boat design

[deep denial]

I am wondering whether there is a yacht design, about 30-34 feet, which is both reknowned for seaworthiness and sailing ability, but can also take the ground well. Most bilge- and lifting- keelers lack the seaworthiness. Any thoughts?

 

[Juggler7823]

Moody and Westerly have both made bilge keelers up to 36 foot which sail well

 

[bigwow]

Sounds like you need a catamaran

 

[Helina]

I agree

 

[Twister_Ken]

Northshore Southerly.

Feeling.

Ovni.

A cruising cat.

 

[Blueboatman]

Anything with a couple of beaching legs?

 

[deep denial]

I'd wondered aabout that, but have never used them. How stable are you on legs with a beam wind?

 

[FullCircle]

Kevin,welcome to the forum
What do you mean by lack seaworthiness?
Just asking, as I have a lift keel 13500lbs disp 35 foot with lift keel rated RCD A. AVS 123 degrees, STIX33.49 So what parameters are you basing your judgement on?

 

[bigwow]

No contest here Kevin, as I said before it's got to be a cat, a 35' cat gives you space of a 70' half boat, you do not have to grow one leg longer than the other to stand upright in the cockpit, your bits and pieces do not have to be stowed before leaving your berth, no gimbles required on cooker,you can set down on any available drying bank upright with no problem. The list is endless, go on make the right choice, you know it makes sense!

 

[rwoofer]

[ QUOTE ]
35' cat gives you space of a 70' half boat

[/ QUOTE ]

Rubbish. 35' cat has nowhere near the space of a 70'mono. Probably more like 45'-50' mono.

 

[RupertW]

Even as a cat fan I'd agree there - a 70' mono has 8 times the internal volume as a 35' mono, but a 35' cat will only have perhaps twice the volume, so I think about 50' is right.

Having said that you won't get a saloon half as wide or spacious even on a 70' mono, or quite the same level of privacy as cabins in separate hulls down different staircases.

 

[BobnLesley]

I got taken out on a Fin keeled 34' Moody in the summer of 2004 which would fulfil all of your requirements; it was particularly good at 'taking the ground' though it did tend to lean over quite a bit as the tide went out

 

[bigwow]

Alright perhaps 70' was a little rich, but the other points?

 

[deep denial]

[ QUOTE ]
Kevin,welcome to the forum
What do you mean by lack seaworthiness?
Just asking, as I have a lift keel 13500lbs disp 35 foot with lift keel rated RCD A. AVS 123 degrees, STIX33.49 So what parameters are you basing your judgement on?

[/ QUOTE ]

Old seafaring lore, mostly, and the generally accepted view that bilge keelers don't sail well to windward, and that anything with narrow keel, eg lift keelers, dont heave to well, and lack directional stability

 

[RupertW]

Sorry to disappoint you but my boat has a narrow keel and heave's to very easily and stably.

I wouldn't judge seaworthiness on beating ability alone, although it is important.

 

[graham]

A modern well designed twinkeeler will go almost as well to windward as the same boat with a fin.Re taking the ground it all depends on how often you intend to do this.

Even a bilgekeeler needs calm water to dry out in.drying out in even a small swell can be a frightening experience which can damage the hull and rig .

You need to give more info to get sensible advice on designs eg What you intend to use the boat for ie coastal/ocean/liveaboard or whatever.How many people you will sail with ,what is your budget etc etc.

A sadler 34 twin keel would be a good choice for a boat with good performance and grounding ability.Southerlies with their lifting keels and grounding plates.Most long keel yachts will dry out happilly leaning against a wall or posts.Or on beaching legs.

 

[rwoofer]

I would consider a cat myself as I like performance and shallow draft.

Couple of things have put me off so far:

- berthing costs in marinas. I know the usual answer is to anchor, but that is not always possible and often SWMBO likes to be able to walk ashore etc. And I like to keep the boat at the home port in a marina for security and access for working on the boat
- drying out. I would only go for a cat with daggerboards to get the upwind ability (eg. something like a Catana), but the deliberately light construction means you dare not risk drying out on a rock or somethink.

 

[Helina]

[ QUOTE ]
I would consider a cat myself as I like performance and shallow draft.

Couple of things have put me off so far:

- berthing costs in marinas.

[/ QUOTE ]

When not familiar with circumstances in UK it's difficult to comment but in Finland most harbours have shallow spots where keelboats cannot go so it's possible to negotiate decent prise for a berth like that

 

[FullCircle]

<<Old seafaring lore, mostly, and the generally accepted view that bilge keelers don't sail well to windward, and that anything with narrow keel, eg lift keelers, dont heave to well, and lack directional stability >>


Oh Ok, well I wont try to point in any one direction then.

Except my boat wasnt built when Old seafaring lore was being made, hasnt got a narrow keel, but is lift, and heaves to with some aplomb.

Are you going far then, where will you need the ability to take the ground? My excuse is that I sail in a map of puddles.

 

[kds]

You are not stable on legs in any situation except dead calm, no tide and flat bottom.
Ken