Aft or Centre cockpit

[tjc]

It's time for a change and the trusty 30ft long keeler has to go to make way for a newer slightly bigger model.

Question is do I stick with long keel aft cockpit i.e Rustler 36 etc or do I go for one of these centre cocpit thingys with big after cabins i.e HR 33 Najad etc.

I have never sailed a centre cockpit boat but whilkst you seem to get a lot of space you do seem perched up on top a bit and this must add to the motion somewhat. Bags of space though.

All help, advice and suggestions would be welcome

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[chas]

Horses for courses really - I am sold on CCs as to me, the advantages outweigh the disadvantages ie:
- less movement as you are not at the end of the boat
- better headroom in aft cabin
- cockpit normally wider and more comfortable
- cockpit normally deeper and safer for children.

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[Skyva_2]

It must also depend on the boat. Mine is aft cockpit, and centre cockpits in my experience are shallower - and you tend to step down to the deck rather than climb up, which feels less safe.

- CC has better accommodation below, better visibility when mooring. Maybe poorer vis under the genoa. Possibly higher profile and more wind resistance?

- aft has better vis of sails, possibly more mainsail area as boom can be lower.

- movement is just different in AC boats.

Higher performance boats tend to be aft cockpit.


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[tome]

My observation is that you need quite a large boat (> 40ft) before the centre cockpit comes into its own. On smaller boats the aft cabin tends to be cramped with a walkway under the cockpit through which you have to stoop to make your way. It also cuts the saloon down considerably in size. Against this it's more comfortable in a seaway, but the extra height takes a bit of getting used to when the boat heels. As has been pointed out some of them are quite shallow.

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[iangrant]

Be careful on the choice of CC - I've just done the move from a Jeanneau 37 to a HR42. Blimey what a difference in sailing motion comfort, no slamming etc...
The HR center cockpit is not like the newer perched up Ben type, but tucked down low. out of the weather, safe for the children etc..
Aft cabin is big with "proper" beds!!

Ian

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[pvb]

Centre has some advantages for cruising...

Over the last 30 years, I've owned/sailed a variety of yachts. I much prefer centre cockpit yachts, for a number of reasons. Firstly, and probably most emotionally for some family crew members, centre cockpits avoid the exposed feeling of being right at the back of a boat, and seeing the waves roll up right behind. Secondly, in my experience, centre cockpit boats are drier to sail, provided you have a sensible windscreen or sprayhood arrangement. Thirdly, the centre cockpit puts you closer to the boat's centre of motion, and this seems to make most people happier with regard to motion sickness. Fourthly, when sailing either single-handed or short-handed, and I find that it's much easier to manage a centre cockpit boat (shorter trips from helm to mooring points). And, as an afterthought, it's useful to be able to "lose" a lot of clutter out of sight in an aft cabin.

Some centre cockpit boats however have a very high and exposed cockpit - the Westerly Seahawk maybe rates as one of the worst.


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[tjc]

Re: Centre has some advantages for cruising...

Thanks for that, interesting as the Westerly Oceandream/ Quest was sort of on my list. What is wrong with the cockpit on those and importantly do they sail well?



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[Peppermint]

Re: Have a good look around

Many of the Scandinavian centre cockpits are, as Ian says, much snugger than the large volume producers come up with. The HR 36 for example is a very secure feeling cockpit but headroom in the aft cabin is less than standing.

As to height of cockpit sole many aft cockpit designs raise the cockpit sole to fit the two aft cabins in underneath. Maybe not as much as CC but it's still higher than traditionalists would like.

The height and motion thing aside, you can find your sprayhood gets more work in a CC as spray gets to you earlier. On some designs viz from the helm is obstructed by the headsail in a greater degree of arc than on aft cockpit boats. Again on some I've sailed the boom is more of an issue as it sweeps over much of the CC and you are that bit higher.

The aft deck is quite a useful area and beginers do feel that bit more secure in CC designs so add that to the aftcabin layout and it might be what your looking for if these are things you value.

