Are we losing touch with the essence of boats ?

[Guest]

Ships Navigator for 17 yrs, been on boats literally all my life - I'm 48 now.

I use Notebook PC for charting + work and also a PDA for work.

Most boaties are motoring / sailing from marina / mooring to next pub location etc. A fancy boat shaped cursor moving across a screen image is about really all thats really needed + a few details such as speed / course and time to pub.

Yes there are also those that travel a bit further than Chichester Harbour to Folly Inn ..... (for non UK boaties - thats Solent on South UK Coast) .... And then all the finery's and details about plotting etc. take on serious value.

Me ? A small screen plotter of 5" .... would certainly see me through most I need ...... I have negotiated channels and rocks with my PC and Seaclear far easier than all the traditional methods I was taught over many years at sea ....

I can still use a sextant, still have my Texas Ti59 Celestial Nav calculator, Nories and the better Burtons tables, Air Nav Sight Reduction tables etc. etc. But they are now collecting dust in some far away corner of my UK nest.

I take boating seriously with a definite slice of humour and as it comes ..... why be so uptight and make it so difficult or complicated ?? What ever happened to the old ways where people actually enjoyed themselves and relaxed on boats ..... it all seems to be tied up with wallets, electronic gadgetry, and latest toy .....
So many boats all look the same without character ... that goes for cars as well !! - what happened ??

Does anyone cast off and take a leisurely sail to another haven now ? You - know a trip to the pub or beach etc. without plotting / marking / detailing every little bit and bob that may be seen / unseen on the way ?? ....

Seems that the more I read - the more I realise that the spirit is not in boats as it used to be ..... so come on prove me wrong .....


<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gps-navigator/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/searider/

 

[ShipsWoofy]

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>

So many boats all look the same without character ... that goes for cars as well !! - what happened ??

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Consulants and accountants.

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.topcatsail.co.uk>Woof</A>

 

[Robin]

Does this count?

Probably, weather permitting we will leave Poole Friday pm and have a leisurely sail to Lymington, most likely just using the roller genoa (tailwind forecast). We may slow down (roll the genoa away) over Christchurch ledge to see if there is a dinner sized bass or two about. The plotter/GPS will be on but from habit rather than necessity though it will show when the tide has turned our way since we will probably go against the tide as far as Hurst.

If that option is spoiled by the potential for strong (ie F4 +) headwinds for a Sunday return then we may just use the genny alone to go fishing off Old Harry and cook the catch on the Barbie in Swanage or Studland.


The catch is that by writing this I have already complied with the new SOLAS regs by having a pre-considered passage plan!


<hr width=100% size=1><font size=1>Sermons from my pulpit are with tongue firmly in cheek and come with no warranty!</font size=1>

 

[ChrisE]

Woofy, well at least us consultants can spell!

Nigel, don't fret there's still enough of us out there who just sail for the fun of it. If I'm honest I rarely even open the Almanac for most weekend trips, although I wouldn't be without my PC based tidetables. The toys are fun and, as you say, useful for serious passages but if you're just footling about then they can stay in their box.

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[RupertW]

I find it all a bit baffling - I worked for years designing computer systems and went sailing partly to get away from the technology.

I do use a handheld GPS if it's foggy, or I'm out of sight of land, or I'm beating against a tide and want to know VMG over the ground. Otherwise it doesn't seem much effort to use compass, echo sounder and paper charts and an almanac. Wind indicators, logs which never really work, radar and chartplotters seem nice but hassly to maintain and power.

On most marina to marina trips even echo sounders are superfluous, although I wouldn't rush to repeat a season on an old triple keeler where I used a long boathook to test the depth - very effective on crossing shoals but a bit physical.

I've also seen people rely so utterly on fancy screen combinations that they navigated outside marked rocky channels because the picture told them it was safe, and were devastated by a powerdown even though they could see two islands, one headland and two lighthouses.





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[Guest]

Re: Does this count? - Certainly !

Fantastic ....... boating for pleasure and not one-upmanship !!

Long may you continue to enjoy .....



<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gps-navigator/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/searider/

 

[Guest]

Exactly ......

It seems that so many are involved in one-upmanship - that enjoyment of boating has gone by the wind !! (apologies for pun)

My UK boat is scruffy, small, heavy, needs new sails, needs a good refit, smells a bit of diesel in bilges after engine change etc., BUT I enjoy every minute of her. There have been frantic waves and comments of ..... can you berth alongside the other chap please etc. etc. Who cares - thats their loss .....

