About Target HF3mfrom NASA

[Jerzys]

Hi. I have just received Target HF3 receiver from Nasa. I have found in “A guide to…..Target HF3 receiver” that enclosed program works only in DOS not in Windows. I have Dells Inspiron with Windows 2000. Is anywhere on the web some simple suitable program for weather fax? I’m looking for some good program for this (even buy) and even better to find some not complicated program combine with MORSE alphabet. (My knowlege about radiocomunication is very limited). I hope you can give me some advice and address.

 

[milltech]

You can still run your Dell in DOS mode to use the programme supplied, just click the MS-DOS programme icon, but I believe if you have an HF3/m it will not work with Windows software, I think you will need HF3/P for that.

Ask Nasa, nasamarine@aol.com


www.allgadgets.co.uk

John

 

[DavidGrieves]

I have a program on my PC for weather fax it is "Mscan Meteo Pro" I don't know how well it works because I don't have a reciever. Send me an E mail and I'll send you the program, it's only 1.34Mb david@whitehave.freeserve.co.uk

 

[ParaHandy]

Is it an HF3M? If so you will have a problem with Windows 2000 etc. This set has a demodulator which converts audio output to a digital signal. The signal is decoded by timing the width of the modulated signal into the RS232. Only DOS 3.1 has fast enough control and interrupts to guarantee this works. Higher Windows OS does not work.

So, run in DOS mode to see if the standard Tarfax software supplied with the HF3M works. If it does, great. If not have a look at pervisell.co.uk who have a fix which might work for your laptop. You have to do some horrendous sounding things (but then I don't know too much about it) to the PC and it won't multi-task thereafter.

Once past that stage download JVFAX70 (freeware). Infinitely better than Tarfax and discrimination/decoding much more sure. If you can't find it, send me a PM. This program allows automatic fax reception amongst many other useful bits.

For Navtex, either HAMMCOM (freeware) or RadioRaft (£25). I prefer RadioRaft as it will receive RRTTY, MORSE and you can eavesdrop on lots of diplomatic traffic.

Fit an active aerial. Costs £35-45 and is worth every penny.

If the PC proves a problem - bin the good one and get a crummy old DOS3.1 with floppy & hard disc. These have single rail power supplies and you should be able to charge it direct from the boat's 12volt. Doesn't matter so much if it "bounces" around too?

The HF3 is a super little set.

 

[ccscott49]

If you want to run any other program, you will have to modify you reciever, so it gives audio output, to allow another modulator to be used, or for some programs, a audio input for your sound card to decode the signals. NASA will sell you for about a tenner the socket and capacitor and instructions how to do it, it's simple, I've just done it to use a new program, can't remember the name offhand, I'm not onboard.

 

[vyv_cox]

I went down the road of weather fax about two years ago. I spent quite a lot of money on an Icom PCR1000 receiver, Xaxero software and, as time went on, more and more peripherals, gizmos and gadgets. None of these made very much difference to what is an outdated mode of communication. Ultimately I have made the decision that this is not worth pursuing nowadays, witness the fact that at about the same time a decision was made to turn off the UK Bracknell service. OK if you are an enthusiastic radio amateur or have access to someone who is, but all I want to do is see the occasional weather chart.

It is now cheaper to buy an Iridium or similar telephone than the Icom PCR1000. Ok, this was a lot more expensive than the NASA, but I was assured that it would give far better results. These would give access anywhere on earth. The latest land-based mobile phones with full facilities will download weather faxes from Internet without a PC, at a cost of 400 pounds. My decision is that it is much better to invest in means of accessing the Internet than struggling with SSB.

 

[ccscott49]

I tend to agree with you on this, I now use a laptop, connected to mobile phone for weathercharts from wetterzentrale.de but its slow, slow, if I was to say, cross the atlantic, I would like to have an iridium phone for both e mail and weather etc. but its still not cheap. I have the nasa and new software and still have difficulty making it all work, without interference etc. SSB for E mail is very, very slow and not really worth all the hassle, it is also not free! As the price of satellite comunications falls, which it is doing all the time, I will invest in a system, which gives me faster internet access, but not yet, cruising in the meddy, I don't need it yet, if ever.