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[dulcibella]

Re: Have a good look around

I changed from a Halmatic 30 to a Rustler 36 last year and don't regret staying with an aft cockpit. Serious boats will probably have a windvane fitted sooner or later; a good setup is much easier to achieve with an aft cockpit because of the short runs of steering line. Anyway, a lower, narrower boat without a lump in the middle looks better - not a logical argument, but it matters.

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[pvb]

Oceanquest...

I think the Oceanquest was a facelifted Seahawk. Don't know what the Oceandream is. The Seahawk cockpit seats were very high up, making the cockpit feel rather "perched" on top of the boat rather than part of it. As I recall, the coamings were fairly low too, adding to the sense of vulnerability. The space down below was cavernous though - but the companionway ladder would be daunting for some. Sailed OK.

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[robp]

Re: Oceanquest...

The deep "climb" down was what put SWMBO off Westerley CC's. We wound up with a Benn36CC and it's a good balance. Well protected, (Moody owner says better than M36). Not a pretty boat though, and I agree, it does matter. I know a Ben isn't going to figure on everyone's list but it's handled a lot of weather OK.

For the record, my wife is very nervous heeling and in a seaway. She feels much better in a CC. One of the reasons we got it.

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[iangrant]

Re: Oceanquest...

you are not alone!

"my wife is very nervous heeling and in a seaway"

So is mine - so we don't beat to windward with 'er onboard!!

Ian

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[Talbot]

Re: Oceanquest...

Mine SWMBO refused to be heeled over, and it also frightened daughter - solution bought a catamaran now I would not buy a half boat - ducks back below parapet.

seriously if you want to beat to windward, and sail as a family - buy a modern cat.

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[Barry777]

Over the years I have had both CC and aft cockpit craft. The smalest CC was 34 feet (Moody) and to be honest whilst very roomy with a very good aft cabin the cockpit was a bit exposed, although not as bad as some - the Westerly Oceanquest for example was even higher. As it also had a bilge keel and in-mast reefing it wasn't the fastest boat on the water, nor sailed that close However i now have a 38 footer which is a much better length proportionally for a centre cockpit. I find it very comfortable and safe for my sailing needs - south coast and France.

It's horses for courses really. If you want a comfortable aft cabin with loads of space and a maxi berth then a CC is definitely the one to go for. However, if a more traditional boat with a long keel is what's wanted then an aft cockpit is a definite. There are a number of makes/designs that use the same hull for either layout so i don't think the sail performance is an issue.



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[DeeGee]

Years ago, my friend first introduced us to cruising (in the Med) in his Maxi 90. I think she was a 32ft-er, so maybe 95?. Anyway, this was CC, but there was no attempt to link the back and front cabins apart from walking thro the cockpit. It gave us visitors in the aft cabin great privacy (we needed it back in those good old days...) and kept the whole boat in decent shape, with proper cockpit lockers and all! I am surprised that noone now uses that sort of formula.

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[robp]

Re: Oceanquest...

Whilst enjoying (most) of our summer holiday, SWMBO started asking all the cat owners we met, what they thought? She then suggested that we could check them out at the boat show.

When we hit the unnanounced 29 knots, wind "against" spring tide up the Alderney Race and round Dap de la Hague, she went to the Country Cottage Aft and covered herself in duvet! P&O got the full benefit the following day, with a rip off single to Pompey.

I'm just still not sure how I would adapt......Currently my ten year old's idea of a good sail is when he can go fish spotting from inside the saloon! (In SWMBO'S absence of course).

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[robp]

Slightly off the original subject but we looked at a Dragonfly 1200 Trimaran at the show. It had exactly that kind of layout. Aft cabin access from the cockpit. Fabulous boat and been clocked at 22 knots? Mind you, 230K plus VAT...

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[robp]

Re: Oceanquest...

Strange thing is, I can't stand motoring into a sea, with the bow pointing skyward or buried! She doesn't mind that at all.

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[iangrant]

Re: Oceanquest...

same here - my 10 ten year old can't have it rough enough!

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[Oldhand]

Think of it this way:

Is a vast romper room (and how does the emrgency tiller work) more important to you than checking your sail trim? i.e Think of your neck when checking your mainsail tell-tales from a centre cockpit.

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