Advice on sterndrive play

[frazion]

Heya, looking for a bit of advice. My starboard sterndrive (DP-G on KAD300A) has a bit of a wobble. if i grab it i can shake it side to side with the movement clearly originating from above the steering hood. My first thought would be the steering bushes however these were replaced a little over a year ago and the port side is absolutely fine. I've taken a short video of the movement from inside the engine bay and would be really interested in any thoughts or advice before i take it all apart.

thanks,
Fraser

 

[oldgit]

Providing excessive wear on the bushes on the steering fork is not allowing a lot of water into the back of the boat would not be to concerned.
On all of my twin and single outdrives there was considerable play in evidence , it did not appear to have a dramatic affect on the ability of the boat to hold a course.
Due to the number of joints between the steering ram itself and the leg via the steering hood there will be some play in the system.

On my boats this could amount to 2-3 inches of movement at the propeller hub.
Most of the play will be on the steering hood.

Unless really bothering you would leave it alone. ?

 

[BruceK]

I have DPE, that I recently overhauled. I have zero play now. This is what I found.

The helmets including shaft is soft aluminium. When you pull the helmet out, the shaft may look good but unless you measure it you may be surprised to find how much has corroded / worn off and yet still look good. Especially if salt water has ever got up past the seal and grease and you can bet your bottom dollar it has.
The steering / rudder arm is also aluminium and square, it doesnt wear as a result at the helmet shaft end as a result but you can bet the steel pins that connect it to the steering rod and tie bar has caused some galvanic corrosion and enlarged the holes and even the tie bar hole on the slave drive will now be out of round if there has been judder which you have. And finally the circular locking pin that connects the helmet to the top of the drive wears as does the retaining ring in the helmet and even worse the retainer can galvanic corrode the female joint on the drive top. My bill to get zero play came to over 3 grand. Does it make a difference? Oh yes. Very much so. The boat doesnt wander and close quarter steering is so much more precise.

 

[oldgit]

Worth replacing gearshift and prop shaft seals while the boat is out of the water ? Only a few pennies but well worth replacing to prevent trouble later.
Simple pressure test should indicate if one or both legs need doing.

 

[frazion]

Thanks folks. Good shout on the gearshift and prop shaft seals - dont think they have ever been done! You wouldn't happen to have part numbers by any chance? I'll probably do them as a matter of course- I did notice some water in the leg oil this season change. I'll probably leave the play for this year and give it an overhaul next year. proper strip back and rebuild. Got plenty of jobs still to do before getting back in the water and want to make the most of the season!

 

[oldgit]

Loads of web stuff with diagrams and part numbers.

Volvo Penta Schematics - Marine Parts Express

Most of it can be done DIY depending on the depth of your packet and how handy you are with tools.
Prop Seals cost around £20.00 Prop Shaft Seal Kit for Volvo Penta Sterndrive 250, 270, 275, 280, 290, SP-A, SP | eBay

Water in leg is usually via prop shaft seal and sometimes gear shift seal ..
When remove prop(s) check for fishing line damage ie. grooves/scoring on prop shaft .
If there is any wear, locating your new oil seal very slightly in the housing can put the seal on fresh metal without having to buy a new shaft.

 

[alt]

Shouldn't there be 4 seals in the kit above?

Are the kits the same for the 290 DP-E / DP-G? I replaced the propshaft seals (all genuine Volvo) on one DP-G a few years ago and now want to do the other for peace of mind. Of course, buying now from the UK is a hassle (i'm in Ireland) so looking for an EU supplier.

Volvo don't make seals so not worried about genuine, but would prefer to be able to get the whole kit (2 x big seals, 2 x small seals, 2 x ORings) and ensure they're decent quality and most importantly... stainless springs in the rings.

 

[oldgit]

There is now a gear shift seal which has two lips as opposed to the earlier OEM single lip design ?
This seal is dead easy to replace 15 mins or so at worst, just got to remember which bits go where for re assembly. Only ever recall replacing these once.
Some folks do take a photo before dismantling.
Removing and fitting the prop seal can be done without any special tools.

and yes am aware that trim anode should not be covered with Trilux.

