Bayliner boats

Robin

Robin

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Are they poor quality or is the term bin liner not as derogatory as it sounds?

The reason I ask is we are moving to the USA to live aboard a mobo (after 40 some years with flappy things). Our ideal is a trawler type like a Defever 47 or 49, displacement speed stuff with excellent liveaboard features and long range beefy stuff. However a broker we met over there sent info on a Bayliner 4588 Pilothouse that looks like a pleasant appartment and quite a boaty layout except for the full beam saloon and only a side ledge in place of a side deck aft of the cabin. It is also fully cored hull, so lighter but rikier of delamination or water ingress? Engines are Hino (?) 250hp, max speed 14kts, cruise at 10kts but 2gph (USA gallons) at 8kts which is trawler like supping.

What is the word on Bayliners please? The one offered looks very good yet is $100,000 cheaper than an older Defever!
 
Used one frequently in the US a lot of boat for very little money with some clever use of space.

Hino WO6 is a lovely smooth and economical base motor. Sadly the alloy manifold/heat exchanger has been unavailable for good few years, when manifold fails which they are almost designed to do, it is a major PITA. Bayliner Owners Club very active and helpful and they may now have source for new manifolds.
 
Alrob said:
are you sure its not 2 MPG (2GPH seems rather ambitious)
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Oops sorry yes you are right, 4gph (US) so 2 miles per (US) gallon.

I don't know the engine reference, just the HP. The boat is from 1993 but has only 870 hrs on it, it was a NE boat and wintered ashore under cover for 7 months every year.

There is a bigger version too from 2000 with 1850hrs on Cummins 300hp giving 20kts plus but a) we want to cruise at displacement speeds and b) although technically 49ft the real length overall is 52ft because of the overhanging pulpit and our chosen marina has a limit at 50ft.
 
I can only speak about my newish 285, but we've found it ace. I can't afford the Fairline Targa / Princess V of my choice (swmbo has refused my suggestions of how she could help raise funds) but the 285 gets us out on the water, goes like stink, keeps the family safe, not let us down and nothings ever fallen off!!

Yes it's not built like a product 3 times the price but it's a hell of a lot better built than any caravan I've ever been in!!

The only down size to a cheaper boat is the mooring fees cost the same as the very expensive Norweigan boat moored next to us!! ;)
 
Bayliner owner here and I would agree they are not as strong in the hull as the more expensive boats but they keep the water out just as well as any other hull, if you hit it off something hard enough to hole it chances are you will have holed any other hull unless it is steel or done serious damage.

Fit and finish is fine if it is looked after and not abused

the only down side is that, on plaining boats they tend to catch some air in rough seas and slam hard when they come down, but as your buying a trawler hull that wont affect you
 
Thanks all, all useful information. The Bayliner 4588 Pilothouse the broker told us about is I believe a modified V hull, capable of planing but engined for semi-displacement speeds and some 400 were sold in the USA. The pilothouse and extended flybridge gives it a sort of trawler look see pic below. However the trawlers we have on our wish list are deeper with a keel that protects the props and rudders, heavy build and with a couple of 135hp engines to run at displacement speeds only. The attraction is a nice liveable layout, we like the pilot house and at $100,000 to $150,000 less that adds to the niceness whilst worrying about potential longevity!

2218878_1.jpg
 
I've had several (smaller) Bayliners and never had any issues. I particularly love the 285 which is the most popular model and has survived many changes in the Bayliner product range.

I see Bayliner as more "factory built" boats, with more visible GRP and less wood. To me, it means that I can maintain them in perfect condition without costing the earth. They use many parts from larger boats, from the engine, tabs, heads etc down to the Perko hinges and screws.

In the past - 80's I think - there were quality issues. As previously suggested, check the Bayliner Owners Club forum for information on what to buy, and what to avoid.

Back to this forum, the problem here is that Bayliners are like Bavarias. Except that they don't have keels. Or should that be, because they don't have keels? You get the point... people like to mock things that seems to be better value than what they paid for it.
 
Some local boaters here have imported the 32' and 38' version of that series, and besides what Latestarter mentioned with the manifold/heat exchangers, the little Hino's appear to be a robust engine.
The amount and use of space in both of these examples is great, and the hulls slip through the water very nicely.

They appear to represent a lot of boat for very little money.
 
As a previous owner and fan I agree with everything that has been said, the lighter hull is great for fuel economy, they design strength in stringers.

The only extra comments I would add

In the UK Bayliners often go for 30%-40% less than asking price so start with a cheeky offer.

And where the quality is acceptable for price and holiday use I would expect you to have a lot of petty DIY repairs with ongoing upgrades needed to cupboard fixings, glueing screws into chipboard etc, live aboard use will really test the fabrics and fittings .
 
We would be buying in the USA rather than over here. We have personally examined several trawlers from Defever (favourite) and Grand Banks and so on but not seen the Bayliner in the flesh, but the layout looks good for living. I don't like the lack of a side deck aft, there is a ledge and a long grabrail to shuffle along but really the way from front to back when line handling would be through the pilothouse and cabin. However for living on in both hot and cold climes it looks OK. The interior isn't as yottie as a trawler and my guess is the finish is OK but not exceptional. Engine access through the cabin floor is a downside compared to the Defevers with walk in standing headroom engine rooms!