I look with envy at the new boats with all their gizmos, I look at the crews and owners and you know what I see .... more smiling faces from cheaper, lets go for sail types like mine than most of these fancy expensive jobs ....

Sorry - but when I leave the berth .... I have an idea of where I'm going and normally call someone to say I arrived or call at a n agreed time so no-one worries .... but I don't always keep to initial destination .... anyone who's sailed with me can expect anything - literally !! I do not cast all in stone and then dog it out .... Life is too short to waste the moments ..... and sailing free can reward with some lifes best ....


<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gps-navigator/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/searider/

 

[Becky]

I started in dinghys, where you pushed the boat ino the water, pulled up the sails, and just went. Now I still want to do the same thing. But we have to have a passage plan. HWMBO teaches navigation, the shore-based yachtmaster course, so we have it all on; the chartplotter, the appropriate chart, and often the magic road at the helm. Me, well I have a tendency to just sail like I used to if on my own. Which is allowed in the Solent. Further distances, I would get it all out, and set up a passage plan. But I really like the sailing, the rest is necessary (and can be very interesting), but is done downstairs where you can't feel the wind etc. So, yes, I miss the simple side of sailing. But I wouldn't swap my chartplotter for an RDF set and try and find Cherbourg like we used to have to do. It isn't all bad, just so much easier the challenge has gone.
I don't know how many of those on line today are sneaking little breaks from work, but I am stuck here (at home) awaiting delivery of our new anchors. Frustrating, I could have been sailing!

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[RupertW]

Re: Exactly ......

Couldn't agree more - my current boat is much smaller, cheaper, older and grubbier than anything I've sailed in years. My wife and I talked about how sailing cheaply in our twenties seemed more fun, so why didn't we get something we could just untie and point out to sea. It's been great so far, and perhaps I'll soon get round to getting the cooker and water pump working, or perhaps I'll just keep doing daysails each time I go down to do some maintenance.

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[Sea Devil]

Like Becky I am sitting waiting instead of sailing. My transmission to be fixed...

I used to navigate by DR and a sextant - arriving at a headland was exciting as was deciding if it was the right headland...
Trouble is that since inexpensive GPS arrived there is no reason not to use it. In fact it is plainly irresponcible not to use it... but I do miss the excitement and challange of the old days but they are gone for ever.

Mind you seamanship has not really changed nor the challange. GPS Just made it all a bit safer. More and more people sail further and further and expience the joy of visiting far away places with strange sounding names.........

<hr width=100% size=1>http://www.michaelbriant.com/sailing

 

[Mirelle]

A good point - here is one answer

I should make it clear that the following remarks relate to pottering round the coasts of Essex, Suffolk and Kent in a pre-war gaff cutter that I have owned for 20 years, with a wife, a 9 year old and a 2 year old. That is to say, what we do is typical gentle family cruising. Until the children are older, this is pretty much the sailing that I expect to be doing, so the question is - how to get the most out of it?

The echo sounder packed up two years ago, and I have not got round to doing anything about it, as I find the lead line perfectly adequate. No VHF, either. There is a plumbed in GPS but it lives in a cupboard over the chart table, so I can, and do, leave the door shut and forget about it. Our paper charts are up to date and the binnacle compass is corrected to a 2 degree error, which I ignore.

I am tending to make less and less use of the engine, and if we can get in a weekend's sailing, from dropping the swinging mooring near the head of a narrow estuary with a bar at the mouth to picking it up again, without using the engine, I count it a bit of a triumph.

We have not been into a marina for three years. We do not have an outboard,but we do have a sailing tender.

What I have found is that my sailing ability has been improving hand over fist (I've only been making the same mistakes for 35 years, now!) and I am enjoying it much more. The satisfaction of digging out a ghoster, rather than starting the engine, in a calm, is immense.

This approach will not suit everyone, but it certainly suits us.

<hr width=100% size=1>Que scais-je?

 

[Windfall]

<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>

Does anyone cast off and take a leisurely sail to another haven now ? You - know a trip to the pub or beach etc. without plotting / marking / detailing every little bit and bob that may be seen / unseen on the way ?? ....

<hr></blockquote>

Yep pretty much whenever we can. Now we have small ones nearly all our sailing is in the Solent and passage planning involves a look at the tide table and an ear for the forecast. As for navigating on the way...well largely we can see where we're going (and if we can't we aren't out there) and HWMO has been sailing in the Solent for ever...

The boat is a beaten up 70's cruiser racer beautiful but tatty...30' long but tiny in comparison to modern boats...We are re-fitting but there comes a time and this year we sailed with the galley templates instead of the finished article because we just couldn't wait any longer....

