Boatshare - Anyone done this? Help required

[RIN]

Not a formal syndicate arrangement but two friends sharing the fixed costs of a boat - mooring, servicing, upgrading etc. and paying for the variable costs, fuel etc individually?

We have been discussing this with a couple we are very good friends with. It would enable us to have access to a two cabin 34/36 ft boat for less than the cost of running my 30ft boat.

Its easy to see the attraction but what would be the downside? what problems would we encounter?

We would be using the boat both individually and jointly.

It would be a great help if forumites could comment from either practical experience or undertake a brainstorming session and try and identify as many problems as possible with such an arrangement, and any suggestions for dealing with them. Ideally we would then produce a non legal principles of agreement that could work out how we would deal with each potential problem.


Edit I should have said we are all retired so scheduling weekends would not be problem, but we would need some sort of agreement so we do not turn up to find the boat not there.


So what could go wrong?


Many thanks for your comments

 

[Skysail]

Lots of pluses which are obvious.

Possible minuses:

Different opinions on what gear needs to be fitted or upgraded. This includes cosmetic work, which is easy to forget sight of.

Different opinions on sharing the work,assuming you propose to do some of it yourself.

Working out a calendar to share weekends, and holiday periods.

Rules on what can be left on the boat. We took ALL personal gear home each trip.

Different approaches to cleanliness and how the boat is left.
Who takes responsibility for damage and losses.

By no means least, what happens when one or both of you wants to sell.

I would strongly advise using the RYA form of syndicate agreement for sharing a boat. If you need it, it is too late, but an informal contract is worth even less. It worked well for us and covers most of the bases.

it all depends on the partners, but we were very happy with the approach, particularly when we were all working. You do just as much sailing as a single owner.
.

 

[Tranona]

The RYA information covers most of the major issues, which really revolve around two key factors. The first (and probably more important) is determining whether the partners are compatible - does not mean necessarily they are close buddies, but that their interest in the boat is similar. Such things as the type of boat, area of cruising, attitude to use and maintenance are the main things to look for, plus social compatability if any joint use is envisaged. The second is an agreement that lays out the principles of the partnership. This should include not only responsibilities of each partner, but also the procedure for ending the partnership - either by dissolving or the death of one of the partners.

Many boats are owned by syndicates - often it is not visible to outsiders, and if you can find compatible partners it often allows you to continue boating in a way that would not be possible as an individual owner.

 

[davidej]

Now on my third share (over about 20yrs) with no written agreement.

No serious problems.

You may ask why I am on third - first dissolved when one moved, second when one wanted to upgrade-other didn't.

 

[Firefly625]

I nearly went in with one of my brothers to buy a 36ft'er some years back. Everything seemed perfect, we thought how great it would be, sharing berthing fees, maintenaince costs etc etc and you end up with a boat far bigger than you could perhaps normally afford to buy and run...

So why didn't we do it... well it was down to me. The more I thought about it the more I worried. Trouble is I knew my brother too well. I know he is not the most practical chap so the general maintenance that a boat always needs during the season would fall on me. He is a computer geek so was already working on a the possible installation of a hard drive pc....which TBH doesn't really do it for me.. Also I freely admit I am OCD about cleaning and he isn't.
I didn't like the idea that on a nice weekend if it wasn't your turn, you in effect were boatless. and then he mentioned that of course he would have to always bring his dog as he had no one able to look after it... now I have a dog, but she's small and doesn't moult and doesn't like boats so is looked after by the in-laws, his Labrador is big and moults a lot....

The more I thought about it, the more I realised that I would be happier with a smaller boat that was just mine.. I guess the more easy going your nature is, the easier you will find it.. certainly makes sense on many levels, just wasn't for me.

 

[scubaman]

I've done it together with my brother for 15 years and we are currently looking for our next boat.

It has worked very well. Major factor has been that both try to respect the other one's priorities (which on the whole are quite similar) and try to be considerate towards the other family. Both leave the boat well cleaned after a weekend, etc.

We've never had anything written down, but it can be a good idea to clarify things. Still it's often the little things that begin to annoy and can eventually ruin everything.

Therefore most important thing IMHO would be to have a good long open discussion with the other party about 'what if's' and all the things you can foresee as potential sources of annoyment.

After you've had the discussion, evaluate how open and candid it was and how it made you feel. That will tell you how well you are likely to get on with the co-ownership.

Dr. Phil hat off now...

 

[whisper]

It works for us.

We've had an informal sharing arrangement covering 2 boats during the past 7+ years.
Main plus is that we've both been able to enjoy a far better boat than we would have had, if we owned a boat each.

Very basic written agreement mainly concerned with what happens if one of us wants to terminate the agreement. In our case if for e.g. I wanted out then I am obliged to offer my half to my current partner. Price to be advised by surveyor.
If he doesn't want to or can't pay this, then the boat has to be sold.

Again in our case, I am lucky in that my "partner" rarely uses the boat on his own, we normally go boating together though I also often use the boat solo.
We therefore have a casual arrangement whereby fixed expenses are generally split 50:50. With variable ones such as fuel and maintenance I tend to pay more than 50% as I feel that's only fair because I do the only singlehanding.

Critical in all of this is that we both trust each other implicitly and are pretty laid back about things.

I suspect that such an informal set-up may run into difficulties the greater the number of people involved. It is much harder for 4 people to have a casual trusting arrangement than 2. Interestingly and maybe significantly, neither of our wives are interested in boating, other than for getting a lift down the estuary to Salcombe and back.

Go for it if you are certain that your partner/s will be as honest and relaxed about it as you are. Certainly has enabled us to have more fun than we would have had otherwise.

Good Luck.

 

[omega2]

Our partnership is a three way affair, all blokes and mad keen fishers, the "ladies" have no interest in the boat or the fishing, everything gets split three ways, 10 years with the same boat no plans on changing it either, she meets our needs. No formal papers, just trust each other, a rare event these days. Make sure you know who you are getting tied up with, and you will not know them until you live with them, of course that may be too late.

 

[PowerToSail.com]

The most successful sharing I have witnessed is when a Captain or Guardian is appointed to clean, re-fuel, do small jobs, organise works etc. So the boat is like a glorified hotel room. I would not mind sharing a boat myself, but I would want a 3rd party involved to manage the boat; not always practical on a 30 footer, but certainly on a larger boat or one kept overseas where it may not be possible to go down to the boat regularly to inspect or do routine maintenance.