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Welcome to the Jester Challenge forum

Twisterowner

New member
Joined
23 Jul 2005
Messages
6,876
[ QUOTE ]
Get over it live your life and manage the daily risks as you have done since your mother let you go to school on your own.


[/ QUOTE ]

I don't understand why you are addressing these offensive remarks to me. Perhaps you have not read my posts properly. I thought I had made it perfectly clear that I am all in favour of single-handed sailing and consider many other everyday activities far more dangerous. In fact I sail singlehanded myself, although nothing more ambitious than a couple of cross channel trips so far. [If my old-age pension was sufficient to fund it, I might well do some longer trips]

The reason I suggested that Oen carry out a risk assesment is so that he might come to realise that single-handed sailing is not as hazardous as he seems to think. I don't need any convincing.
 

JREdginton

New member
Joined
15 May 2006
Messages
155
I think john may have missed the threaded nature of the forum and posted a retort to the more negative posts againt your own comments by accident /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif It is not too obvious about the threading till you hit the 'Threaded/Flat' button up the top. At least we have not fallen into the 'Rules' debate yet /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif though I am sure we will in the fullness of time /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 

eebygum

Member
Joined
6 Nov 2002
Messages
290
Location
Manchester
My 14 year old daughter took about 5 seconds to do a risk assessment on my entry in the JC 2010 and told me I was not allowed to go......

I was very tempted to say that there is no such thing as 'Not' ....but I decided that was a big mistake to say to such an intelligent girl as she will probably throw it back at me every day !

To achieve the most out of life somtimes you have to accept breaking the convention of rules (collesion regs).

CHeers
 

Blueboatman

Well-known member
Joined
10 Jul 2005
Messages
8,696
When sailing singlehanded I always used to regard myself as the Maintenance Man !

Put simply that involved routinely inspecting all the gear for chaff or failure,having the knowleadge, ability and facilities to build ,or repair most any of the items on the boat or to have suitable replacements and backups to hand...to keeping energy levels up with superb cooking,the mind rested with intelligent reading and the body rested with plenty of quality sleeping and powernaps.....

To mention 'risk assessment examinations' for singlehanded offshore stuff etc is to me a bit of a larff...Ask Seastart who they routinely get called out to...It aint fatigued singlehanders,more like fully RYA qualified awb skippers with flat batteries who simply have to be somewhere on Monday morning...
I think PBO have hit on a winner with this forum.In an updated sense which reflects the enhanced capabilities of more recent small boats ,PBO has returned to its routes,to the spirit of editor Denny Dessouters original PRACTICAL,HANDS ON concept.
Well done Jake K !
 

johndisney

New member
Joined
28 Jan 2007
Messages
6
Location
South East
I apologise if you felt offended that is not my intention, my remarks are made in general and as it is my first response i did miss the thread. But having said that I do find that many people use H&S as an excuse for not doing something and for not taking responsibility, again not aimed at you.

Mea Culpa
 

johndisney

New member
Joined
28 Jan 2007
Messages
6
Location
South East
Thanks for the info, your right I did miss the thread, no doubt it will start a debate if nothing else. I did not mean offend anyone just make them think about it.
 

LeonF

New member
Joined
25 Jun 2001
Messages
1,185
Location
South London
I remember reading an article by a French yachtsman where he said that one should always sail as if one is single handed. Those of us who often take non sailing friends for a jaunt in the summer, realise the value of this approach.
Two years ago on a short trip south down the east coast in a new boat the weather blew up. The strong wind warning was not in place when I left. I made errors of judgement and became fatigued, and went aground on the Barrow sands and was towed off by the RNLI. If I wasn't so tired I would have thrown the hook out ( I had been out for 14 hours, stemming the tide for 6) and waited. The tide had turned in my favour and was rising. I was not proud of having to finally ask for help. However the whole experience has made me a better sailor in every way. I still single hand, but take less risks, pace myself, and allow for fatigue. Much less gung ho. This filters down into when I have crew on board. I think this forum will have much to contribute.
 