 

[colin_jones]

Even with sophisticated equipment, I've given up taking charts off air via a wx program... too slow, too messy with cables etc, too corrupted... and I am not brilliant at interpretation.

My best charts and RTTY always came from Hamburg... still do.

I now get my charts from The Internet using addresses often on the forum and get my plain language from the new NASA Weatherman, which is about the best weather info tool I have ever had on a boat

 

[ccscott49]

Colin, Whats the new NASA Weatherman, a new type of navtex?

 

[alex_rogers]

I have a HF3M radio and get very good weatherfax reception. The 'modem' output of the radio drives the interupt of the RS232 port. This means that the computer has to be running in DOS mode in order for the timing to work properly. On new versions of Windows you can only 'simulate' DOS mode by getting a Command Prompt window and the software won't work properly - the lines all get out of synch.

These days the best solution is to use the input of the soundcard. This has much better signal processing and produces a much higher resolution fax. To do this you need some different software and an adaptor to turn the signal from the HF3M into something suitable.

For the software try MSCAN. There is a fully featured shareware version so you can try it out without paying anything and also receives RTTY and NAVTEX. It is much easier to use than the majority of the free weatherfax software as it is a commercial product. It can be downloaded from :

www.mscan.com

Until it is registered, it puts a reminder across the middle of the fax.

For the adaptor you need to be able to feed the audio signal into the 'line' input of the sound card. NASA make a HF3P radio which has this output and also an adaptor to convert the signal from the HF3M. This adaptor isn't anything more than a capacitor and a couple of resistors. I made one myself and can send you the circuit diagram if you're interested. To test the radio and software you can just put the computer near the radio, turn up the volume and tell MSCAN to use the internal microphone.

Despite the use of internet and satelite communication, getting weatherfaxes from the radio is free and good fun.

When they sell the radio, NASA don't seem to stress the fact that the software only works with DOS and not at all on new versions of Windows - a bit sneaky really.

 

[ParaHandy]

I don't agree with you for these reasons:

Bracknell's transmissions have been replaced with Northwood. The Northwood fax is less clear than Bracknell (they use a lower line intensirty) but against that, Northwood's fax is easier to understand - it has wind vectors which Bracknell did not. It's a moot point whether Northwood will continue transmitting but there are alternatives....

Offenbach's service is comprehensive. It has both weather fax and RTTY weather forecasts for the whole of Europe. The RTTY transmission is "belted" out and I have not failed yet to pick it up. The difference in attitude by the German and British authorities is most apparent here...

The UK has an equivocal attitude to sea safety. With Navtex now on 490khz and 3 day forecasts included on both 518 & 490, the apparent need for long range forecasts by fax might appear to be reduced. This is not the case in my view. The 3 day forecasts on 490 are general to the UK and not specific. They are worse than useless. When passage planning synoptic charts are an essential tool for mariners and the only means of estimating weather conditions up to 5 days ahead.

As for internet access, you must have noticed that the met office charts come not from UK but www.wetterzentrale.de which is a German site. How long will it be before Bracknell exercise copyright? I do not trust this government not to miss an opportunity to get some more money out of us. You might also note that whereas Northwood forecasts are transmitted 3 hours after issue (eg 1200z actual is forecast at 1500z) without fail, Bracknell's through wetterzentrale can be *a day* late. In my view, it is unreliable and not to be depended on.

Reception does vary. But, I have yet to receive a totally illegible fax. Furthermore, Northwood stack the key charts from 1736z onwards. These charts run up to 1200z t+120hrs. The point is that this time is the best for reception. As for your satellite and mobile phone...if I understand correctly what was explained to me at the LBS you have to point the phone at the satellite and keep it there throughout the transmission. I can't see myself doing that at sea, can you? In addition the baud rate is not very good, is it? These maps are (compressed) 250kbytes in length.

