Anchor size?

guydickinson

guydickinson

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The previous owner of this 34ft 9000lb Van de Stadt Legend I now have(!) changed the 24 lb CQR for a 32lb one and kept the 24 as a spare. Unfortunately the bigger one is a really tight fit though the pulpit, doesn't fit on the deck fittings (not surprisingly) and is v heavy...so does anyone think the 24 would be big enough?!!
 
The previous owner obviously thought 24lb wasn't big enough and bought bigger!

BTW genuine drop-forged CQRs would have a weight of 25lbs or 35lbs, but Simpson Lawrence sold cheaper cast plough copies which were identified I think by being stamped with slightly lower weights than the original, so are yours forged or cast?

If you want to sleep soundly at anchor I would suggest you find a way of living with the bigger option, maybe leave it stowed on the bow roller?
 
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<span style="color:blue"> 34ft 9000lb Van de Stadt Legend so does anyone think the 24 would be big enough?!! </span>

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For this size of boat, I will suggest a 15 kg (33 lb) anchor.. 24 lbs should be too small, including with the "new generation" ones..
 
Big enough for what?

Congratulations first though on acquiring your Legend - they certainly are attractive boats, and have a very good reputation (like just about every Van de Stadt design).

With my pedantic hat on, re the 32 lb CQR being 'very heavy', that might be because it is 35 lbs..... I am not aware of any 32 lb CQR's (or 24 - but they do make a 25 lb).

Re the 35lb anchor being a tight fit through the pulpit, I am guessing that it is too big to stow in your bow roller? If it is, it could be worthwhile considering getting a larger bow roller.

I would definitely prefer a 35 lb over a 25 lb CQR as a bower anchor for a 4 (or probably closer to 5) tonne vessel. Have you got room on the foredeck to install a small capstan type windlass? Even a simple manual windlass can pull a lot more than an average human, and with less chance of doing your back in.

Keep the 24 lb CQR as a kedge. You could perhaps also investigate all these other new types of anchors on the market and see if one of them might be more suitable re getting it through the pulpit. There are various very active threads on here discussing their relative merits.

We have a 35 lb CQR as our bower anchor, and we are very happy with it.

BTW, I was told (by an old ham radio friend David Jolly G3TJY) that CQR anchors were invented by a gentleman by the name of Taylor just before WW II, and they were manufactured by the Secure Anchor Company..... David was their General Manager at the time.
 
I have heard the same on the origins of the CQR and also that they where origionally desiged as a very light but hight holding power anchor for sea planes that ,naturally wanted to keep wt to a minimum.

Agree with the above 25lb is a kedge for a boat that size, in fact I would say if you can recover your ground takle without a windlass on a 34ft boat it is seriously underpowered.

Its worth remembering that ground takle is part of the SAFETY inventory and should be able to hold the boat off a lee shore in the worst weather you might encounter so the main bower should be serious stuff.

That said for ease of handling there is no reason not to set up the kedge ona light warp (eg 20m 10mm chain & 50m 16-20mm line) so that it can be deployed from the bow for short stops and sheltered spots
 
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That said for ease of handling there is no reason not to set up the kedge ona light warp (eg 20m 10mm chain & 50m 16-20mm line) so that it can be deployed from the bow for short stops and sheltered spots

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That's not a light secondary anchor rode for a 34fter, that's more a primary for a 40fter.
 
Actually one further thought - is there a sort of shackle out there that doesn't need mousing - ie one could, before a particular outing, disconnect the larger anchor, thread the chain through the pulpit, back over the top and reattach to the anchor. Then you only have to throw the anchor over the top of the pulpit and avoid trying to push it through which as I say is a bit awkward. Later reverse the process. However if the shackle needs mousing each time, could be a pain - ??
 
Consider a Fortress aluminium, probably the best anchor in the world for holding and convenience. Light so easy to handle and stow, but has more holding power than anchors trebble its weight. Disassembles too so makes a great 2nd anchor. The Austrailian Sarca is getting rave reviews, but a bit awkward and bulky to stow.

http://www.fortressanchors.com
http://www.anchorright.net/productCategoryAnchor.php?id=aus&cid=1

The Fortress is pricey, but what price a bad back or treatment /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif Compared to the luxury of a light easy anchor famous for holding and strength. We have an electric winch with CQR on a bow roller, but a fortress as the 2nd stowed neatly in a locker.
 
