buying ex charter yacht in greece

[chrisgee]

Can anyone bring me bang up to date re the above. boat is ex charter and is being sold to me "price inc of vat"
also any good lawyers who can do this purchase in or around Levkas for me?

Thanks for any useful info

 

[nimbusgb]

'Inclusive of VAT' may be different to having a piece of paper that says 'Vat paid'. Are you purchasing from a business or a private individual?

 

[Dom315]

Buying in Greece

I have bought two boats out there, both from Sunsail and I have also sold and never had need of a lawyer. It is very straight forward. I can put you intouch with a good English surveyor who will also advise. Which company are you buying from?

 

[Tranona]

Can anyone bring me bang up to date re the above. boat is ex charter and is being sold to me "price inc of vat"
also any good lawyers who can do this purchase in or around Levkas for me?

Thanks for any useful info

Deal with the lawyer bit first. You only need their services to remove the boat from the Greek register - a bit tiresome but should be straightforward and you get good evidence of title. Suggest you ask Williams & Smithell (brokers) in Levkas for advice. I paid about 800Euros for legal fees on my boat but it was all handled by Kiriacoulis. Make sure you get the Bill of Sale stamped by the Port Police in Levkas as if you do it in the UK you have to get it notarised and stamped by the Greek embassy. If it is being transferred into joint ownership (as ours was) then both new owners have to be present at the Port Police office. We did ours in Corfu - cheapest bit of the whole process at 3 Euros!

Be very wary of VAT. Greek charter operators reclaim VAT when they buy the boat new and then have to charge VAT on the price they sell it for just like any other transaction. However, they are often not the beneficial owners of the boat - it may be owned by an investor like me. In this case VAT will depend on the nature of the investment contract. If the original owner paid for the whole boat and received an annual "interest" payment then VAT will be calculated on 50% or the original price. If the original buyer (like me) paid a reduced price in return for receiving no income, then the VAT is based on the original contract price. In either case the person to whom ownership is tranferred gets a VAT invoice from the Greek operator who formally "owned" the boat for the correct amount.

In all this, I am making an assumption that the boat is still on the charter register. If it has already been removed and is in private ownership then you will need to satisfy yourself that everything has been accounted for correctly. Be aware that many older boats (coming off the register before around 2002/3) will not have paid VAT but should have a certificate from the authorities that it is considered VAT paid.

In addition you will need a lawyer to handle the re-registration of the EPIRB and DSC as the agent won't re-programme them without an affidavit from the previous owner. No problem if you have it done in the UK!

You can, of course put the boat on the SSR as soon as you get ownership, but you will need to get it measured (expensive) in Greece if you want to put it on Part 1.

Although bureaucratic and slow (allow 4-6 weeks) the process is secure and you will end up with very clear title documentation.

Hope this helps

 

[chrisgee]

thanks for the info. Boat is still on the Greek register and seller is paying for all costs relating to its removal.
I am happy with most of the procedure but want to ensure that the VAT that is paid is paid on the correct value as an example price is say 65000euros inc vat that is 53000 + 12000 vat. I have heard that some sellers would say value the boat at 30000 + vat 6000.00 and pocket the difference ( less vat and less tax to pay!)

 

[Tranona]

thanks for the info. Boat is still on the Greek register and seller is paying for all costs relating to its removal.
I am happy with most of the procedure but want to ensure that the VAT that is paid is paid on the correct value as an example price is say 65000euros inc vat that is 53000 + 12000 vat. I have heard that some sellers would say value the boat at 30000 + vat 6000.00 and pocket the difference ( less vat and less tax to pay!)

In which case you don't need a lawyer - just make sure they do all the transfers properly. I forgot to check the EPIRB. Fortunately they had not programmed the MMSI so that was not a problem.

Yes, be aware that some have a cavalier attitude to VAT. Better to agree a pre-VAT price and make sure the VAT is shown separately. That is what I have - and ensure that the boat details are clear on the invoice. They tend to use the registration number as identity which seems fine as you will get that on the deregistration document so that you can reconcile the VAT payment with the boat.

Also make sure that there is no outstanding finance. For the first 3 years of the charter contract my boat had a mortgage on it, but I have a letter from the bank that the mortgage has been redeemed and they have no further charge. The charge if any will have been registered, but it is better to specifically ask the vendor and get it in writing.

Hope it all goes smoothly.

 

[dt4134]

Better to agree a pre-VAT price and make sure the VAT is shown separately. That is what I have - and ensure that the boat details are clear on the invoice.

Don't know about Greece but I presume it is similar to the UK. It is not a VAT invoice unless VAT is shown separately and the VAT registration number of the vendor is shown.

That's based upon the little VAT notices every VAT registered company in the UK receives from HMRC from time to time. Can't quote the number as I threw it away after de-registering for VAT.

I also remember there being something about having to show the VAT on each item on the invoice.