120nm in a Beneteau Flyer 6 Grand Prix?

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VOD80

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Hi, I'm a noob to boats but I have had a life spent around machines, including being a private pilot (in fact, all this boat malarkey makes planes look cheap!) and motorcyclist. I've just got my Day Skipper so I feel as though I know it all :-D. Nevertheless, I would like to know if anyone has an opinion on the following question. I asked a tiny little question on scuttlebutt which ran on for 5 or so pages and got me called a troll as well... hope to avoid that this time!

I'm a raggie at heart but it's not very practical for my current lifestyle. I lust after an X Yacht X-34 but it's a bit beyond my budget and, living far from the sea as I do at the moment, it'll just risk becoming a marina queen - if ever I could find a berth!

So, my thoughts turn towards motorboat that I can tow and keep at home when not using. I could imagine a week of camping on a boat in hot places, and could imagine getting up to 60 odd miles off shore (trips of 120nm to some of the islands around here, for example, albeit fair-weather only). We would be a family of two adults and two children, used to camping expeditions in Land Rovers to Africa so not necessarily in need of lots of luxury or comfort, but just wanting something strong enough to survive.

I like small things and I like beautiful things! I like the look of the Beneteau Flyer 6 Grand Prix. Does anyone here know if they're reasonably good (wanted to say "seaworthy", but that word's a bit charged round here...) Would people on here do something like, for example, Barcelona - Alcudia in one of these?

Or would it be better to consider something a bit bigger, the Benny Flyer 8 GP?

Not trolling, just trying to learn! Be gentle with me, please!
 
Boats of this size are weather depentant - even if you have an excellent sea hull, while the boat may well be fine in a blow it will still not be the most comfortable place to be - safe maybe, but not neccessarily pleasant. There is no replacement for water line length or displacement when the weather gets rough.

a 120nm passage is about 6 hours, 5 at best if you can maintain 25knts which is feasible provided the sea state is fairly smooth. You might be better to ask the question will a 6 metre boat be a comfortable place for 4 people to spend at least 5 fairly noisy hours? I am not trying to put you off, just give you some perspective. No reason why you can't do it, and the 60nm runs are easily capable for a small boat.

Other boats that might be worth considering are the Jeanneau Cap Camarats and some of the smaller sports boats from the US manufacturers such as Fourwinns and Searay.

Also worth checking these boats hold enough fuel for the trip, and dont forget to only work on 80% tank capacity.
 
Thanks, I know about the comfort and the need to choose the day carefully, I really wonder if it would be possible if it does all go pear shaped with the weather.

For fuel, one of the guys I've spoken to recons he gets 15 litres an hour at 25 knots.

Is that reasonable or is he exaggerating things a bit?

Good point about the noise!
 
The med is very frequently quite choppy we used to tow a 24 footer there every year before going up to a 37 which is permanently in Spain now. We found in the 24 that other than first thing in the morning and early evening that the ride in the chop was quite uncomfortable (much more so than in the equivalent raggie boat in the same conditions) Be prepared to hang about in marinas for the right conditions for 60nm journeys and sometimes you may not make it at all and have to make do with bay hopping.(which is great incidently!)
 
From experience, it's nearly imposible to predict weather to the sort of accuracy you need. Therefore need a big safety margine, with either boat size, or/and design. Fast boats do not tend to favour bad conditions and speed will reduce accordingly.

I'm not saying you cant do 120 miles in a trailable boat. Probably could loads of times. If you could drop everything at a moments notice. Boat fueled and ready to go. It just dont work like that, so most times a bit iffy, even for a 35/40ft boat.

80% of fuel is mentioned above. I'd be horrifide to even concider that sort of figure. There aint a Texeco station if it goes tits up, or maybe you have to go some where else.

Does anyone know the level, that the boat starts to run out of fuel, on a rough sea??
 
I'm with David on this one the wind can change and the seas get lumpy.
For instance I set ot on a 51nm passage Spain to Africa, in what could only be described as idea conditions. That morning I had already done 20nms along the coast to pick up my passengers in perfect conditions.

Forcast was W3-4 so I knew it would get a bit lumpy further off shore, but hey 50nm at 20kts not long is it? Well the customers wanted to cruise nice and slowly as they where enjoying champers an tapas on the fly. About 12-15 miles into the crossing and they were no longer on the fly as we were all inside for the next 1.5 hrs in 2.5m beam seas.

I was in a 17m plus 21ton boat. Cant imagine what it would have been like in a 6m boat would certainly have turned round.
 
I have a Merry Fisher 625 which is about the same size as the Flyer 6 and we did Poole to Plymouth last year in one hop.

On paper it looks fairly straight forward but we did find it quite a journey in a couple of ways that make me think twice about doing a journey of 100+ miles.

As has already been mentioned, if the sea is flat and you can maintain 20-25kts then it isn't a problem in almost any boat. The trouble is that the sea hardly ever stays the same for any time at all so what you start out with is almost never what you end up with.