TimDaniel

New member
Joined
11 Jan 2007
Messages
74
Don't feel bad John_Disney .... there are some people on here who go out of their way to be 'dicky opposite' no matter what the discussion - I suspect it comes from leading very boring lives!
 

JREdginton

New member
Joined
15 May 2006
Messages
155
If the actually have lives /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif I mean to say, handle of 'Eon' and avatars of 'Neo'. Maybe life is best left 'virtual' with not too much risk, mind you, even virtual death in the 'Matix' was real enough /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 

FAITIRA

New member
Joined
22 Jan 2007
Messages
1,548
Location
France
Don,t knock the guys who want to do it, your lot will make it illegal soon enough. Grow up and throw the shades away.
 

FAITIRA

New member
Joined
22 Jan 2007
Messages
1,548
Location
France
Well said, bravo, load of c..p from the risk assesors (is that how it,s spelt?). Bill.
 

JREdginton

New member
Joined
15 May 2006
Messages
155
[ QUOTE ]
throw the shades away

[/ QUOTE ]

Only just twigged it, they must be 'peril sensitive' /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

(To be fair to 'oen' have found some realistic stuff of his on the now gone UKSA thread. The man is not totally silly)
 

Noddy

Member
Joined
22 Jun 2005
Messages
621
Location
Thames Estuary
[ QUOTE ]
Don,t knock the guys who want to do it, your lot will make it illegal soon enough. Grow up and throw the shades away.

[/ QUOTE ]

I suspect that people will keep doing it even when it is illegal.

Perhaps part of the attraction is to get away from the man made twaddle and face a bit of reality.

If this is so, then the more rules and regulations that are imposed the greater the desire to do Jester type things.
 
G

Guest

Guest
[ QUOTE ]
Rules are for the guidance of wise men, and the obedience of fools.

[/ QUOTE ]

Rules are the products of power-hungry bureacrats who seek to justify their own existence. 'Safety' is usually the excuse used to introduce unpopular restrictive legislation. Car seat belts, ID Cards to combat terrorism - plenty of examples to choose from.

Laws are made by politicians for whom many people have the highest contempt - and we wonder why people don't respect their laws anymore.

"Life - a sexually-transmitted condition with a 100% mortality rate."
Enjoy it while you can.

Colin
 

andlauer

New member
Joined
15 Mar 2007
Messages
310
Location
Paris France
Bonjour
In aeronautics studies have shown that the safety level decreesed with the number of rules.
Eric /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 

Noddy

Member
Joined
22 Jun 2005
Messages
621
Location
Thames Estuary
This is really about the role of rules in managing risk.

Lots of rules means that you don't have to think for yourself.

The motive behind this can either be laziness or fear.

I guess if someone is more afraid of the authority figure (punishment for transgression) than the real danger then they have 'taken their eye off the ball' so to speak. I guess this is also true if they trust that 'all is well because the rules have it covered.'

The hard bit for some is having to think for yourself as it can mean getting into conflicts.

Guidelines are better than rules.
 
G

Guest

Guest
[ QUOTE ]
This is really about the role of rules in managing risk.
<snip>
Guidelines are better than rules.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sure.

A good example in support of my previous comment about 'safety' being the rationale often used by authorities to impose restrictive legislation, is the case of Sven Yrvind (Lundin), who had sailed his small boat BRIS across the Atlantic and even around Cape Horn, only to be told on his arrival in Canada that his boat was considered too small to be seaworthy (i.e. a safety issue), and he was forced to transport his boat into the USA by road in order to continue his journey.

I can understand an antagonistic attitude towards wholesale irresponsible behaviour - especially if the rescue services are likely to be involved. But when the seaworthiness of a craft has been amply demonstrated along with the seamanship of it's skipper, then I really can't see any justification for such prohibition.
Providing a skipper is prepared to sign a disclaimer - accepting full responsibility for his (or her !) actions, then one ought to be granted the basic human right to risk injury or death - providing of course that this doesn't impinge on anyone else's right to safety and security in the process.
Isn't this right automatically granted to mountain climbers, pot-holers, hang-glider pilots, free-fall parachutists and the like ?

Colin
 
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