What boat for my circumstances?
- Thread starter tommy2
- Start date
How did you get on trailer sailing her?
wallacebob
Active member
I’m sure you said in previous post you’re near Wick. First thing would be to spend a morning chatting here : Wick Marina – Wick Harbour Authority. There will be adverts I’m sure stuck in office windows. You’re location makes choice of boats difficult if you want to transport by land from south = expensive. Buy local or buy something easily self trailed ( Hunter 23, Leisure 23, etc) from seller to you.
Yes things seem to be a lot more expensive up here, not just boats but cars etc. I go to the South of England approximately every 6 weeks and do own a large 4x4 so could tow something back if there was a decent cost saving to be had
billyfish
Active member
- Joined
- 6 Oct 2020
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- 455
Scandinavian motor sailer
Biggles Wader
Well-known member
That looks like an Achilles triple keel version. Nice boats, very quick but you will get very wet. Also balsa cored deck so look out for water ingress after 40 years. I wouldnt describe it as a trailor sailor.
No you don’t want aTwister or a Contessa. Dig deep and there was a fab Cornish crabber style trailor sailor that would be perfect for launching. Perfect for a couple of nights away and a cool boat to cruise lochs and coastal waters. Ditch the flash tractor and settle for a tatty one and get a cool boat.
Steveeasy
Steveeasy
Refueler
Well-known member
I never trailed her any real distance or to different sailing areas - but it would have been OK. I decided early on to have a Club mooring - so the trailer mostly sat in the Club yard ... I allowed members to use it ....
When I wanted to do work on the boat ... I would pull boat out on the trailer via the club slipway and then the LR towed her home. I lived about 10mls from the Club.
Once work done ... back to slip and re-launch. The mast was managed by myself and whoever was helping me .. wife or son. Mast was in a good strong tabernacle so it was braced well ....
The boat on the flat bed .... no reason you couldn't with that ... but I would suggest there is a reason she is on a flat bed and not a trailer.
She is also what I term a 'weekender' ... large cockpit which reduces cabin volume. More for those who are going for a sail rather than a few days away.
srm
Well-known member
Over the years I have made quite a few mistakes with tides and swell giving some very uncomfortable times in rough water. This is why I suggest a boat that will look after you in such conditions. Boats that can be easily pulled off and on a trailer generally have a lower range of positive stability. Because of the necessary design compromises their angle of vanishing stability will be a significantly less than for a deep keel boat. Vanishing stability is the angle of heel at which the boat will invert rather than self right.
Keep the trailer boat head into the waves and it should be OK but get hit by a breaking wave on the side for any reason and you could be rolled. But usually only if the wave height is equal or greater than the boat's beam. This will seem extreme to many people who have offered suggestions as they will not have met such conditions. I am not trying to scare, its not going to be a problem for most of the time, but in those waters it just might be and not necessarily in strong winds.
One simple example: a fine sunny summer morning I overslept at anchor and set off through Papa Sound (between Papa Stour and Shetland Mainland). Rather than go through at the start of the tide as intended it was now at full stream. With just enough wind to sail I happily set out into the sound, only to see it full of breaking waves as a big swell was running in against the tide. Unable to turn back against the stream I continued keeping on the edge of the breaking waves. This was in the Trintella 29 and in the narrowest part of the sound I had the wave crest ahead and the trough astern. I only went through one breaking wave which only splashed the decks but to port the seas were violently breaking. I started in to the sound standing at the tiller but was flushed out into the Atlantic sitting down with weak knees. The rest of the passage to Scalloway was a pleasant lazy summer sail comfortably riding the long Atlantic swells.
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Refueler
Well-known member
The matter of positive stability ........... many older and not so old boats cannot actually be termed full self righting. Once they reach near or at horizontal in a knock down - many will not come back up ... water has flooded cockpit and most likely into cabin.
I know many are going to argue that ... but its fact of the boats of yesteryear ...
The development of trailer sailers has come on a lot since those days ... as well as that of boats of size that can be drawn into trail-sail.
My Sunrider 25 suffered two knock downs one after another from the infamous air draft that comes off Cowes East Point when winds are in a particular direction. I was cutting through the moorings on way back to Langstone sails nicely set ... BHAM over she went .... let fly and she luckily started to come up before she'd reached that critical angle ... as I was sorting sheets and gear - she went over again ..... came back up again luckily before critical.
Its something you never forget.
