Any lawyers out there? US boat builder owes us money

Neil_Y

Neil_Y

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www.h4marine.com
I'm guessing this won't be easy, but who knows until you ask.

A regular (one boat a year) customer of ours has failed to pay an invoice since June, goods were sent before payment as a gesture of goodwill, as we were out of the office at a show when we should have shipped, and never had payment problems in the past.

What worries me more is the failure to get any real response apart from " I'll talk to accounts " and no response from recent phone calls or emails. So any body know what my options might be, I'm almost tempted to hop on a plane and do a face to face approach. It would almost still be worth it if the flight cost £ 1100.

It's close to 2k so might be nice to have before Christmas.

Having lost money when Dickies went under I should have known better?

Thanks for any suggestions or experience from over the pond.
 
My ex was a lawyer; she always said that lawsuits are to expensive to pursue if the amount is small.

If it was GBP 2M... go for it. Otherwise, go for small claims court.

GL
 
I don't think you have a prayer of recovering the money through the US legal system because doubtless the customer will file a counter claim for some spurious reason and then your legal costs will far exceed the debt. I suspect that your only course of action would be to keep making yourself a nuisance. Find out the names of the top managers and keep calling them personally. You could always threaten exposing them on social media as bad payer; most companies don't like adverse publicity. You need to consider this as well; it is possible that the company is not paying you because it has financial problems and in those cases it is usually the supplier who shouts loudest who gets paid. As you say, you don't want to end up as another Dickies creditor
 
The US system does have small claims through district courts, less than $10,000 claims but it seems if it goes to court I'd have to be there. At least being a Ltd company I would not need an attorney and could represent myself.

Thanks for all the comments.
 
Neil_Y said:
The US system does have small claims through district courts, less than $10,000 claims but it seems if it goes to court I'd have to be there. At least being a Ltd company I would not need an attorney and could represent myself.

Thanks for all the comments.
Click to expand...

With flights and accommodation and the possibility of losing the case could end up with your losses doubling.
Is it really worth it?

Also, would the dispute be heard in a U.S. court?
 
It's unusual for a company just not to pay a valid invoice, so I suspect there's something more. Is there any dispute over the invoice? Did the circumstances of you shipping it mean you didn't get a purchase order or at least an order number? Big companies often can't handle payments for goods that don't go through their normal PO system, so they keep getting kicked into the long grass. Are you already set up as a supplier, if not then again it may be a system issue that they need some company info from you. The other reason of course maybe that they are in financial trouble.

I'd second Deleted User's advice, push the problem up to higher management and make a real PITA of yourself. Each time you contact someone, send them all the relevant details to make it easier for them to resolve it. Don't get on a plane, that's just throwing good money after bad.
 
Neil_Y said:
I'm guessing this won't be easy, but who knows until you ask.

A regular (one boat a year) customer of ours has failed to pay an invoice since June, goods were sent before payment as a gesture of goodwill, as we were out of the office at a show when we should have shipped, and never had payment problems in the past.

What worries me more is the failure to get any real response apart from " I'll talk to accounts " and no response from recent phone calls or emails. So any body know what my options might be, I'm almost tempted to hop on a plane and do a face to face approach. It would almost still be worth it if the flight cost £ 1100.

It's close to 2k so might be nice to have before Christmas.

Having lost money when Dickies went under I should have known better?

Thanks for any suggestions or experience from over the pond.
Click to expand...
Yankeeland is currently on full shut down for Thanksgiving Day holiday ( today 27th Nov ) and tomorrow is the mania of Black Friday, the big day of sales events. Many people will be out of town for a week visiting family all over the US and lots of these will also live in the currently frozen northern states where travel is a big problem .

Give it a try in another week and you might get lucky!
 
Thanks for the thanksgiving period advice, I hadn't realised it was quite such a big event! I'm hoping it's just a purchase/order/invoice that didn't fit their normal procedure (as they wanted parts quickly!!) I've supplied them for 6 or 7 years now. Next week the campaign to get the money starts in earnest.
 
I totally agree Nick's comments about understanding customer's PO system

After that, the very first thing to ask, but you haven't stated it, is what law governs the contract? Surely it is UK?. If it is, forget planes and US courts. Just issue proceedings in a UK court, small claims track. Then THEY have to get on a plane, or at least enter a defence, or lose.

Of course, when you've won, you only have a judgement not cash, and you're £84 down in court fees, plus transmission costs in serving the proceedings on them. But your hand is now much stronger in that you are pursuing recovery of a debt confirmed by a court court judgement, as opposed to seeking to prove they owe you the money in the first place. They will have a CCJ against them and you can make that widely know, which will make it hard for them to trade in the UK.

If they're bust, you have no hope
 
jfm said:
I totally agree Nick's comments about understanding customer's PO system

After that, the very first thing to ask, but you haven't stated it, is what law governs the contract? Surely it is UK?. If it is, forget planes and US courts. Just issue proceedings in a UK court, small claims track. Then THEY have to get on a plane, or at least enter a defence, or lose.

Of course, when you've won, you only have a judgement not cash, and you're £84 down in court fees, plus transmission costs in serving the proceedings on them. But your hand is now much stronger in that you are pursuing recovery of a debt confirmed by a court court judgement, as opposed to seeking to prove they owe you the money in the first place. They will have a CCJ against them and you can make that widely know, which will make it hard for them to trade in the UK.

+they're bust, you have no hope
Click to expand...

Ref customer's PO system: 100 years ago I used to earn a crust sorting out the mess left behind when one particularly ginormous multinational with more money than a small country couldn't organise payments to its suppliers and they were often forced into direct action.
 
A well worded letter detailing the debt with a reluctance but necessary movement to Small Claimes Court with all expenses in having to do so would probably work well.

Surprising how this loosens the purse strings.

Make sure it is sent registered and signed for.

Tom.
 
We used to use debt collectors in the USA - no win no fee - fees were something like 40 odd per cent, and they got something about half the time.

The UK allows Statutory Demands to be made for debts over £750 that if not satisfied mean the company enters liquidation. As long as the transaction is simple and uncontested ( i sent you goods, you have not paid) then they do work .

I googled for the US equivalent but could not see anything, it may not exist or the terminology maybe different
 
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