Perry8007
Member
They have the same plus on them
Vids on YouTube blackmail kad44
Hi they have the same plugs on them
Some videos on YouTube
Blackmail kad44
The last two I think
Cheers perry
Volvo penta kad44 only revs to 1200rpm
- Thread starter Perry8007
- Start date
Vids on YouTube blackmail kad44
Some videos on YouTube
Blackmail kad44
The last two I think
Cheers perry
Perry8007
Member
Hi what do I do now it’s a brand new pump been tested by too diesel shops both have said the pump is spot on
Not much I can do at the moment as we are in lock down
Cheers Perry
Not much I can do at the moment as we are in lock down
Cheers Perry
Heckler
Active member
How does the stop system work? Is it power on to activate solenoid to stop?
Heckler
Active member
Whats the buzzing noise on start up?
Heckler
Active member
Ive just come in to this. forget for the moment all the electronics and blowers for now. Let’s do simplistically eh? A Diesel engine works by fuel and air going bang at the correct time. Most of them work on a wide open air intake system, they speed up when you inject more fuel in. The blowers etc give more air so that more fuel can be injected to get more power. If there isn’t enough air going in (or it can’t get out due to a blocked exhaust) then black smoke comes out and it won’t rev up. In this case, no black smoke and looking at his Youtube clips difficulty in starting. So indicative of lack of fuel, a point made by VP. He says all things have been changed and tested and it works on a Merc pump. So no restrictions in the onboard fuel system. The pump shop says that the pump tests ok from the point of view of fuel delivery across all ranges and at all speeds. So fuel in, no restriction, pump shop says pump ok, so no restriction and the throttle control must be working and yet symptoms and evidence say not enough fuel! So what else can cause lack of fuel? The Bosch VE pump has a stop solenoid on it, On my VP MD22 it has to be powered on to stop the engine, on some VE pumps they are powered on to run the engine. If that stop solenoid is faulty or the wrong one, that could be the issue. Partial flow of fuel. I would check it is the right one and that it is opening fully.
volvopaul
Well-known member
Stop solenoid is power to stop .
in my years there has only been issues with the stop solenoid in that it either doesn’t stop the engine due to the pull coil going open circuit .
Performance issue at full revs on the 300 where the fuel demand actually pulls the plunger down with suction due to weak spring .
other issues with the cushion drive in the pump breaking up blocking the fuel pathway to the cam head , which after 2 strip downs I can’t see this now.
its obviously a fuel supply issue inside the pump , simple reasoning no fuel = no bang .
id be throwing that pump away or better still go and fit it to another engine that will decide it’s fate . Been here with a 43.
volvopaul
Well-known member
Perry I see your in NZ I might be over this year if the Silver Fern rally runs.
petem
Well-known member
Is it a brand new Volvo Pump at NZ$12,000 or just a similar Bosch pump?
Heckler
Active member
As I said and quoted you, lack of fuel, but on the test bench it tests ok. So again, as you agree, issue within the pump. I think I saw him switch the ign to off to stop the engine. I couldn’t see him go to the right as we normally do with VP panels to activate stop, so has someone put a vehicle stop Solenoid on there? The pump shop will be used to testing vehicle ones which are not the same as ours, so wiring it up on the rig wouldn’t show an issue.
PS thinking after I posted and pondering on your anecdote about fuel flow pulling the stop solenoid closed, if the wrong one is on there, power to run, power to hold it open all the time whilst running, if the wrong one, is the voltage or connection right to hold it open against fuel flow?
volvopaul
Well-known member
activate to stop is on the ignition key , it’s the earlier 40 and 60 series dash that had a separate stop button , 44 is on later 16 pin loom used right up until D series came in.
problem with pump shop is that a dyno motor is driving the pump not the engine .
The problem here is the engine is driving the pump so unless it gives fuel in progression it won’t pick up speed.
as I’ve said try the pump on another engine or bin it.
Heckler
Active member
The prob here is taking a punt at getting a non VP one! The shop says his original one is fine, how to know if a non VP one is?
Heckler
Active member
When I said go to the right I was referring to the key, I didn’t see him turn the key to the right. If he isn’t turning it to the right then it is stopping the engine by just switching the engine to off, indicating power off is witching the solenoid. If that is so then the wrong stop solenoid is fitted. As I said, the shop maybe didn’t spot that and just activated it by power on to test it?
Heckler
Active member
Ah, just spotted the buzz is when the clutch goes in on the supercharger
Heckler
Active member
When Perry comes on line tonight can he confirm whether the key just goes to off to stop or does he turn to the right against the spring to stop. This will tell us whether the right stop solenoid is fitted.
BartW
Well-known member
Perry,
are you 100% sure that the timing of the pump is correctly positioned ?
I know nothing about Kad engines, they look like mechanical injection pump,
you need to be 100% sure that the positioning of the pump gear is correct, and timing is correct accordingly
is there no possibility that the gear or whatever linkeage with the crancshaft is wrongly positioned ?
sorry if stating the obvious or not relevant for this engine
are you 100% sure that the timing of the pump is correctly positioned ?
I know nothing about Kad engines, they look like mechanical injection pump,
you need to be 100% sure that the positioning of the pump gear is correct, and timing is correct accordingly
is there no possibility that the gear or whatever linkeage with the crancshaft is wrongly positioned ?
sorry if stating the obvious or not relevant for this engine
volvopaul
Well-known member
If the timing is 1 tooth out the engine will not start even if the pump slots are fully adjusted in either direction , trust me I’ve been there .
To time the pump correctly you do need a dial gauge with correct plunger attachment , timing position pin and more importantly the tool that slots in the advance piston which is a Volvo tool , without this you cannot time the 44 or300 correctly .
The point is that the merc pump which is roughly the same VE pump all be it it’s calibrated to give fuel for 250hp works so it’s got to be the pump.
As for the stop solenoid scenario , if a road vehicle type was fitted it wouldn’t bypass fuel into the cam head so it wouldn’t even start .
Heckler
Active member
The stop solenoid scenario, I saw in one of his clips someone switching the switch to off and the engine stopping. It didn’t appear to be turned to the right to provide power to the solenoid. When they try to start, in several of the sequences, the engine struggles to start, similar to trying to start a mechanical linkage engine with the stop cable half pulled. If what I saw is correct then perhaps some one has been modifying things? and there is an issue with the solenoid doing weird things? As I have said, several shops have said that the pump is ok and I am not going to repeat what I posted above. This has been going on for months, all sorts of theories abound. I used to work in Africa and the Middle East, fixing things like this. We were 3 months down the supply line with out the luxury of being able to just say “oh it’s no good, put a new one on” careful inspection and analysis would say whether it was good or not. The shops say good, it works on the test rig, the Merc pump showed the infrastructure is good, so what else is there that can slow or stop fuel flow? No harm in ruling out the stop solenoid, all the advice so far has failed. So Perry, the big question is do you turn the key to off or to the right to stop the engine?
volvopaul
Well-known member
He will turn key fully anti-clockwise to turn engine off which gives battery positive to stop solenoid ; this is an energise to stop pump so requires no power to solenoid to start engine , it has flow of fuel to cam head all the time unlike an automotive engine.
volvo do this to ensure the engine will continue to run in the event of a total power loss from the batteries.
Heckler
Active member
Paul,
I am fully aware of how VP switches work. I keep saying this in the hope that Perry will read and confirm. On one of his YouTube clips, I am sure that I saw a hand turn the switch to off only to stop the engine, it didn’t go fully anti clock wise!! Ie to the right!! All I have consistently said is that we should get him to confirm that!! If he does then there is another avenue to explore! Which has been my point all along!