20 year old Volvos or new Yamahas?

N

NealB

Well-Known Member
Joined
19 Feb 2006
Messages
7,674
Location
Burnham on Crouch
Visit site
Just suppose that you had found two boats of the same class of multihull, both really nice boats and very closely comparable in all respects.

Suppose you wanted to decide which one of them to buy. Would you be drawn more to the one with 2 20 year old Volvo 2002s with saildrives (all of which looks to be in excellent condition), or to the one with 2 nearly new Yamaha 9.9hp 4 stroke high thrust outboards?

What does this august, and informed, panel think?

Thanks.
 
At 20 yrs old you can expect tp start laying out money on the Volvos anytime now, you can expect things like starter motors, seawater pumps, exhaust manifolds to start showing signs of age. If only one motor requires replacing it will cost more than two new outboards.
 
Good question, here are some more!

All things being equal, and holding no fear of Volvo Penta 2002's, I would go with them. They are ubiquitous, easy to work on, plenty of parts around.

Is there any sign of 'service history' to concur with the apparent external condition?
Is weight, space, or range an issue?
Do you intend to do long challenging passages, or the odd coastal hop?
Do you need something to whack out loads of charge for the batteries, or will you be resplendent with solar arrays and wind generators?
Does the weight of the inboards come with any performance penalty?
How nickable are the outboards?
 
Thanks for the replies so far - very thought provoking and useful.

One of the specific worries I have about the Volvos is the saildrives. I've owned an embarrassing number of boats over the last 30 years, but I've never had one with a saildrive. I'm no engineer, but they seem to my ignorant eye to be made of a most unseamanlike mix of alloys and stainless steel. Does this cause problems, or does conscientious attention to anodes avoid all ills?

Secondly, I'm told that the diaphragms, which close the gaping holes in the bottom of the hulls, need replacing every 7 years at a fitted cost painfully close to £1000 per drive. Is that right?

Thirdly (sorry, I'm pushing my luck), is it really necessary to change the Volvo lubricating oil at 50 mile intervals?
 
Saildrives a very reliable when you consider how little maintainence they get, change the anodes as req'd and you shouldn't have any trouble with corrosion.

The diaphragms need to inspected annually and changed at 7 although many go much longer, which is cheaper changing the diaphragm or recovering a sunken boat.
No its not neccessary to change the lube oil that often. My friend once didn't change his saildrive oil for 5 yrs.
Check it once a year by draining some off to check for water ingress, if OK change every 2-3 yrs.
 
I am guessing that you are looking at catamarans. Some cats pitch more than others. The Yams would have to be fitted in wells as close to the middle of the boat as possible to keep them in the water when pitching into a head sea. If this is not a concern then go the o/bs.

Just waffling a friend had a 25ft mobo with 300HP Volvo V8 stern drive. He has removed that and fitted a 240HP V6 Mercury O/B. He is very pleased with the result. The o/b is quieter more economical pushes the boat just as fast and can be raised to minimise fouling /corrosion. So the days of O/b as a poor mans power are long gone.

Still there is an elemant of " a mans got to have diesel to be a real man/salor" (just like 4X4) so resale value may dictate diesel. olewill
 
Just thinking it through some more, if the saildrives are in the hulls, does this mean that you cannot dry out, or has the cat got keels as well (I mean keels deep enough to hold the drives clear). This would be a disadvantage to me with a cat as I would want to be able to dry out.

A further issue then would be protection. If my yacht had a saildrive it would be well protected by the keel in the event of grounding.
I would hate to think that I could rip a saildrive out if I was ditch crawling, or simply returning to my mooring at WQBY at LW when I should really know better!

Saildrive technology is pretty well sorted. As put elswhere, check the oil regularly for emulsion, change every 100 hours if all is OK, and keep up with the anodes and you should have no problems. The gaiter is a bit like an impellor, check it closely each year, particularly as it comes of age. When you decide you simply must change it at 10 years or so, you will probably find you might drop it into the locker as a spare as it is still pliant and without cracks. Plenty of anecdotes around to suggest they will last twice the 5-7 year recommedation, though your insurers may have a view on this.