 

[gordmac]

Worth replacing gearshift and prop shaft seals while the boat is out of the water ? Only a few pennies but well worth replacing to prevent trouble later.
Simple pressure test should indicate if one or both legs need doing.

You should do a vacuum test as well, my gearshift held pressure but not vacuum. Not sure about pennies, genuine Volvo prop kit and gearshift bits were about £300 for my DPH!

 

[oldgit]

If you are prepared to go to your local seal/bearing shop , all the seals and ball races are bog standard bearing sizes.
When a jack shaft bearing failed in the transom assembly on one my outdrives did get a few quotes regards genuine VP parts and parts from aftermarket supplers.
Out of interest spoke to the chap next door to my workshop about how much the bits would cost. He burst out laughing.
They repair gearboxes.
Two days later everything we needed arrived.
Both ball races all the seals. total cost about £65.00 inc postage.
A classic was the little ball races in the raw water rebuild kit pump around £100.00 but it does come with all the little bits and pieces.
The bearing with its seal is identical to one used in skateboard wheels.

 

[frazion]

alas, ive already done the leg oil this year and dont fancy draining it all again just to do the seals. ive got the gear seals and small seals ordered up anyway and will look to get the large seals for next winter when i plan on doing a full leg refurb back to metal.

 

[gordmac]

The gearshift seal just has a manufacturer and size on it, probably a standard product. As well as that the propshaft seals have Volvo part numbers on them, maybe bespoke? They are all different.
If the oil you took out wasn't emulsified the seals are fine. If it was emulsified I don't think it is a good idea to just replace the oil as you have a leak.

 

[frazion]

The gearshift seal just has a manufacturer and size on it, probably a standard product. As well as that the propshaft seals have Volvo part numbers on them, maybe bespoke? They are all different.
If the oil you took out wasn't emulsified the seals are fine. If it was emulsified I don't think it is a good idea to just replace the oil as you have a leak.

just for point of reference for anyone else stumbling across this to complete the thread since its probably getting a bit off topic from the original post. My DPG seals are VP numbers:

gear: 925093 / 853868 (theres a kit available with all the bits in it)
large prop o ring: 851407
small prop o ring: 853871

 

[chortle]

Heya, looking for a bit of advice. My starboard sterndrive (DP-G on KAD300A) has a bit of a wobble. if i grab it i can shake it side to side with the movement clearly originating from above the steering hood. My first thought would be the steering bushes however these were replaced a little over a year ago and the port side is absolutely fine. I've taken a short video of the movement from inside the engine bay and would be really interested in any thoughts or advice before i take it all apart.

thanks,
Fraser

Hi

Sorry to resurrect this thread but I have this wobble on my KAD300/DPG (a 2004 boat but new to me). Again the steering helmet bushing was replace a couple of years ago. Did you ever get to the bottom of it. The Volvo dealer says it is likely wear of the transom shield itself (so the bush is not secure in the shield. I hope not - that is an expensive part and change out.

Best wishes

Eddie

 

[frazion]

Hi

Sorry to resurrect this thread but I have this wobble on my KAD300/DPG (a 2004 boat but new to me). Again the steering helmet bushing was replace a couple of years ago. Did you ever get to the bottom of it. The Volvo dealer says it is likely wear of the transom shield itself (so the bush is not secure in the shield. I hope not - that is an expensive part and change out.

Best wishes

Eddie

Yeah, but probably not what you want to hear. A bit of a long story, i needed to change the tilt rams on the port side, which required a full engines out job and removal of the port transom shield. While i was at it, i figured i might as well pull the starboard transom shield and renew gaskets etc. (incidently, glad i did, at some point in the past, some water had started to rust one of the shield bolts, so was worth it)

In doing the starboard shield (which is where the wobble was) i replaced the bushings as a matter of course. I was a bit grumpy at doing this since they had only been replaced a year ago. In any case, there was still some play and i could only assume that the transom shield itself had worn over time by a few mm - much like your volvo dealer has suggested. So, after all that i resin-ed in the bushing which acted to fill that gap and no more play.

