⛵️? Certificate of Conformity❓

[nortada]

EUGUIDE_pdf_version.pdf (europeanboatingindustry.eu)

Quote:- 'If the watercraft was not designed and built for the EU market, for instance second-hand imported boats or personal watercraft, it will have to individually undergo a post-construction assessment (PCA) with a notified body to establish whether it meets the Directive’s requirements'.

Since 1/1/21 will this be an issue for British boats in the EU and in practical terms, what does it mean?

I suspect the date-of-build could be all important. Possibly a problem when attempting to sell a boat, built in the UK, in the EU? For popular boats Moodies, Princesses etc. would it be possible to have one in-class udergo a post-construction assessment, then all other boats in that class cleared?

 

[grumpygit]

I am not sure why you are flagging this up because imo nothing has changed. All European and EEA vessels to the best of my knowledge carry the CE certification and no doubt this will remain post Brexit. Also giving that so many UK manufactures use EU companies to build their GRP hulls and supply other components I can't see a problem.
Regarding others, such as age related or as in the case of US manufactures need to be assessed differently if they do not carry the CE certification but this has always been the case. Unfortunately the expense of PCA can cost a fortune so you could say buyers beware.

 

[nortada]

I am not sure why you are flagging this up because imo nothing has changed. All European and EEA vessels to the best of my knowledge carry the CE certification and no doubt this will remain post Brexit. Also giving that so many UK manufactures use EU companies to build their GRP hulls and supply other components I can't see a problem.

Regarding others, such as age related or as in the case of US manufactures need to be assessed differently if they do not carry the CE certification but this has always been the case. Unfortunately the expense of PCA can cost a fortune so you could say buyers beware.

You ask why I raise this issue; then you provide the answer in your last sentence.

As you say, age related so what is that critical date?

 

[Graham376]

I am not sure why you are flagging this up because imo nothing has changed. All European and EEA vessels to the best of my knowledge carry the CE certification and no doubt this will remain post Brexit. Also giving that so many UK manufactures use EU companies to build their GRP hulls and supply other components I can't see a problem.
Regarding others, such as age related or as in the case of US manufactures need to be assessed differently if they do not carry the CE certification but this has always been the case. Unfortunately the expense of PCA can cost a fortune so you could say buyers beware.

Forgetting places such as the US, there were thousands of boats built in the EU such as mine (1988) which are not CE marked and my reading of the document states can't be placed on the market without compliance so, what's the position for these old UK boats now based in the EU and owned by us - third country citizens? Until 31/12, VAT paid boats were free to move throughout EU (including UK) wherever based for as long as we wished, it was all one place and there was no import or export.

What has changed, if anything? Are we able to sell them in EU or would that constitute "placing on the market"? Are they going to be treated as imported when they originally arrived and still rcd exempt or, do they now need to comply?

 

[Tranona]

This may help, although not covering non CE marked boats. There is more information specifically about importing boats into UK where it seems CE marks will not be accepted but boats will require recertification using the new UK equivalent. There is more information on the RYA site, but I can't seem to access it even though I can sign in as a member. The new site looks like a mess to me.britishmarine.co.uk/News/2021/May/Collaboration-between-leisure-marine-associations-continues-with-post-Brexit-requirement

 

[Graham376]

Had a look at the RYA site about RCD and much of the information is just a repeat of that found elsewhere. It does however appear to confirm that the exemption from rcd compliance for boats built in or, in service within the EEA <1998, no longer applies if a boat moves between UK & EU. This still leaves the question about whether the pre 1998 exemption still applies in the EU to boats which were there on 31/12.

 

[nortada]

Had a look at the RYA site about RCD and much of the information is just a repeat of that found elsewhere. It does however appear to confirm that the exemption from rcd compliance for boats built in or, in service within the EEA <1998, no longer applies if a boat moves between UK & EU. This still leaves the question about whether the pre 1998 exemption still applies in the EU to boats which were there on 31/12.

If possible, please post link to the RYA site.

Could this affect you and do you intend to pursue this further?

Currently not planning to sell the boat but never say never.

 

[grumpygit]

You ask why I raise this issue; then you provide the answer in your last sentence.