Difficult call because the plus points are lower price and/or younger versus higher build quality and older. We are not quite ready to buy anyway, but need to have a good idea of what we want (make and model) so that when we are ready we can move fast.

One definite plus is the lack of exterior teak and teak decks compared to a Defever or Grand Banks. Aside from the maintenance angle of loads of teak handrails etc, teak decks on both the Defevers and GBs are known problem areas and costly to fix. If we buy one it will be one with the teak decks removed or on younger Defevers without them from new.
 
What year model DeFevers are you looking at?

If you go back to the mid 80's say, the old girls are usually pretty tired by now.

As a live a board the Angel 56 is a huge boat for low dollars, with a couple of lay-out options, make a decent passagemaker also. Powered by a couple of naturally aspirated V8 Cats, purring at a mere 210 HP.
The extensively used dark teak is a little gloomy, but some may like it.

Happy hunting.
 
We have personally seen two 1988 Defever 49s (now sold) that were genuinely better than new and have information on another 1987 private sale one which on paper and pics tops the lot but is very pricey, like $330,000. That one is a northern USA boat dry stored 7 months per year under heated cover and currently laid up whilst the owners cruise Europe for a few years on their other boat! Whilst it is laid up, they have had the yard strip and epoxy the bottom and Awl grip the whole boat, all modern electronics and exceptionally well equipped for long range cruising when not plugged in to AC power.

We want to stay below 50ft because apart from costs, slips for above that size are not available in our preferred marina and much more limited generally.
 
I did a bit of coastal cruising on a mates DF 49. She was strip planked in 2" mahogany, and powered by twin John Deere 135 hp. She had a lovely motion at sea, slicing through the waves at 10 knots and quite economically.

The refurbed Oz examples (DF 49's), even timber, are asking between 4 and 500K AUD.

The trawler yacht scene in the states appears to have a big following.
 
AndieMac said:
I did a bit of coastal cruising on a mates DF 49. She was strip planked in 2" mahogany, and powered by twin John Deere 135 hp. She had a lovely motion at sea, slicing through the waves at 10 knots and quite economically.

The refurbed Oz examples (DF 49's), even timber, are asking between 4 and 500K AUD.

The trawler yacht scene in the states appears to have a big following.
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Much more of a following than here in the UK which is surprising considering the high price of fuel here when compared to the USA!

The grp version of the DF49 is ideal for what we want but good ones are snapped up quickly, hopefully when our time comes there will be one. The Bayliner looks a possibility on paper but I have nagging doubts, not least about engine access and looking on their owner's forum the model I asked about has had some issues with leaky hull to deck joints.
 
I had a look at a smaller 34' Bayliner here recently (a 3486 Convertible) built in 1988, and shipped here from Florida.
She has two Hino 250 hp diesels, which apparently had only 600 hours on them, and the story was that the boat was previously owned by a (now) elderly couple in the USA who had her for 20 years, mostly just as a houseboat.
The accommodation was well laid out, but it was all very tired and in need of refurbishing - this was perhaps reflected in the price paid (approx US$ 12,000) by the chap who shipped her to Barbados.
The access to the two engines was fairly diabolical, especially to the outboard side of the port engine - the only way of getting to this was via a hatch (from the owner's cabin) in the forward bulkhead of the engine room.
And the saloon floor beams were literally an inch or so above the rocker cover on the port engine (there was no access at all from above on the starboard engine).
I hope that a bigger Bayliner would have better engine access!

But I see what you mean about price for the 4588 Bayliners - I did a search on Yachtworld and found 29 for sale, ranging in asking price from $119k to $ 210k, and generally around $ 160k.

Do you have Nordic Tugs on your list? They seem to be quite nice, look very traditional but with semi-displacement hulls and relatively big engines.
I did a search for them on Yachtworld and found this rather nice ally trawler yacht - she is probably up in the same price bracket (or higher) than the DeFevers though :
http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...rrency=USD&access=Public&listing_id=1675&url=

Here is the cheapest Nordic Tug currently on YW - 42', built in 1995, and US$ 250k:
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1995/Nordic-Tugs--2203679/Kake/AK/United-States

I was going to suggest one of the older 46' Nordhavns, but they all seem to be rather expensive as well - here is one from 1990 for $ 360k, but she is in Seattle....
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1990/Nordhavn--2168705/Seattle/WA/United-States
 
I would really love a Nordhavn 46! We looked one over at a UK boatshow, single engined plus a wing spare with a saildrive. WOW that is a SHIP! However unless the exchange rate improves dramatically or we win the lottery it is out of the question.

We haven't looked at Nordic Tugs but I will now, thanks. We did look at Krogens but they had problems with osmosis and wet core materials I heard and the ones we looked at also had teak deck problems.

I found a pic of engine 'access' on a Bayliner 4580 and it is dreadful, I think on balance it isn't for us.
 
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