Advice for newbie

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brunodeath

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Hi forum,

I would like to try to get some advice...

i used to 'sail' years ago, in dinghys and the occasional yacht weekends around salcombe estuary and lakes.

I now have the bug back and would like to take my first step into the yachting world so would like some advice how i should proceed:

unfortunately i live in the midlands so would have to travel for any estuary/costal sailing but i want to move into yacht sailing (25 - 30ft) and am considering purchasing a small yacht.

should i attend a course?
where would people recommend i start to sail based on my location that would be relatively straightforward/easy
what starter yacht would people recommend (25ft - 30ft yacht)

i hope this isnt too vague but i do appreciate any help i can get!
 
Hello, and welcome. I hope you'll find lots of encouragement and sound answers to the many questions that will occur. You'll also need practice in 'separating the wheat from the chaff', if experience here is any guide....

Given what you've written, I would recommend you contact the Island Cruising Club at Salcombe : http://www.icc-salcombe.co.uk/. They are certainly one of the best organisations around, and a course with them should give you all the perspective you might need - besides being in some of the finest cruising waters around our shores.

As for recommended starter yachts, 'how long is a piece of string'....? You'll quickly have a list of several dozen..... So many considerations - what kind of sailing you're most happy doing, what space you personally need, how many will come along with you, where you will want to keep your boat, how large is your budget..... All these and other questions can be exercised at ICC Salcombe.

Oh, and it's many years since I took my SWMBO there. That club's reputation has only grown since.
 
Maybe start by doing a bit of crewing for someone who already has a boat.This will get you back into the swing of it and bring you up to date with modern equipement and nav aids.You may find everything is totally different or it all clicks easily,but it will get you looking at what is suitable for you while not costing much at all.I wouldnt jump in and buy a boat too quickly,best wait until you really know what is feasable.
 
If you are happy handling a dinghy I see no reason not to go ahead and buy a boat. If you keep it on a mooring somewhere safe you are not going to do much harm to yourself or anyone else and you will build up a lot of experience quickly. Local sailing doesn't need the kind of navigation skills you may feel you are lacking, so long as you are familiar with such things as buoyage and collision rules, and you can do courses at your leisure.

There are ways of improving your skills, such as sailing with experienced sailors and joining a club and racing, but so long as you stay within your abilities you shouldn't be criticised for giving it a go.
 
My advice is if you do buy your own boat then first find a secure place to moor it. Being so far away it's probably more important that it's secure, or there is someone local to keep an eye on it, since you can't just pop down to check it quickly. A sailing club would be the ideal environment or a marina if you can afford the fees.

If you plan to use a marine VHF radio then you should do the VHF course. Again another benefit of sailing club membership is often they run the courses a lot cheaper.

You need to think how you are going to launch and recover the boat, or keep it afloat all year. Again it all depends on the boat and where you are keeping it.

Having said all that, when we started, we went and bought a boat. Brought it home in it's trailer, then went looking for places to keep her. In hindsight probably the wrong order but it worked out okay for us. Oh and we learned to sail be reading some books then going out on a calm day and trying what it said in the book. Again not the ideal way, but it worked out okay.
 
I bought a 26ft boat with a friend when I was 54 and I'd never sailed or hardly been near a boat. He had crewed in a dinghy in his distant youth but he was far from being a skipper. We stuck the sails up on calmish day and went from there. 13 years later I have my own 31ft boat and happily sail across the North Sea and singlehand in local waters. I did Dayskipper theory to learn lots of stuff I didn't know but found that sailing itself was just a matter of gently pushing the boundaries (or sometimes getting pushed).

Go for it. There are always people about who will hold your hand a couple of times or you could pay for own boat tuition.
 
Whereabouts in the Midlands are you?

Lots of people from the East Midlands sail in and around the Thames estuary, ourselves included

A little bit more idea if your location, rough budget and ambitions would aid giving specific advice based on our experience of the last four years since we did it ourselves from a similar starting point

Bru
 
The midlands covers too large an area to make a sensible suggestion as to "where". But for the process, I would suggest that you sit on your wallet and dont buy a boat for the moment. Instead do a practical course, Then maybe charter a time or two. Once your location is chosen join a club which oiffers moorings and get to know people. The decision as to what boat needs to come after you have decided what sort of sailing you fancy, where you have decided to do it, and begin to understand whats in front of you when you look at a boat. Its just too easy to buy the wrong boat.
 
