Allgrip versus Gelcoat: what is best?

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Edoardo

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I am not an expert on painting. I have to repaint my sailing boat and I will have it done by a shipyard. What is best between allgrip and gelcoat? What are pros and cons of eah alternative? What should I know when dealing with the shipyard (things I should ceck or I should ask explicitly for)? The boat is blue and I would like to keep the same colour. Many thanks. Edoardo
 
I am having my boat painted soon. It has a black grp hull and although it is only 5 years old it is suffering from exposure to sunlight. I can get the shine back again using Farécla but it is hard work and has to be repeated often. So I have decided to have it done in Awlcraft 2000.
2 of the boats near mine have been painted in Awlcraft 2000. They are dark blue and look great.
I have been advised that Awlcraft 2000 is superior to Awlgrip because the colour is contained all the way through the coating and is much easier to maintain and repair.
There is some information Here
 
Dylan.
Awlcraft is easier to apply than Awlgrip but is certainly not a superior coating. Both are colourfast throughout the coating. Awlgrip is harder and more durable but Awlcraft is easier to use because it is quicker drying thats all. That means the yard don't have to have such stringent dust control and temperature is less critical. Your yard is feeding you a line old chap! Get a quote elsewhere for Awlgrip and compare!
For the answer to the original question. Gel coating is only preferred because it is easy and cheap to put on the mould surface as a first layer before laying up. It also does have a thickness to it that can be abraded and repolished (typically 2-3 mm) but for a refinishing job Awlgrip produces a better finish than any gel coat. It is only a thin paint layer though so difficult to repair any minor knocks and scrapes. Will certainly give a finish that is superior to any other paint system though. Thats why almost every superyacht in the world uses it!
 
Mine was sprayed with awlgrip in a field on a misty morning in april, the paint went on well and dried to a brilliant shine everyone thinks its still the original gel coat.
The shine is still good enough to read a book in the reflection from four foot away !
chips and scratches are easy to toch up as well provided you have some of the original paint
 
Thanks for the info. I can see the difference here . I will try to get advice from another Awlgrip centre. Basically I was told that Awlgrip is more difficult to apply and that if scratched it will leave white marks that are difficult to repair. They were quite adamant that the awlcraft2000 had a thicker pigment than the awlgrip.
The quote I got was to.....prepare topsides--cleaning, degreasing sanding etc...3 coats epoxy primer--spot filling between coats...3 coats of gloss.
The yard isnt cheap, quote was approx £3600 +Vat for 9 metre hull, but I have seen their work which seems excellent.
 
Have just spoken to another centre. The 2000 does have the pigment all the way through. Basically Awlgrip is like metallic paint on a car, which has a laquer topcoat. Whereas the 2000 is like a solid finish. They agreed that the Awlgrip is harder than the 2000 but they also said that since my boat is black then the 2000 is a better option. They also thought that the quote I had was reasonable.
 
You are quite correct I suppose that if the final lacquer coat is applied to a colour other than white it may show scratches. The layer under that however is through colour. I have managed the finishing of 6 superyachts in awlgrip, but on reflection 4 have been white. On the other two one was laquered and one was not. I suppose the lacquer coat if scratched on a white boat would not show. The acrylic awlcraft does not have a final lacquer coat so may indeed be better on a small yacht if you are happy that it is not as hard..... On superyachts the owners usually want the best finish possible and frankly they don't get the punishment that our little ships get so perhaps I will modify my opinion. It will be interesting to hear what an awlcraft boat looks like in 7 years though. I think that's still a bit of an unknown.... Perhaps you will let us know in 7 years time!
 
Painting has got to be a last resort for the average yacht owner. Your dark hull will show every scratch, much better to stick with gelcoat, or get it regelcoated (though I understand this is only possible in white). The thicknes of all paint films is tiny compared with gelcoat. I had an Awlgrip painted hull for a good while and it did pretty well; since being resprayed (Awlgrip Urethane Aristo Blue) two years ago it has proved very fragile and must be treated with kid gloves, fender socks or skirts are a must.
 
Our boat was factory painted with Awlcraft 2000 (Flag Blue).

I must say that I don't think it is the best of coatings for a marina based boat. The fenders seem to give scuff marks very quickly. It can be polished to bring it up to a reasonable finish again but nowhere near "as new".

I have tried fender socks etc and they help a bit but it is all but impossible to prevent some damage to the paint finish, especially in high winds when the boat is being pushed onto the fenders and pontoon.

