Azimut 42 or 46

[novatec1]

I currently own a Searay Sundancer (30'). I am looking to upgrade to an Azimut 42 or 46. I agree that the Azimut has a beautiful interior and exterior. My major concern is how the boat handles once at sea.

Please provide input as to boat handling in good and rough seas.

Thanks



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[NYJohnB]

I have an Azimut 68 Plus, but have met a number of other Azimut owners including 42 and 46. FWIW, several of them run those model boats back and forth from New York to Florida themselves and have told me they were quite seaworthy in rough conditions.

I am very happy we purchased an Azimut.

John B

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[novatec1]

Thank you for the reply.

I have an aquaintance that just sold an AZ46 2000 and he complained of handling problems on the Great Lakes in Michigan and complained that he thought the beam was not wide enough and that the props are too close together. He also stated that he had a hard time getting support from the Azimut.

Have the newer models been improved in this aspect or anyone heard about these issues or experienced problems when having to resolve a problem with the vessel because the company is out of Italy?


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[NYJohnB]

Re: support issues, it appears to be more of a dealer issue than Azimut - at least in my experience. Plus many of the systems are not Azimut for support - i.e. MTU for the Diesels, ZF for the transmissions, Cruisair for the heating and cooling, etc. These are coordinated through the dealer, but service for these are direct.

For other items it is the dealer that has to address and in my case they have addressed any issues, but not always as quick as I'd like. However, these items have mostly been really small stuff.

Azimut seem quite proactive. I have met factory reps on the engineering side as well as head of sales for North America - both from Italy. I got the distinct impression that if I ever had a big issue I could go directly to them.

They are doing another rendezvous in Manhattan this June and I am sure will have representatives again.

If you are serious about the boat and are concerned about the handling, the easiest solutionn is to get a sea trial. If there is no sea trial available I would have concerns about the dealer. I believe it is not too hard to go straight to Italy to see how the boats are built and get a sea trial as well. For the kind of capital outlay you are looking at a sea trial is not something you could be denied if you ask.

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[Deleted User YDKXO]

Novatec, firstly welcome to the forum. I've just recently bought a 2000 model Azimut 46 in Spain and we carried out trials in rough sea conditions in the Mediteranean and I was quite happy with the handling at sea. The hull is a medium to deep V and is very similar to other well respected hulls from other European builders like Fairline and Princess
Obviously, the boat is a cruising boat not a race boat so the hull has to be a compromise between offering good seakeeping and good accomodation. The hull will slam into a big head sea just like any other cruising boat of similar size but if you dont like it, you just slow down. In fact, at 12-14knots, my boat felt quite comfortable head on into 6-8 ft seas. I tried my boat beam on and in a following sea and found no particular vices
The one thing I was a bit dissapointed with was the top speed. My boat achieved 27.5knots flat out with full fuel and water tanks and clean hull/props whereas I was hoping for nearer 30knots
I dont really understand your friend's comments about not being beamy enough or having props too close together. The beam is again comparable to other similar boats. The props are in tunnels; the upside of this is that the propshaft angle can be a little flatter than a conventional hull for better propulsion efficiency but the downside is that the section of hull between the tunnels acts like a small keel which may mean that the boat is a little slow to turn at speed but this is more a characteristic than a problem. What is for certain is that no 46' cruiser is going to turn as quick as your 30' sports boat
The one criticism I have as regards the handling is the poor seating on the flybridge. The helm seat is non-adjustable and offers very little support so you really have to hang on to the steering wheel in rough conditions. In addition there are very few handholds for crew sitting in the other seats. I know that US boats like Searays tend to offer much better helm seating than Euro boats so this is something you'll have to decide for yourself whether you can live with
In the end, the only way you can find out whether the seakeeping is acceptable to you is to arrange an extended sea trial in rough conditions
I cant comment on Azimut service in the US but in Europe, I believe they are better than average

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[jfm]

Hey mike congrats on new boat, you did it, well done. Hope all is well with it. Which marina are you parking it in?

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[novatec1]

Thank you for all of the wonderful help. Currently I am working with a rep from Allied Richard Bertram in Florida. From what I understand they are the largest rep for Azimut in the US. I will be vacationing in Italy in July and I would hope to arrange a sea trial while there.

Meanwhile, congradulations on your vessel. May your journeys be enjoyable and your maintenance worry free.