I agree, so far as straight line holding power is concerned, that the Fortress is excellent. Particularly in softer bottoms where its relatively large surface area gives it an advantage. However, in common with all 'flat' designs it is very poor at se-setting when it is asked to turn. In some cases it can trip itself if the turning chain gets between the shank and blades, which often happens.

I use an FX16 model as a kedge for the reasons you state but I will never sleep on it as it has dragged twice in very light conditions when the wind turned.
 
Read the anchor testing article in the current Yachting Monthly, testing all of the following:

<ul type="square">[*]Claw (Bruce type)
[*]Océane
[*]XYZ
[*]Hydrobubble
[*]Fortress
[*]WM Performance 20
[*]CQR
[*]Bulwagga
[*]Manson Supreme
[*]WASI / Bügel
[*]SARCA
[*]Delta
[*]Spade
[*]Rocna
[/list]The December "editor's log" talks about it, and you can read that for free online here.

/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

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BTW, I was told (by an old ham radio friend David Jolly G3TJY) that CQR anchors were invented by a gentleman by the name of Taylor just before WW II, and they were manufactured by the Secure Anchor Company..... David was their General Manager at the time.

[/ QUOTE ]Invented in 1933. Very popular now and then, but very out of date today.

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I have heard the same on the origins of the CQR and also that they where origionally desiged as a very light but hight holding power anchor for sea planes that ,naturally wanted to keep wt to a minimum.

[/ QUOTE ]This is incorrect, you are confused with Danforths, which were developed for military use during the second world war and found applications onboard sea planes. A CQR is no way to keep weight to a minimum! Their holding power to weight ratio is very low, as they have a heavy fluke with dedicated tip-weight and a relatively small fluke area.

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That said for ease of handling there is no reason not to set up the kedge ona light warp (eg 20m 10mm chain & 50m 16-20mm line) so that it can be deployed from the bow for short stops and sheltered spots

[/ QUOTE ]That's way too heavy for his boat. What GMac said.

/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

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The Austrailian Sarca is getting rave reviews, but a bit awkward and bulky to stow.

[/ QUOTE ]A brief review of the SARCA can be read here.
 
Craig, you are obviously very prejudiced against CQR anchors......

You said that they are "Very popular now and then, but very out of date today".

'Now and then?' What is the most popular anchor at the current time for most cruising yachts? I wouldnt mind betting that the CQR is in the top 3 at least, if not the leader.
 
For my 9.6 metre Gib'sea I switched the 25 Lb CQR and its 30 metres of chain to the kedge and bought a 35 lb plough which lives permanently on the roller shackled to 60 metres calibrated chain and 50 metres 12mm octoplait. As back up I also have a 22lb Fisherman and a 25Kg fisherman.

You pays your money and takes your pick.
 
Courting disaster ??

Why mouse a shackle to an anchor for short stop ? My shackle is not "moused" to my anchor even though it's permanently rigged. But it has been tightened securely and then a punch used to lock the thread ......

What you could do if so wished is use a piece of monel wire - single loop ? So in fact you just "twiddle" two ends simply ... or even a cable pull-tie - because it's for short term anchoring ...

Now I'm going to be howled out of the room !!
 
getting back to the original question -

the 24lb will make a fine day anchor; if you are crusing, overnighting or sheltering somwhere it wouldn't give me enough confidence to close one eye let alone two............

as someone else says 'sort out the bow fitting so that you can easily use the larger one'.........says it all really.
 
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'Now and then?' What is the most popular anchor at the current time for most cruising yachts? I wouldnt mind betting that the CQR is in the top 3 at least, if not the leader.

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I'm not sure that's relevant. Boats last a long time, and most people don't replace anchors. Just because the anchor you have is good enough doesn't mean that there isn't something better. For what it's worth, the fact that there is something better available doesn't mean you have to replace what you have.

Look at new boats: most that I am familiar with come with Delta anchors. Give it a few years and Delta anchors will be the dominant anchor out there for that simple reason.
 
This year for the first time we anchored with two anchors from the bow - a 35lb CQR and a Fortress FX16. We were in a tidal creek in quite choppy conditions and the pilot book recommended use of two anchors to limit swinging, although we did it as much as anything for practice. I'm glad to say both anchors held through several tide turns, and the Fortress, being used for the first time ever, dug in superbly - from comments above this seems the ideal use for it.

I know all the books talk about setting two anchors in various configurations, but how much do people do it in real life? Pretty much all of the boats we see seem to lie to a single anchor.
 
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