I know many are going to argue that ... but its fact of the boats of yesteryear ...
The development of trailer sailers has come on a lot since those days ... as well as that of boats of size that can be drawn into trail-sail.
My Sunrider 25 suffered two knock downs one after another from the infamous air draft that comes off Cowes East Point when winds are in a particular direction. I was cutting through the moorings on way back to Langstone sails nicely set ... BHAM over she went .... let fly and she luckily started to come up before she'd reached that critical angle ... as I was sorting sheets and gear - she went over again ..... came back up again luckily before critical.
Its something you never forget.
srm
Well-known member
Definitely agree. I deliberately did not use the term "self righting".
I have also sailed on some modern boats with CE Cat A plates, indicating they are considered fit for ocean sailing, but I would not want to make a long passage in them without serious modifications.
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dunedin
Well-known member
A lifting keel Dehler 25 on a road trailer has just popped up on Facebook, from a seller based in Forres listed at £9,500:Ono.
Sounds like might be worth a look. On Boats and Parts For Sale Scotland group, which would be worth joining if not already done so
PS. In my view a boat which has been sailed recently is generally a much better bet than something that has lain ashore for ages
Sounds like might be worth a look. On Boats and Parts For Sale Scotland group, which would be worth joining if not already done so
PS. In my view a boat which has been sailed recently is generally a much better bet than something that has lain ashore for ages
That looks a very capable little boat - although the outboard is not the best way of propelling a boat in heavy conditions.
However getting back to basics, to meet your expectations of a boat that can sail well in demanding conditions and allow you to spend several days afloat cruising there is a huge theoretical choice and many have been suggested already (like the Twister, Folkboat, Contessa and a whole host of others from the 1960-1980s in your budget. BUT all are incompatible with "trailer sailing" - that is launched every time you want to sail. This is because of size weight, draft and the sheer complexity of launching and recovery on a regular basis.
While you may think that boats are cheaper in the south, what you will find is that there are far more available, but finding a good one is enormously time consuming as you will "kiss a lot of frogs before you find your princess". A suitable boat will not have a road trailer, will almost certainly need the mast taken down and prepared for transport, and will need a crane to lift onto transport. I have recently moved a boat (a bit bigger than you are looking at) from Wales to Poole. It cost £2500. You may be lucky and find a boat that will sit on a flat bed and load with a HIAB which will knock about £500 off the cost.
It is not the purchase price of the boat that is important. The key figure is the overall cost of buying it and getting it into use where you want it including all the transport, lifts and any work that needs to be carried out to make the boat usable. On a £10k budget and not buying locally, the boat cost needs to be sub £7k.
I think you may be correct it is the Achilles triple keel. I did phone about it last year and was sent pictures and price. But they wanted £6500 for it, which seemed steep when I compared their price online.
My first boat was a Dehler 22 massive rig for a boat that was only a tonne. Water ballast tanks. I was told not to buy it by an expert. So I bought it. Christ it was like a rocket ship. Be great fun now. Single line reefing. Easy to tow. Apparantly for German lakes and the like. It was very smart.
Steveeasy
srm
Well-known member
There are lots of boats that I would be happy to sail on German lakes, or indeed withing the confines of Scapa Flow though I have plugged up the Flow in a 55 ft motor boat throwing spray from the bow clear over the boat. However, I have a high level of self preservation and am a lot more selective about what I would choose to sail out of Scapa Flow on.
srm
Well-known member
Owners always have an inflated view of the value of their boat when it comes to selling. They need to be gently guided to a realistic price. Its been on the market for a while so there are obviously few potential buyers around. When selling my last boat the broker expected offers at 20% below asking, and that was in a popular sailing area. You could open negotiations a lot lower if you are convinced the boat will suit you.
@Tranona was spot on about having to allow for the extra costs of getting a boat home, whether by road or by sea. I always use the latter but that is for boats a bit bigger than you are looking at. I have sailed the length of Britain a few times as a result, usually after a month or so full time getting the boat ready.
Yes but the asking price was not even in reach of what I found online. Last year I found examples of the same Achilles triple keel boat for £1500. Thats a massive way off £6500. I guess some people just don't need / want to sell. If they don't need the money, they can just hang onto it forever more.
Looking around, boats in Scandinavia seem to be a fair bit cheaper. I even toyed with the idea of finding something in Scandinavia and paying someone to sail it over with me across the North Sea. Don't think I would like to do a trip like that on my own quite yet.