Scimitar 21ft Saro one design

[Rappey]

I have several jibs you can have. I’m away for another week, then I can send details and postage costs. David

Can't thank you enough. Will be great to have a correct fitting sail..
Look forward to your return.

 

[David Balkwill]

Right, I've found the sails. There are two jibs you can have. Both are used but are not damaged and will be fine for cruising, teaching.
The first is a Westaway. 6.3m luff, 2.3m foot. Light material. Was fitted with hanks, but I removed them since I set the jibs free from the forestay. I also removed the luff rope and threaded a steel cable so the sail can be set free and take the load from the forestay. This is the sail in the two sailing photos below. Looks fine.
The second is a Rockall. 4.8m luff, 2.8m foot. Was also fitted with hanks. Already had a steel luff cable. I've added a strop at the head so the haliard length is the same for both.
In a bag together they weigh 5.3kg. I'll check with the post office or other carriers tomorrow, they may refuse a bag and ask for a box which may add a bit of weight and cost, we'll see. Here are some photos. I'll need your contact details, address, e-mail and phone number for the postage.
Regards
David

 

[Rappey]

Fantastic . Will pm the information.

 

[veedub1955@]

Morning again guys, back on with getting my Scimitar back on the water, will be moored on Llyn Brenig Denbighshire, just up the road from me in Denbigh. There's another one at the club so look forward to racing it at some point

 

[Rappey]

After an incredible act of kindness from David Balkwill sending me two jibs I've now sailed many miles around portsmouth harbour . Heard a few "lovely looking boat" comments from passing boats.

 

[michael beringer]

Hi.
I also have a lot of drawings of the Scimitar, If you PM me I can arrange for you to have the various drawings etc.

 

[michael beringer]

I would be very interested in drawings of the Scimitar rig or dimensions for the Genoa as this is missing from the Scimitar I have just bought.
The Laurent Giles archive is in suspension at the moment.

 

[Alberto muñoz]

Hello! I would be very interested in the drawings of the boat.

 

[AlmazAndy]

Hi Alberto
All the original drawings for the Saro Scimitar are held by Barry van Geffen in New Zealand who bought the rights to them and many other older, archived Laurent Giles designs as I understand. You can either buy copies of whichever drawings of the boat you really need - there are lots and lots of them - or alternatively I bought a summary booklet for the boat which includes some drawings and lots of information and specifications. You can e-mail Barry at info@laurentgilesarchive.com. I found him to be really really helpful and especially interested in chatting (by e-mail) about my boat, not least as I'd just installed a Torqeedo electric drive to it. My boat is based on the River Hamble near Southampton UK. Where are you? Do you have one these lovely classic 'gentleman's yachts' ? I've done many upgrades to mine and if you're interested, I'd be happy to tell you more about them.
Best of luck getting drawings from Barry, but I think you'll find him a very useful contact for information about these great boats.
Cheers
Andrew
Southampton UK

 

[AlmazAndy]

Matt Look closely at having an electric outboard. The Torquedo is pricey but has an excellent reputation. You will probably be forced to go electric given your sailing location. I assume this is for a get you home in flat calm conditions that can occur in your non tidal location.
Certainly two strokes are a no no. Fitting a 4 stroke on the stern is possible but not easy to operate. Electric can be remote controlled.
We still have the bolt on side bracket that is a Saro original supply. They are a bit cumber some to fit and carry but make operation of an outboard much easier than one mounted on the stern.
An alternative would be to have a cross beam board with an outboard mounted on one end. This could be lashed down across the boat behind the snubbing winches.

Cheapest option is a single sweep oar and a single rowlock. Early days of Scimitar was "Seagull era". We found a good long single sweep would allow a boat to be moved against a 3 knot tide when the seagull was probably more useful as an anchor! Needs an able person swinging on the oar and someone else steering. We used a more reliable 2hp evinrude twin two stroke in later years. It took us three hours to go two miles against the spring tide at Menai Bridges! Stern mounting with a heavy four stroke will slow your boat down horribly when sailing.