Sod that Birdseye, that's WAY too sensible! Buy a boat you can't afford, stick it on a mooring (you can't afford), get out there and have a go! S'easy
 
I too live in the midlands and recently bought a "big boat", having done some dinghy sailing. I decided to buy a "trailer sailer" so that I could try out different places and avoid concerns about security and avoid many of the costs of having a boat in the water all season (and not being able to get to it as often as I would like). I am pleased with what I have been able to do and where I have been able to go. I did the shore-based day skipper at a local evening class to sort out what I knew, what I knew I didn't know and what I didn't know I didn't know.
 
I live near Wellington Shropshire but travel 235 miles to my boat which is up on Tyneside where I have 24/7 hr access to the sea at all states of the tide, I motorway almost 95% of the way and a 4 1/2 hr run on a good day, BUT, the boats secure with good 24/7 security and watched by a number of berthholders.

Get yourself on a VHF couse and don't buy the first boat you see, many people buy a boat, but few ever 'really think' what they want to do with it, how many 'if any' crew will you have, berthing costs etc and can you afford to maintain it.

As suggested above 'do your homework' and know what your going to look at if you decide to buy and remember if the boats a bargain your first question is WHY !

Whatever you buy make sure the hull and engine is in good condition, otherwise your bank balance will be seriously dented.

Mike
 
brunodeath said:
Hi forum,

unfortunately i live in the midlands........................
Click to expand...

Hey, there really is no need to apologise. I was born in the midlands but escaped to UKs finest city almost 30 years ago :)

Hello and welcome to the forum.

Lots of good advice already given. Ultimately, you'll make your own decision based upon gut feeling. I started as a mature novice sailor but with a fair bit of power boat experience from another hobby. Having never pulled a bit of string on a boat I did a dinghy course almost immediately followed by DS practical. In successive years, I also did the DS and YM shore based courses. After a while with a dinghy, I bought a trailer-sailer, then a keel boat, progressing through a few others to my now 41 ft AWB.

When viewing a boat (view lots) first impressions carry weight, IMHO. If the owner can't be ar5ed and it looks like a dog, it probably is. Conversely, if it you immediately get a "wow" factor, it's probably worth progressing.

Buying a boat is not the end of the spend, far from it. Upgrades, maintenance, mooring, insurance, yacht club membership....the list is endless. DIY maintenance is part of boat ownership, buying a pile of junk with ambition of restoring it to perfection then setting sail towards the horizon is a minority sport.

Loitering around a sailing club can pay dividend if you're leaning towards racing. Take the initiative and talk to obvious sailors. There aren't many unwilling to wax lyrical about their pride and joy.

Doubtless there are horror stories of when it all goes wrong. But then there are thousands of us who simply "get on with it" and take great pleasure from the hobby, even with our wonderful weather.

Good luck with your search. Keep posting :encouragement:
 
What a pleasure it is to read this post. Pleasant educated advice from persons willing to help. Hopefully it will not be 'discovered' by some others who appear only to criticise on another thread. Good luck with your endeavour and enjoy your sailing.
 
Another Midlander here. I keep my boat on a club mooring in Gosport and it's about 130 miles, 2 and a bit hours for me...easily doable on a Friday night. Personally, I find the Solent gives the best scope for visiting many different places of differing charachters for an overnight stop, rather than a simple "left or right out the marina?" It's also not in the least bit expensive if you know where to look...join a club, get on the mooring waiting list, job done. I keep a 27' fin keel boat on a swinging mooring, including all club fees, for under two hundred quid a year.

Good luck!
 
I'm midlands too, Birmingham. Whichever direction I go in a bit of sea with a decent access mooring is 2.5-3 hours away. For me the area of choice was NW Wales due it's scenery and wildlife and finally settled (mooring wise) in Porthmadog. Was traveling to Hartlepool for my new-to-me boat which although much further distance wise was about the same in time.

I'd previously had a trailer sailer but it proved too much of a faff with rigging, derigging, loading and finally the cost of towbars on modern frequently changed cars.
 
dslittle said:
What a pleasure it is to read this post. Pleasant educated advice from persons willing to help. Hopefully it will not be 'discovered' by some others who appear only to criticise on another thread. Good luck with your endeavour and enjoy your sailing.
Click to expand...

I was just thinking the very same thing, a wide variety of opinions expressed in a manner that invites further discovery.
 
