Or loiter a while? Caution has kept my family alive so far, I won’t be changing that!

Whilst I understand that 'in your experience' is a strong argument, my certain knowledge is that for many years, yachtsmen and women have been convinced that ships haven't seen them and are not altering for them and that they are doomed. AIS has been a wonderful tool that tells a different story. Whilst IRPCS say that course alterations are supposed to be large and obvious, ship's tend to make small tweaks to their course as 'large and obvious' costs money and time. (Same thing in shipping terms.). AIS has revealed what I have been trying to explain to people for years. Ships DO alter for yachts. If you are stand on, then stand on (with care in case you've just found the one in 10,000 that is asleep) and watch as the ship tweaks it's course and passes clear of you. If you've just found the one ship (and again there have only been a slack handful of ships in my sailing life that this applies to) that doesn't appear to be complying with IRPCS, you can always reverse your track and live to sail another day.

Vessels constrained by draught have rights... so I don't understand your question. (However you probably know they're almost right at the bottom of the pecking order?)

I can't comment on whether ships rarely answer VHF calls as I have only called a couple in fifty years. They both answered.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Do as you would do while trying to run across the M6. Expect no mercy and just keep out of the way.

Please don't 'just keep out of the way'
There's no such thing in IRPCS and if you can see the ship then IRPCS applies and you should comply with the law.
Otherwise you're just another WAFI that get's yachtsmen a bad name among professional seamen. and OOW's. "What are they doing now?" or words to that effect is a paraphrase of what is heard on many a bridge.

 

[LadyInBed]

Ships that I see on a collision course with me, I note their COG at about 5 mls, if they haven't altered course by 3 mls, I see no problem with giving them a shout on 16 and say that I see we are on a collision course, and asking them what their intension is. Most times they reply and tell me that they will be altering course and which way. The ones that don't reply, I see them change course on AIS.
I've never had a ship run me down!
A point about calling them on 16 is that they don't know if Joburg or Dover or whoever isn't monitoring 16 so come the day of judgement they will be on the back foot.

 

[Laminar Flow]

My understanding is that when crossing the TSS a small vessel shall do so at right angles and without impeding the traffic. That is why I stay out of the way and, when in doubt, prefer to go astern of anything large and rusty.

Having worked on the bridge of commercial ships, we only ever called in "our intentions" when doing something "unusual". Otherwise it just makes sense to stick to the COLREGS and avoid any confusion. Generally speaking, no small craft should be doing anything unusual and certainly not in the TSS.

 

[john_morris_uk]

My understanding is that when crossing the TSS a small vessel shall do so at right angles and without impeding the traffic. That is why I stay out of the way and, when in doubt, prefer to go astern of anything large and rusty.

Having worked on the bridge of commercial ships, we only ever called in "our intentions" when doing something "unusual". Otherwise it just makes sense to stick to the COLREGS and avoid any confusion. Generally speaking, no small craft should be doing anything unusual and certainly not in the TSS.

Completely agree. I despair at the suggestions from some people.

 

[James_Calvert]

I've only fitted AIS receive this year and haven't yet had the chance to use it among shipping.

But on the question of whether your CPA represents a passing in front or a passing behind, won't the changing bearing tell you in the same way a hand bearing compass does?

 

[srm]

and if you can see the ship then IRPCS applies and you should comply with the law.

IRPCS only applies if there is a risk of a close quarters situation. This is something MN deck officers should learn on the ENRAST courses when faced with two or more targets. They can turn towards a second target to avoid close quarters with the first, provided that they do not create a new risk with the second target.
IRPCS also applies if you can not see the vessel but are aware that there may be a risk of close quarters, ie hear a sound signal forward of the beam or have a radar target - Rule 19.

 

[srm]

But on the question of whether your CPA represents a passing in front or a passing behind, won't the changing bearing tell you in the same way a hand bearing compass does?

Yes, but depending on your reciever and display mode plus the crossing angle it may not be very obvious, especially if your own heading is not steady. If you can see the vessel your hand bearing compass may resolve the situation more easily.

 

[LittleSister]

IRPCS only applies if there is a risk of a close quarters situation.

Surely IRCPS apply at all times. Whether there is a risk of collision, and whether the vessels are in sight of one another, affects only which particular rules, or sections of rules, apply.

 

[srm]

Whilst IRPCS say that course alterations are supposed to be large and obvious, ship's tend to make small tweaks to their course as 'large and obvious' costs money and time. (Same thing in shipping terms.). AIS has revealed what I have been trying to explain to people for years. Ships DO alter for yachts.