I'm not sure you will be paying £1,000 / side, and DIY should be straight forward. It's more a pair of gaskets really, but there is a bit of prep for the bonding to the hull. I think you need to raise or tilt the engine slightly to do the job, but there may be plenty of scope to do a lot of the prep. yourself if inclined, to keep the cost down. For £1000 I bet that would include a full leg re-build including gaskets and seals etc.

Then again, if there is no evidence of when this was last done, assume, for the purposes of negotiation, that they need changing immediately.
 
They are indeed catamarans......

Comanches.

The outboards are virtually amidships.

I used to have a Wharram Pahi 31 with a Yamaha 9.9 hanging off the stern. Pushed her along great in calm conditions, but the prop spent half the time out the water when it got livelier. Of course, generally, we'd be sailing then anyway, but motoring up the Irish Sea, from Scilly toward Isle of Man, in wind free conditions, with a resisual slop from gales a few days before, was frustrating.
 
Thanks, Andy...

The Comanche, unlike the Iroquois (her smaller sister), does indeed have keels to sit on, and protect the drives. No problem there.

Volspec quoted £800 + VAT to supply and fit each diaphragm. He reckoned each one is a day's work for them. No leg rebuilding was mentioned!
 
Having been there I wouldnt go near petrol outboards. They are not as effective as inboard engines in bad weather, consume way more fuel, and that fuel is dangerous and expensive.

In a cat you will find yourself doing rather more motoring anyway, particularly to windward
 
My son has a single Yamaha 9.9 4-stroke on a 9.2m 2400kg multihull. It does 22 nm per gallon at 5.5 knots in calm weather. This is a similar mpg as a diesel would use. A 2-stroke outboard would use significantly more of course, but modern 4-stroke outboards are more efficient than you make out.

The fuel cost is of course approximately 2.5 times the price at the moment for petrol compared to marine diesel, but if the duty free status of red diesel is ended, the price will be much closer to each other.

Diesel is much more commonly available water side than petrol, but again may change if the tax status of red diesel changes.
 
I don\'t accept your generalisation.....

"In a cat you will find yourself doing rather more motoring anyway, particularly to windward"
.....................................................................

There's cats and there's cats, just as there's monos and monos.

Some of each sail well, particularly to windward, others don't. Some cats will sail rings round some monos, and vice versa. Some cats will sail rings round almost anything else, regardless of number of hulls.

Different skippers on identical boats will also make their own decisions as to whether to "motor" or "sail" (or both), in a particular situation. It's a personal choice.

I certainly don't recall motoring any more in our old Wharram than we have in any of our other boats.
 
Re: I don\'t accept your generalisation.....

Unless you're a "green death" hater, and assuming you will be motoring a bit, I'd be heading the Volvo way - nothing inherently wrong with 2002's, and you can spec non genuine for lots of parts (eg starter alternator etc). 120S leg has a long history of not having much wrong with it. Mind you new Yammies are fine too, but depends on your cruising area / intended use - you're in a much better position to work this out than newbies to multi's it seems - if you're going to motor lots in roughish water, then diesels, otherwise the o/b's are a goer I guess.
 
Re: I don\'t accept your generalisation.....

I dont know what your comparator monohulls are, but I do know how a Wharram will sail to windward in a sea. Lovely boats they are, but windward performance isnt part of their attraction.
 
Re: I don\'t accept your generalisation.....

I tend to agree with Rick,although a condideration for me would be whether the outboards can be lifted free of the water when sailing as this would improve sailing performance somewhat.

Does the boat with the outboards have some other charging facility? I dont know about the new ones but my older 9.9 had enough charging capacity to charge the start battery and that was about it. An inboard has a lot more capacity in that departmentand can also have a water heater and even a fridge compressor attached.

I think the issue comes down to you making an accurate assessement of the type of sailing you will be doing. Mainly daysailing--outboards, more extended cruising, the diesels.

Whatever you decide on, I would try to use the other vessel as a lever to negotiate a reduced price.

Good luck and let us know what you decide.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top