I have not yet tried touching up any damage with new paint so can't say if it is feasible. I do know that it is bl00dy expensive paint though - i think £80 per ltr for colour, £60 for other component and another £50 for some other component before you even start prep work!!!
 
So what is the solution for a dark faded hull?
Fortunately I only use the marina in the winter but it is normally very sheltered in there.I can make the hull shine with lots of elbow grease but I want to go sailing not polishing. The boats I have seen with the Awlcraft really do look 'as new'.I am taking the view that painting with the softer Awlcraft will be better than the delicate Awlgrip and better than having to cut and polish every couple of months. Perhaps I cant win.
 
I think gelcoat is much thinner than is commonly supposed. I'm taking mine off at present and it's generally less than 0.5mm thick - nearer 0.3mm in most places, although that's obviously still much thicker than paint. Also I can't understand why you couldn't replace with black-pigmented gelcoat if you wanted. It's the same as white gelcoat but with black pigment in!
 
Having looked at the posts on here again this morning I think I would summarise like this.
1. You can in fact polish up your black gel-coat and even a light going over with the finest wet and dry will remove the hazy surface and let you restore to near new. Products like Marine Glaze which is a hard resin polish (expensive but easy to use) will help to keep the shine through the season but you will need to do it again each spring.
2. You can use Awlgrip which will be harder and resist fender scuffs better than Awlcraft (not an issue on superyachts so much) but if you do scratch it in black you will see it. The penalty for such a fantastic mirror finish is that you see every scratch.
3. You can use Awlcraft but because its softer will get fender scuffs more easily and you will soon be polishing again.
With either 2 or 3 using fender blankets (soft clean sheets of suitable material between the hull and fender) will help but it's a pain. Fender socks tend to pick up christalline salt deposits and make matters worse if you are not careful. Fender blankets or socks need washing regularly for this reason.
Alternative 1 is best in terms of a durable finish. 2 is going to look fantastic but you will become paranoid protecting it. 3 is going to look good too but I think will possibly deteriorate faster as it is softer.
Sorry but I think you are finding out the hard way why most people have white boats! I personally think dark blue looks fantastic but never again!
 
If your boatbuilder only used one coat in the mould instead of 2 it will be this thin.
Usually new gel coat is more than 1mm.
Gel coat cannot be applied like paint so is not an option for a respray.
 
My boat 35' was repainted by Audax yard in Palma de Mallorca in February 2004.
Audax is not known to be cheap by any standard!
They recommanded and used Awlgrip Topcoat.
Here what they did :
- sand with 80 grade,
- fill in where necessary,
- three layers of Epoxy primer,
- sand the primer,
- apply three layers of white Awl-grip Topcoat.

The result is excellent, and nearly four years later still like new, even where the fenders abuse on the paint.

I then paid just under € 4'000.

Can recommand Awlgrip.
 
I have concluded that our best option is to try and minimise any damage and to use rubbing compound / polish occasionally to try and keep her looking as good as poss.
We just accept that there is no way of keeping the blue hulls in factory condition. If the hulls get to the stage where they are getting very scruffy or we want to sell the boat then the only option would be a respray.

Some of you may recall the recent article in YM about the Discovery 55, Festina Lente, that had just completed the Blue Water Rally. She has a dark blue hull (factory applied), although I do not know what type of paint was used. I saw her when she got back and the blue hull was badly faded / chalky. Again I don't know how much maintenance was done en-route (i suspect very little) nor do I know how much the finish could be restored with rubbing compound and polish.

The owner of Festina Lente did say that he would still opt for blue hull again - he reckoned she looked much more impressive in the anchorages than white boats. No doubt the aircon reduced any problems of the dark hulls heating the interior!!! She was also heading back to Discovery for a refit, so I would guess a respray was part of that. Much easier when you can afford factory refits !!!

I would also agree that blue hulls do make a boat stand out from the crowd - you need to balance this with the extra care and maintenance required.
 
Many thanks to all those who contributed. I have learnt a lot, though as often no clear cut, unanimous conclusion has been reached. For the time being I am inclined to go for Awlgrip (maybe three layers as adviced by Paulka) and be careful with fenders. However I wonder if, instead of three layers of Awlgrip, I could also apply two layers of Awlcraft2000 and one layer of Awlgrip to finish. Am I an idiot?
 
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