Yes, On the ENRAST course, for open waters, a CPA of 1 mile is regarded as safe. This can often be achieved by a small correction when altering at three miles from the target.

On the other hand I have had an overtaking coaster pass close by in open water with no one conscious on the bridge as I illuminated its interior as it passed.

 

[srm]

Surely IRCPS apply at all times. Whether there is a risk of collision, and whether the vessels are in sight of one another, affects only which particular rules, or sections of rules, apply.

Thanks, I stand corrected, should have qualifed my statement with 'the steering rules'.

 

[Spirit (of Glenans)]

There is, but support for it in radios and plotters is a bit hit and miss. Vesper used to maintain a list of radios that worked.

In practice, the name from AIS and a voice call on 16 is easier all round, if you’re going to do it.

Pete

Crewing on a new 42ft boat crossing Biscay a couple of years ago I found that overtaking vessels, if initially on a converging course, would alter course slightly, when at least five miles distant, so as to keep clear.
The boat was equipped with B&G Zeus MFDs which, when interrogating an AIS contact, had a facility to initiate a VHF DSC call to the vessel concerned, by one click.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Surely IRCPS apply at all times. Whether there is a risk of collision, and whether the vessels are in sight of one another, affects only which particular rules, or sections of rules, apply.

Indeed.
Rule 1 These rules shall apply to all vessels upon the high seas and in all waters connected therewith navigable by seagoing vessels.
And at the start of the section on what you should actually do when approaching another vessel.
Rule 11 Rules in this section apply to vessels in sight of one another.

 

[RJJ]

I've only fitted AIS receive this year and haven't yet had the chance to use it among shipping.

But on the question of whether your CPA represents a passing in front or a passing behind, won't the changing bearing tell you in the same way a hand bearing compass does?

Mathematically yes, but if it's going to be close then the angle won't open out much until it's potentially hazardous. I think this discussion centres on cases where the bearing is moving only very slowly.

It's close, so your decision to stand on or take avoiding action must be underpinned by (a) COLREGS, (b) good judgment and (c) avoidance of confusion between vessels. This discussion centres on whether (c) can be supported by communication. My view is yes (see #21) but used sparingly.

The bearing is of course always the first reference point at greater distances. I quite like checking the bearing from way out and seeing if my eyeball guess accords with reality. And I always check with compass as well as AIS.

And if your course steered and speed are variable (downwind in a seaway, for example in my anecdote above) you can see the CPA flitting between 500m, 0, 500m the other way.

 

[jkraffty]

I called a ship last year for the first time in 6 years when in the E bound lane (not TSS) near Ushant. Traffic was the heaviest I've ever encountered. I only had AIS receive on a 23 ft yacht with biggish seas and fluky wind, meaning my course and speed were less than precise. At 3 miles his CPA was around 200m after I had crossed ahead. Anything less than half a mile makes me very nervous, especially if crossing ahead! Changing course to go astern would have put me in a close quarters situation with another vessel, so I called to ask if he could see me, explain the CPA that my AIS was giving and to ask of his intentions. He was very polite and said he would turn 10 degrees to starboard to give me a wider berth. I was pleasantly surprised at how effective the comms were.

 

[Babylon]

On my first ever Channel crossing ten years ago in my small yacht (<---- photo to left) we were just south of the Isle of Wight when a large grey ship suddenly appeared out of the west on a certain collision course according to the hand-bearing compass. This is from my diary notes written up after the passage:

0740 Log 9.7 200 deg WSW3/4, 8 degrees leeway (probably an overestimate) EP on chart (50 26.9N 1 33.2W) Brian feeling dicky, autohelm steering, speed down to 4.5kts.

0830 Grey ship to starboard, approaching on constant bearing 245 degrees. Not equipped with AIS (or indeed a DSC radio), I reached for the VHF mike: “Grey ship in approximate position (lat-long from GPS given), this is yacht XXXXX, are you receiving me? Over.”

Comes back a thoroughly professional female voice: “Vessel calling US Warship P339, we are receiving you. Over.”

“US Warship P339, ah yes... we are only a small sailing yacht fine on your bow, just checking that you have us in sight. Over.”

“Yes, we have a clear visual on you. We are altering course to port. Over.”

“US Warship, thank you so much! XXXXX out.”

0840 Log 14.0 195 deg WSW3, speed down to 4.0kts, engine on.

Did I, under the circumstances, do the right thing?