Then there is tides. I have a friend who says that with a motor boat you don't need to worry about tides as a few extra knots won't be noticed when doing 20kts. In one sense that is true but what he doesn't account for is the fact that tides are not just about speed. It is the changing state of water, particularly around headlands, that tides have the biggest effect on for us mo'bo'ers. At the main headlands... Anvil point, Portland, Start Point etc, although the sea state was generally good and very able to allow us to sustain 20kts, we found that we had to slow to 8-10kts around these points for 30-45 mins at a time..

OK, we tried to time our rounding of headlands to be at slack water but on a 6-7 hour journey you can't get them all right /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

No matter how good your planning and even with local knowledge, you will have to slow down at some point for sea state unless you are very lucky.

We get 15lts/hour out of our Suzuki DF115 in flat water but rough it up a bit and that drops greatly to nearer 20-25! We had less than 1/4 in the tank when we arrived back in Plymouth... not clever I know but we did have a bolthole into Brixham or Salcombe if we felt that fuel was going to be an issue. It wasn't but it could have been so worth thinking about carefully and ensuring that you have a plan should you end up using more than anticipated. Don't forget... rougher seas = more fuel used!

Noise is a big factor over a long period. We cruise at 18-20kts. The book and saleman suggested 25kts as a cruise. Fine for a quick zap to a local fishing ground but for long distance cruising it is very tiring.

Yes we would do long trips again but only if the weather was such that we could sustain a sensible cruise speed and only if fueling options allowed us to end up at our destination with a sensible reserve.

Would the boat handle bigger seas and worse weather? Almost certainly yes but I certainly wouldn't want to be out in much more than a F4 and 1m seas at the very worst in a boat that size for long. Safe perhaps (depending on conditions, location and experience)... pleasent certainly not. Not for me anyway.

BTW I always insist on taking sensible safety gear on a trip like that, flares, spare radio/GPS etc, all paper charts for trip, full weather gear etc... it can add hugely to the amount of stuff you take and as storage is very limited on a boat this size is can be a bit difficult where to stow everything.
 
OK guys, thanks for the feedback. And it's true, you're all much more relaxed than the Scuttlebutt clan

/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

To be honest, I hadn't appreciated just how affected by sea state the small boats would be!

Y'all learned me some'at!

Thanks
 
We have done similar distances in the med with a 6 and 8 meter boat. The longest was 140 miles Barcelona to Mahon. We always did the trip in company and made sure we had sufficient fuel (with reserve) we used to set off around 5 in the morning to get the best conditions. (We carried full safety kit, spares and have decent mechanical knowledge for brake downs)

However on our last trip we couldnt get a decent weather window to get off the Island. Every morning we would get up and stick our nose out of the marina and do a couple of miles before turning back. We had to rescue the boats by trailer and take the ferry to the mainland (An expensive lesson to learn at nearly 5k expenses for the recovery).

With hind site I think we were very lucky that we didnt get caught off shore when the wind blew up. I boat of the size you are looking at is great for coast hopping and camping with the family, but I would forget about the off shore passages.
 
Well in theory a 6m boat would be capable of making offshore passages but sooner rather than later, you will frighten yourself and your family when the weather turns out to be even just a bit nastier than you thought. Bear in mind the classifications of the EC Recreational Craft Directive. My guess is that most if not all 6m boats are rated no more than Cat C which means the boat is designed for inshore coastal passages only
If you are serious about undertaking offshore passages up to 60nm away from land, then IMHO, you need a boat with a minimum Cat B rating and that probably means a boat in excess of 8m and preferably with twin engines. Obviously at this length trailerability is a problem. If you must have a trailerable boat plus offshore capability, then a RIB would be worth considering
 
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IMHO, you need a boat with a minimum Cat B rating and that probably means a boat in excess of 8m and preferably with twin engines

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I promise, no need to be "humble" with your opinions! I respect what people with more experience say. I just needed to calibrate my expectations /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I'll probably stay with the small boat but just do less "adventurous" things with it, the crawl - walk - run type of progression.

Before this discussion though, I didn't really know where "crawl" stopped and "walk" began...

Thanks for all of the input!
 
"just do less "adventurous" things with it"

As you can see by my last post in the morning my 20nm trip along the coast to Banus was wonderfull, flat seas etc. It was only when eft Banus for Africa and got 15nm out that the big seas arrived, at that point in a 6m boat I would certainly have turned round.

Yup stick to coastal hops.
 
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"just do less "adventurous" things with it"

"snip"

Yup stick to coastal hops.

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Sure, it's probably less adventurous but no less interesting. It's just them islands, like a magnet, calling me.... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
Ok
not sure if any of you have one but the flyer 6 has a 200 litre fuel tank and i would not try to do 120nm in minebut as a boat it is lovely well styled and looks better than most late 90's and 00's boats
mine is for sale 07947 937049 or check out boatsandoutboards website
 
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