I could go on....look at the service provided by the States

SSB is, in my view, a far better service. It has proven robustness at sea and that is all that matters to me.

 

[ccscott49]

I will still use, the wetterzentrale site, but will also use my SSB, have you seen the weather forecasts on wetterzentrale, provided by the USAF @ Sembach, they are excellent!

 

[ParaHandy]

Yes! They are very good, although take some time to download as they're in colour. I have a pal (who golfs!?) and I give him the Sembach forecast. Last weekend, they got the wind strength about right but the frontal position completely wrong but there again so did everybody else which is why people have been complaining elsewhere on this site!

The only doubt I have about Sembach is that their forecasts are straight off the computer whereas the Brit ones have a forecaster actually look at them (at least, most of the time).

Recent weather will have been quite kind to you? Much better than 6 weeks ago?

 

[vyv_cox]

I wouldn't argue with you. I don't have much knowledge of the subject but I do know that despite spending loads of money on bits and pieces and software, plus sending many e-mails to the suppliers of most of them, I failed to receive a single weatherfax. The instructions provided by Xaxero, in particular, were laughable in their many omissions and wrong in many places. I never got the software to take over the tuning of the Icom, which was the claim that made me buy it in the first place. The dealer I bought it from demonstrated it by having the Xaxero on one PC and the Icom on another, so I failed to realise the problems until later. The information they gave me about buying PCMCIA cards to increase the number of available serial ports was inappropriate.

If I was going to buy a system to do this I would insist that I saw it running on my laptop before spending a single penny. I would very much like to be able to receive wx but I don't think that SSB is the way for me.

 

[ccscott49]

I thought the sembach ones were made with all the info/data from their various bases as seen on the chart and the computer, shows how wrong I can be! just like the forecasters! But after studying the charts for a few weeks offshore, everyday in fact for three weeks and comparing them with the actual satellite pictures when they arrive, I've found them to be very good IMHO of course. They do also show rain, snow etc. I did compare them also to Bracknell and the ECMWF, plus a few full north atlantic charts, since I had a very slow time out here for a while, they all seem very close to each other. Yes, the colour is a nuisance when on mobile, but I normally only look at those when in an internet cafe, or at work, using bracknells most of the time. I study this kind of thing, to make my own weather forecasting better, from simple charts.

 

[ccscott49]

I went through the same learning curve, and have now got it right. I will tell you the name of the system when I get back, but it runs through my sound card. I got it from a place in Lancaster, if thats any help.

 

[ParaHandy]

Last year, also with time on my hands!, I compared Bracknell's 5 day 1200z forecasts with the actual. They were remarkably good, I thought, so rang the Met office to complement them (it took a longish time and many requests for money to speak to a forecaster before they twigged to my intent). Eventually got some interesting info. Up to 60 hrs ahead, the forecasts are from Bracknell's "main" programme. 60 to 72 hours ahead and it's from another Bracknell program. 72 to 120 hrs ahead and they come from ECMWF. That's why you can sometimes see a slightly disjointed forecast when the time crosses the boundaries between one computer model and another. The Met office accuracy prediction for 5 day is 35%!! I think that figure dates back to the days when they used a wet finger to forecast with!

The US Air force Sembach stuff is a brilliant teaching aid.

 

[vyv_cox]

Lancaster's a long way from me here, but not too far from my home address. My dealer offered me a system that ran through the sound card at a late stage, but by then I was totally disillusioned with the whole thing. Would appreciate your info when you have it, though. Maybe I'll have another go.

Vyv.

 

[colin_jones]

No. Basically it is a 4 channel HF receiver dedicated to wx forecasts in plain language (RTTY) from Hamburg. It is about the best bit of cruising weather kit I have handled. I think it costs about £245 without haggling. I belive that there is a report in the current PBO.

If I can tell you anything else, email me direct.

 

[ccscott49]

No probs, I'll PM you when I get the info!