For info, I got my replacement shield (for the port side) 2nd hand for about 800 quid off ebay which took the bushings securely but of course with a 2nd hand part, thats no sure thing! I did the engines out myself and just paid for the lift out which was a few hundred quid, but note that I did not replace the shield which had the wobble in the drive, i simply used epoxy resin.

now, short answer is on reflection, pull the bushes, whack in some resin, and relocate them to stop the wobble.

long answer, if you have the time over winter until next season and you have some mechanical saavy, pull the engines and do a thorough check. i was terrifed of the effort, but overall it was WELL worth it. found a pile of things that would have gone unnoticed - split hoses, blocked hoses, transom shield bolt corrosion, got to address the general rust and and overall nice shiny paint job, cleaned the header tank and renewed a bunch of gaskets that had probably never been changed.

 

[chortle]

Wow - thanks for that! I will suggest the resin solution. Have also emailed Volvo Paul and sent him a link to video. Will see what he thinks. as well. I guess with resin, the bushing would not be replaceable in the future.

 

[frazion]

Yeah, but probably not what you want to hear. A bit of a long story, i needed to change the tilt rams on the port side, which required a full engines out job and removal of the port transom shield. While i was at it, i figured i might as well pull the starboard transom shield and renew gaskets etc. (incidently, glad i did, at some point in the past, some water had started to rust one of the shield bolts, so was worth it)

In doing the starboard shield (which is where the wobble was) i replaced the bushings as a matter of course. I was a bit grumpy at doing this since they had only been replaced a year ago. In any case, there was still some play and i could only assume that the transom shield itself had worn over time by a few mm - much like your volvo dealer has suggested. So, after all that i resin-ed in the bushing which acted to fill that gap and no more play.

For info, I got my replacement shield (for the port side) 2nd hand for about 800 quid off ebay which took the bushings securely but of course with a 2nd hand part, thats no sure thing! I did the engines out myself and just paid for the lift out which was a few hundred quid, but note that I did not replace the shield which had the wobble in the drive, i simply used epoxy resin.

now, short answer is on reflection, pull the bushes, whack in some resin, and relocate them to stop the wobble.

long answer, if you have the time over winter until next season and you have some mechanical saavy, pull the engines and do a thorough check. i was terrifed of the effort, but overall it was WELL worth it. found a pile of things that would have gone unnoticed - split hoses, blocked hoses, transom shield bolt corrosion, got to address the general rust and and overall nice shiny paint job, cleaned the header tank and renewed a bunch of gaskets that had probably never been changed.

Wow - thanks for that! I will suggest the resin solution. Have also emailed Volvo Paul and sent him a link to video. Will see what he thinks. as well. I guess with resin, the bushing would not be replaceable in the future.

it would be, it would still tap out, just need a clean up.

The other two things that i considered is, with the shield out, take it to a machine shop where they could rebore the hole and provide an aluminium shim spacer;
or
instead of just resin, wrap a strip of fibreglass and resin around the bushing to pad it out. i went with the resin only, because there was barely any space needing padded.

responses to doing it will include - but resin is brittle and wont do anything. again, i wasnt using the resin to secure anything from a perspective of gluing things together, just to pad the tiny bit of wear in the hole.

 

[QBhoy]

Looking at that video, I wouldn’t worry too much. Not too much play, considering the hydraulics aren’t taking things up in terms of slack. Much worse than that would certainly be the bushes or cable to the hydraulic ram previous to there.

 

[oldgit]

If you go looking for problems you will surely find them.
The outdrives on my 3500 hour 40 year old Princess 33 most certainly had a "bit" of play and did have tendency to "dribble" through both steering yokes.
It took a fair amounts of knuckle scraping, swearing , lying in puddles but very little money to sort the problem.
A new set of steering helmet bushes and copious amounts of grease helped to reduce the play and certainly stopped the leak.(For a while)
To this day am still wondering why VP never fitted a 50p grease nipple to the transom assembly ?
Provided there is still a bit of any bush in situ, ie. no metal to metal should be no need for major work to the transom assembly ?