I'm sure one day she will be finished and shiny.....one day I'll have lots of electronic gizmos at my fingertips (we do have a handheld GPS in a cupboard somewhere....) but in the meantime we're just enjoying ourselves /forums/images/icons/smile.gif.

Long may it last




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[Guest]

Re: A good point - here is one answer

Excakerly ....

My 1/4 tion boat in Estonia has a small 4hp outboard that stays in the locker. We sail out of and into her marina berth in the Olympic Marina.

When I first bought her - I was not so happy to do this, but the son of the seller who is an excellent skipper basically said don't worty and watch me .... We turned her around by hand from being bows onto the quay, raised sail, sheeted in and ahuled on the bow to buoy line to get a bit of way under her .... boy she flew out of there as clean as anything.
Later I bought the outboard and tried my way ..... I had more trouble then when we did it without !!
Sailing skills are forgotten with non-use and it takes a while to get 'em back again ....

I now intend to increase more and more the use of sails and less gadgetry in my years left to enjoy this fantastic pastime.

Good on you - Mirelle


<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gps-navigator/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/searider/

 

[ChrisE]

Re: Does this count? - Certainly !

Isn't there a tad bit of one-downmanship going on here?

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[Guest]

See - all is not lost ....

I am so glad to see that I am not a dying breed .....

There are still those out there that look upon sailing as getting away from it all ..... the rat-race and all the palaver that modern living seems to dictate.

Can we start a new Club ?? The 'Casual Cruisers Club' ????


<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gps-navigator/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/searider/

 

[dralex]

I love just sailing for the sake of sailing, I don't even care about a destination some days. I never tire of putting the sails up, turning off the engine, sheeting in and then just sailing- the only technology I love is the autohelm because it means if I'm on my own, I can sit up on the rail and just watch the water going by ( please- no comments about safety etc). Whatever is going on ashore, it just melts away when I'm on the boat. One of the biggest pleasures for me is helming on my own with the sun coming up and with a mug of tea. Simple stuff, but it makes me smile.

Technology should be complimentary- the key is knowing when you need to use it. I have radar and it's only been used twice this year, but when it was switched on, it adds reassurance. It's also nice sailing with no mobile phone and with the VHF switched off- sailing is my escape.

In answer to the question- no, I don't think we're losing touch with the essence of boats, just getting a bit carried away with toys at times.

<hr width=100% size=1>Life's too short- do it now./forums/images/icons/wink.gif

 

[zefender]

Re: Casual cruising?

Er I think your purpose might possibly be misunderstood!

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[tcm]

Re: You\'re lucky

right well my boat hasn't been cleaned EVER, the engine's knackered, the steering is very heavy, the interior all poky with no facilities, the sail very ancient, and we moor in mud for nothing. Whereas everyone else these days seems to have fancy contraptions to make cups of tea at the drop of a hat and they keep their latest purchase of fancy biscuits in oh-so-clever tins with matching lids onnem, tsk. But are they happy? I don't think so!

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[Guest]

Some years ago ....

The Yachting World I think it was had an article called :

Small Boats go Further ...... or something like that.

It highlighted chats between mag people and boat owners / crews while walking around various harbours / marinas etc. There were examples of a couple of Students working their way around the south coast in a Hardy 20 ...... taking bar jobs / odd jobs to pay for the next tank of fuel and food etc. They were travelling from SE corner to Scilly Ilses if I remember rightly.
Another was a small sailboat of about 25ft ..... crossing channel etc. etc. and rarely sitting idly on its mooring .... hardly a w/end would go by without logging in some sea-miles.
BUT on the other hand .... bigger boats were sitting unused in marinas - waiting for crews and thw owners to organise themselves .... some interviews even went so far to say that they hadn't moved the boat for that season or even season before ...... it was too much trouble to get all crew down, boat readied etc. etc.

SAD isn't it .......

Evolution is a necessary thing - no-one argues about that, but enjoying what you pay for etc. is also a good thing ....

I think that article could be written now and it would be interesting to see any differences .... if any !


<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gps-navigator/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/searider/

 

[jenku]

Re: See - all is not lost ....

I am in. I also use my boat partly to get away from computers and communication devices at work (and home) so I even threw out the battery. Instead I now have room for two more bag-in-boxes of wine.
However I do have a handheld GPS (which I mainly use as a log and to avoid the occasional invisible offshore skerry) and an outboard. I try to use the engine as little as possible, but had to use it a couple of times this season due to calms (I know, I am trying to learn the "coffee and wait"-thing).

<hr width=100% size=1>http://www.sail.to/alacrity