Living in the midlands gives you lots of choice as to where to keep your boat and how much to pay for moorings. If you are that far away though you do want to make sure that the boat is secure and safe so that you can sleep on stormy nights!
You don't say what your budget is which would help people to give better answers.
IMHO decide what sort of sailing you want to do before you buy your boat. If you don't know then act as crew for other people to get a better idea.
Doing a course won't do you any harm and may increase your knowledge and confidence.
Look at lots of boats before you buy. Photos on websites always make boats look better than they are when you see them. Some owners look through rose tinted spectacles when advertising their boats!
Condition is more important than age.
Buying the boat is only the first financial commitment. Once you have one then you never stop paying for her. Hold some of your purchase price back for upgrades / replacements / unexpected costs.
If you are buying an old boat then get one with a replacement engine. It may not cost any more and could save a considerable amount of money! Not to mention time and aggravation!
Don't keep a tally of how much you spend over a year, it will only spoil your fun!
Did I mention to get one with a new engine?
Most important of all - enjoy it! If you're not then sell the boat and do something else!
 
SteveTibbetts said:
... finally settled (mooring wise) in Porthmadog. Was traveling to Hartlepool for my new-to-me boat which although much further distance wise was about the same in time.

I'd previously had a trailer sailer but it proved too much of a faff with rigging, derigging, loading and finally the cost of towbars on modern frequently changed cars.
Click to expand...

Been to Madog- liked it a lot, but worried about what it would be like getting out with a SW swell? Beautiful area. Liked the moorings at Pensarn- could get a train home frome there!

Rigging is a bit of a faff on a trailer sailer, but it's a question of being well organised. The payback is that my boat is safe in a shed in bad weather and gives me access to many different sailing areas. However, one day I expect I might have a (bigger) boat on a mooring.....
 
Not saying its for everyone, but a trailer-sailer does have advantages. Especially if you have room at home.
- No mooring fees
- No anti-fouling costs. (unless you keep it continuously in the water for more than 3 weeks or so.)
- best is centerboard so you can explore shallow waters.
- Generally have an outboard motor. Owners of yachts with inboard motors do seem to spend a lot of time and money trying to keep the things going.
- You can choose to sail east coast, west coast,north or south without having to sail right around the island. Lake sailing is also a possibility.
-With rudder and centre board raised i can approach a beach stern first and depending on the slope of the beach, step ashore with dry feet.

If you have your systems sorted out then rigging is not so bad. I have a 26 ft trailer yacht and plan to arrive at the yacht club 40 minutes before race briefing.
In that 40 minutes i raise the mast and fully rig the boat and launch her and tie up to the floating jetty. (My regular crew makes this a bit faster but enthusiatic and helpful first timers slow the process down.)

Though my boat was sold as 6 berth, this would only work with 2 adults and 4 small and docile kids, but its OK for three adults. Includes a galley with sink, and enclosed heads with a portaloo.

Downsides:
Trailer maintenance.
Suitable towing vehicle
access to launching ramps.
Even with my straemlined systems it does take time to rig up and unrig.
26 ft is about as big as you would want to tow and at that size the ballast ratio is not as good as a fixed keel 26 ft boat should be.

Remember Rule 1: Every boat is just a set of compromises made into a solid object!

As has already been suggested in one way or another. Try and be clear and realistic about what you want and what will work for you.
For example i have rigged my boat so that i can single hand her if i want. I bought my boat knowing my wife would not come sailing with me as a rule.
Sometimes on nice calm days she does and enjoys it and that is a bonus. I have a friend who regularly crews for the small amount of round the buoys racing that I do.
I sometimes crew in turn on a competitive 11 m yacht. This needs 8 competent crew to be totally effective round the buoys and organising that is a huge weekly chore for the skipper.
Even for cruising, I know people with boats stuck in marinas because they need a crew to help sail it.

With or without a crew, sailing round in circles on your own with no objective soon loses its charm.
Most People find a purpose in either racing or cruising. These things are not mutually exclusive as some on this forum may believe.
With racing the purpose is obvious and you learn a lot about sailing efficiently that can be also applied to cruising.
If you are not racing, what is your objective? Sometimes my objective is to take a group of friends on a gentle sail to a nice beach and have a picnic and then return them safely and without scaring them. Sometimes my objective is to go from a to b, stay overnight at b and explore c and return to the home port at the right stage of the tide.

Good luck
 
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