As you say, age related so what is that critical date?

I still can't see what has changed with the directive apart from creating a topic. I think it may have been a good idea to put this issue on a larger platform within YBW or even on/and other Forums.

The magic date for compulsory CE certification is post 16th June 1998, older boats within the EU/EEA do seem to be exempt.

 

[Graham376]

If possible, please post link to the RYA site.
Could this affect you and do you intend to pursue this further?

Just search rcd within RYA site.

Although UK have new certification rules for boats returning in the future, AFAIK nothing has changed with European regulations but, our situation/status has, we're now third country citizens. A boat imported into Europe has to be RCD compliant so UK boats arriving there in future will be treated in the same way as any other third country.

Many boats are already there, some legally, some not. There is a contradiction in RCD rules. One statement says boats manufactured in EEA and/or in service pre-1998 are exempt from RCD but, in another section says any imported boat placed on the market has to be compliant.

The question is - Do our pre-1998 boats already there on 31/12 maintain their exempt status or will they be treated as imported and have to be compliant if offered for sale?

I can't see any problem if I sell my boat to another Brit who's keeping UK flag but, if selling to someone who wants to change to EU flag, it could be a different ball game.

 

[Tranona]

It sure is a confusing situation and from what I have seen of the discussions and rulings nobody seems to appreciate the complexities, nor the additional cost the new rules will have. I thought the whole idea of Brexit was to reduce the amount of unnecessary regulation, but the very opposite seems to have happened with regard to certification in the UK. What will happen across the EU is anybody's guess.

BTW Flag of registration and ownership has never been an issue in relation to certification - the regulation is an economic one related to "placing on the market" and is unconnected for example with temporary importation under VAT rules, just as there is no connection between Schengen for people and VAT rules for their boats.

 

[grumpygit]

It sure is a confusing situation and from what I have seen of the discussions and rulings nobody seems to appreciate the complexities, nor the additional cost the new rules will have. I thought the whole idea of Brexit was to reduce the amount of unnecessary regulation, but the very opposite seems to have happened with regard to certification in the UK. What will happen across the EU is anybody's guess.

BTW Flag of registration and ownership has never been an issue in relation to certification - the regulation is an economic one related to "placing on the market" and is unconnected for example with temporary importation under VAT rules, just as there is no connection between Schengen for people and VAT rules for their boats.

You are so correct with the "confusing situation" and I would suggest we give things at least this year to see if things pan out for the better. (but please don't hold your breath)

Does this answer a question?
Are all craft required to be marked?
No, the requirement applies only to craft constructed in or imported to the EU or the EFTA countries of Iceland, Norway and Liechtenstein after 16 June 1998. Similarly, the craft must have a length of between 2.5 and 24 metres before it is required to be CE marked.

 

[Graham376]

BTW Flag of registration and ownership has never been an issue in relation to certification - the regulation is an economic one related to "placing on the market" and is unconnected for example with temporary importation under VAT rules, just as there is no connection between Schengen for people and VAT rules for their boats.

The flag of registration can have a bearing in practical terms, when selling. If I were to sell my UK flagged boat to (say) you, we would just complete the usual transfer docs, bill of sale etc and you would change registration into your name. If OTOH I was selling to a Portuguese buyer to register there (I don't know about other countries) the Maritime Authority would carry out a survey and the paperwork trail from new including VAT status would be thoroughly scrutinised. I've heard of cases where engines have been changed and authorities saying boats no longer comply with original spec.

 

[Tranona]

The flag of registration can have a bearing in practical terms, when selling. If I were to sell my UK flagged boat to (say) you, we would just complete the usual transfer docs, bill of sale etc and you would change registration into your name. If OTOH I was selling to a Portuguese buyer to register there (I don't know about other countries) the Maritime Authority would carry out a survey and the paperwork trail from new including VAT status would be thoroughly scrutinised. I've heard of cases where engines have been changed and authorities saying boats no longer comply with original spec.

Yes, I agree, but that is Portuguese rules - not EU and would have existed pre Brexit. Good example of why I suggested that the situation across the EU will be confusing.