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[Deleted User YDKXO]

Re: Azimut 46

Thanks, John. Boat is moored in Denia which is'nt quite the same as SoF but the previous owner has done me a good deal on renting his berth so it looks like I'll be there for at least a season.
Boat seems fine. The previous owner did not spend much time on her and when he did, it was mainly for entertaining so the oily bits have only done 130hrs and the engines are still under warranty anyway for another year. She's got all the essential gizmos including a big gennie and full aircon and, fingers crossed, it all seems to work

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[gcwhite]

The best sea keeping boats of this size are Fairlines either a Phantom 42, 43 or 46 would do very well. They all have "Osilenski" (excuse the spelling) hulls which have an outstanding reputation.

Do not buy a Sealine; they are very skittish in heavy seas in my experience.

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[Deleted User YDKXO]

Thats a big statement. What about the Princesses which also have Olesinski hulls or Sunseekers which have Don Shead hulls, some of which are race boat derived. Also not fair on Sealine. Many of their hulls in this size range are John Bennett designed and he also has an excellent reputation.

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[novatec1]

I am also looking at the Fairline Phantom 42 or 46, any opinions on those boats in comparison to the Azimut line.

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[adarcy]

Re: Fairline 42 or 46

Hi,
If you go to the magazine pages here MBY anyway ? MBM then you can purchase reprints of their tests of these boats. Just be sure the dates are right for the models (eg Princess have had 2 45s OK 10 years apart but you know what I mean) I think they have tested both of these current models and speak quite highly of them. That is not to denigrate Azimut, in fact the Az is more like an American boat than the Fairlines. These have a deeper vee forward so handle rough seas at higher speeds more comfortable with less slamming. OTOH the Az and yanks being flatter are sl faster for the same power. But the Fairlines have snappier speedboat-like handling - choices choices!

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[jfm]

Re: Azimut 46

Good stuff Mike, glad it's all going well. You should post some pics of the front cabin wardrobe (perhaps put in a load of shoe racks first) to make Pauline jealous.

No need to remind me of my predicament with your statement "it all seems to work" Actually ours is now nearly all working. I collected it from the fixers in La Rague Saturday morning and the big stuff (eg airco) is now working well. Still has a f%*king gold tap in one of the bathrooms though......

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[Jim44]

Please explain what experinces you have had to make the Sealine comment. How many have you owned? Do you own a boat?

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[adarcy]

On Scutbutt 8/3/04 Ile de Re thread he/she said

I have a 16m motor yacht...................

But I was wondering along your line of thought so I went and searched his/her posts

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Re: Azimut 46

No thanks, I have my own Pauline when it comes to shoes and clothing, thanks very much!
Sounds like you're having a bit of trouble with the Sq58, John?

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[Deleted User YDKXO]

Re: Fairline 42 or 46

Not entirely true, adarcy. The AZ46, at least, has a similar deadrise to a Fairline or Princess at about 19degrees at the transom so I cant imagine the forward V is much different. The boat doesnt feel any different at sea either to a typical Fairline/Princess
You're right about US boats though. Boats like Searays and Carvers appear to have flatter hulls

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[adarcy]

Re: Fairline 42 or 46

Mike

You may be entirely right about the deadrise at the transom but I seem to remember MBY commenting on Meddy style boats (Baia, Feretti and I thought Azimut) as having less deadrise forward when compared with Olesinski and Shead hulls (F'line, Princess and S'seeker).

I accept steep vee all the way back is VG for offshore work but takes so much HP that "all" leisure boats are semi-vee at best in the aft 1/3 but I still thought that there was a difference (even if only in emphasis) between Meddy + USA versus UK in the forward 1/3 or 1/2.

Anthony

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[Deleted User YDKXO]

Re: Fairline 42 or 46

The MBY test on the AZ46 in 1998 (I dont have a copy to hand unfortunately) commented that the hull designs of the major European manufacturers had converged to such an extent that the sea performance of the AZ46 was indistinguishable from the other major builders like Fairline and Princess. Or words to that effect.
In fact I was told that Olesinski has a hand in the design of the Azimut hulls although I've never seen a credit to him in any of their literature
It seems that everyone in Europe is standardizing on a variable deadrise medium to deep V hull of roughly the same proportions and if you think about it that makes sense because, for example, Fairline would not want to design a significantly deeper V hull than Azimut because, as you point out, they'd need to fit bigger engines to drive it or accept a reduced speed and that would put them at a disadvantage in the market. This is borne out by the fact that both the Phantom 46 and the AZ46 have engines in the range of 450-500hp each and both boats make about 30knots max so it suggests that the hull design is similar
There certainly appears to be a difference though between Euro boats and US cruiser boats like Searays. I've noticed that length for length, Searays seem to have smaller engines and yet still appear to hit the magical 30knots. This does suggest that their hulls are flatter although I could be talking total bollox!


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