Why are survival suits not provided for passengers?

[GabrielTurner]

Solutions to risks are based on reasonable probability of that risk happening. Vessels have twice the capacity of lifeboats incase there is a problem with some of them. They are also maintained and inspected to ensure a high probability of availability. Additionally it is a legal obligation, globally, that crews drill to ensure response times are adequate. Therefore there is an expectation that emergency response processes and equipment will do what it is supposed to do when required. Now, all this may or may not happen depending on the level of inaptitude of the company that runs the vessel and the master that commands the vessel, nevertheless, control activities are in place to ensure performance times and outcomes for emergency response are achievable.

What you are doing is applying multiple failure modes one after the other, irrespective of probability, when in fact the probability of that even happening is so small as to be irrelevant. If one of these improbable events happen and people die the courts decide who was at fault. Actuaries price your life at around $2million, if the cost of controls to keep you alive exceeds that, you can die and insurers can pay out. For example, do you expect a ship to be protected against a meteor impact, as that is the level of absurdity where such approaches end up.

Regarding survival suits, some ferries do have them for passengers as well as cruise ships based on risk assessment. Some information below on the framework that control risks: -

Types of Life-Saving Equipment Onboard Ships

Floating about an environment that does not support human life is a dangerous activity that carries a degree of risk of death if it all goes wrong, you can't run away and hide at sea. If you are planning a cruise in cold waters, then ask the company what safety controls they have in place and whether your safety can be assured to a risk that is ALARP - they will know what you mean if use the term ALARP. Then make the call on whether you should stay on land or go to sea.

Good point, I didn't know that!

Fair point that crew who might accidentally end up in water have one though. Of course I don't expect such protection. Maybe I could invest in my own passenger (not crew) survival suit, put it in my backpack, and wear that at all times on a boat if I'm that paranoid. That way I'll be able to put that on after my lifejacket if I have time or deem it necessary e.g. in the event that it takes a while to get lifeboats and/or rafts ready, or they end up unavailable. Thanks.

 

[GabrielTurner]

Definitely, a fresh spring troll, happily gambolling through the hedgrows and gleefully wasting our time!

How is asking such a question trolling? I'm a newbie to this whole thing, there's a difference.

How does one don a survival suit after accidentally falling into the water?

Edit: I guess, perhaps, one could climb out and don the survival suit then accidentally fall back in again.

That is not what I meant.

However for me as a passenger if I had one and ended up in the water (which is unlikely to be without a lifejacket), then the answer is simple. I could (whilst floating or treading water) get it on over my lifejacket if I had one on. Else I'm probably best off using it as a blanket instead, that way it won't weigh me down. I've swam in clothes before, and those are bad enough!

 

[liyam]

I had to put on a parachute when i went glider flying.. Worked on the theory that you only need it when you dont have it

Yes, same here!

 

[TNLI]

I'm a fan of survival suits, cos I got real lucky on Fleabay with an absolute top of the range fire resistant one made by a company in Finland, it would have cost 1400 quid new, and I got it for 70 quid, although it was missing the gloves!

In a serious accident at sea, having a dry suit available might be a double edged sword if you do not carry it with you. The reason being that if a big ships sinks suddenly, (They often capsize first), the passerngers might be tempted to do a runner back to their cabins rather than the lifeboat deck or muster point. If you stored the dry suits on the lifeboat deck, they would probably get stolen!

 

[PilotWolf]

I'm a fan of survival suits, cos I got real lucky on Fleabay with an absolute top of the range fire resistant one made by a company in Finland, it would have cost 1400 quid new, and I got it for 70 quid, although it was missing the gloves!

In a serious accident at sea, having a dry suit available might be a double edged sword if you do not carry it with you. The reason being that if a big ships sinks suddenly, (They often capsize first), the passerngers might be tempted to do a runner back to their cabins rather than the lifeboat deck or muster point. If you stored the dry suits on the lifeboat deck, they would probably get stolen!

And how long did it take you to put on first time?

W

 

[TNLI]

And how long did it take you to put on first time?

W

About 2 or 3 minutes, as it's a large size. I've purchased a mask and snorkel, as well as new gloves, but still looking for a Kapok or similar lifejacket. I wore it one cold evening and it's real warm, but not tested it in the swimming pool yet, although the zip and liner look like new. It sold for such a low figure cos the pictures were not good, although I must admit that it is a tad dirty and needs a decoke. The fire proof ones were supplied to oil rig and oil tanker crews only. You can get a normal one for about 5 to 700 quid.
Above water · Ursuit
Although I regard dry suits as essential crew gear for cold water operations, they can be very useful even in the tropics, cos sharks initially home in on smell, including that caused by a crew member doing a number one or two after their beloved uncompartmented sinkable boat sinks. Most folks know that the other main way a shark finds its dinner is from detecting abnormal vibrations in the water, but most captains in tropical waters do know how to prevent that isssue resulting in the need to find more crew for the salvage operation.

If your luck really has run out and a shark finds you, the next way they decide on whether to try a bite or two, is visual homing. Alas the Great White and infamous Oceanic White Tip, (They always attack), do pay a lot of interest in floating objectsm, BUT even if one does decide it's dinner time, (Very unlikely if you are in a dry suit and not splashing around), their final method of homing in only occurs after they close their eyes at around 2 to 3 meters, and switch to electric field detection. That should result in the electrical insulation of a dry suit confusing a shark about which leg to bite off first!

 

[chrishscorp]

Failing that why not provide some suitable alternative to survival suits for every passenger and not an arbitrary percentage of them. Like this passenger suit for instance: SeaPass Passenger Suit - Survival suit / Abandonment suit / Emergency suit

I have met ladies who would refuse point blank to wear one of those regardless of whether the ship was on fire, sinking or being attacked by a Kraken

 

[TNLI]

I wonder if the cruise lines who sail into cold waters, would consider renting out dry suits to concerned passengers ?? That way if the ship sank, the cruise line would not be held fully rsponsible, cos the passengers concerned did not pay for the extra safety gear.

 

[BigAlbatrossBird]

Ultimately it's going to come down to it not being considered by whatever powers that be that consider these things that it wouldn't improve safety enough to justify the expense. It's going to be obvious to most of us here what survival suits are and why they are important, but to the average passenger it's going to be different. In an emergency people will scramble straight for the boats regardless of whether there are any suits.

 

[TNLI]

That is not true if you are including life rafts in particular, although it does depend to the safety briefing film to some extent, in addition to how easy it is to find the survival suit in a serious passenger panic situation.

Cost is the real issue, and this particular suit could be a game changer, although something is wrong with the deal as it's far too cheap:
Fladen 1 Piece Flotation Suit | ChasNewensMarine (chastheboat.co.uk)

This is the section of the web site above that I kind of doubt is true, as only Gortex and a few other very expensive materials insulate to the required standard:

In ISO 15027-1 tests at 5 degrees C water temperature body heat loss was only 1.2 degrees after 1 hour when wearing the Fladen one piece suit. One of the few suits in the UK meeting ISO15027-1. Which basically means it is approved and tested as an Immersion Suit protecting the wearer from the cold water, as well as keeping them afloat.

I hope the folks at Practical Boat Owner do some serious tests of the different cheap dry suits, then we will all have a much better idea as to what is worth buying and for what purpose can it be used for.