 

[AlmazAndy]

Well in case you, or anyone else is interested, I fitted a Torqueedo Cruise Pod 2.0 saildrive unit to my Scimitar. It's absolutely brilliant and well worth the expense. A terrific piece of kit and a million miles better than an outboard. Happy to provide more info about it, and how I fitted it to anyone who's interested.
Andrew
Southampton
Saro Scimitar 'Almaz' based on the River Hamble

 

[Rhun]

Hi all!
I just got a Saro Scimitar 21, registered in year 1964. Still needs some work on the surfaces, but I hope to have it ready to sail the Solent as soon as possible.
Is there any owner of one of these that can share experience with the boat?

cheers!

Hi Carina,
How did you get on with your Saro Scimitar boat project? I’m about to buy one myself to sail around in Cardigan Bay. Any info on performance, mast configuration and all round capabilities would be of great value. They look like indestructible boats but also a wet ride in any kind of chop!
Regards

Rhun

 

[Rhun]

I can probably tell you anything you need to know about them. My father had No 9 Anina.She was based in the Menai Strait for most of the 60s. The class was doing well with fleets growing there, Abersoch, River Crouch, and River Dart. She was designed as a plastic XBoat replacement. They were made in the now long closed Saunders Roe (Saro) flying boat servicing facility near Beaumaris with the exception of a couple moulded by Ferranti in Bangor after the moulds had been sold to them or Dickies.
Dickies decided to churn out plastic copies of the very pretty local Conwy fife ODs and this effectively killed the local class off. There were some attempts to revive the class at Port Dinorwic sailing club but these were short lived. My brother still has No 53 Tryphena stored in a garage and she has been fully restored.
He designed and I built a four wheeled drop chassis design trailer for trailing this boat for which he still has cad designs and box section steel cutting plans.
The boat was the wettest boat I have ever had the displeasure to sail. Racing in any wind against tide meant continuous use of a pump and or extensive bailing with a bucket. If the boat had any water in it the lack of any forward bulkhead meant any return leg down wind was fraught with potential of driving the boat under any boat stopping waves! I know there is one still lost in a big hole near Gallows Point Beamaris!
I have never seen any of the original sail plans with a three quarter rig other than one developed much much later in the class history by a lone voice owner. The huge cost of replacing mast and sails was more than enough to encourage more potential owners of a plastic Conwy Fife and the eventual demise of the class at the RAYC.

The substantial mast head rig was virtually indestructible. It was well supported by twin backstays and dual lowers and there was very limited potential for encouraging any mast bend or sail flattening. In our first year of ownership we had only a standard main , a storm jib, a huge balloon spinney and a Genoa that had so much overlap in it that even the helm couldn't see behind even from the aft helm position. Totally impractical for short tacking or racing in any fleet especially with a family crew. I know the Spinnaker was cut down in size to about a third of it's original area. The big Genoa was banned even though the performance off wind on a reach was astounding!
The boat was offered with a cuddy for Cruising that could have provided some respite for any forward crew who were affectionately christened the sponges.

There was indeed a sailing school at Holyhead and also one at Gibralter that used these boats for training.

When we were refurbishing no 53 we kept an eye out for second hand bargains and an old HH sailing school boat came up for sale complete with trailer on E Bay.
The boat was a wreck the trailer was just about road worthy. I am sorry to say the hull was beyond repair and was cut up. The lead keel was sold off at a very good price! The scrap man had never seen 3/4 of a ton of lead in one single compact lump.

In our ownership the only major problem was the total loss of a rudder. The original build incorporated a galvanized steel tubular rudder shaft encapsulated in the gf blade.I was at the helm when the steel tube finally gave in to corrosion with the tube shearing off just below the hull at the top of the rudder. I dont know if later boats had the same design but ours had a new rudder moulded and fitted using a solid phosphor bronze shaft.

In our ownership we have enjoyed hours of safe sailing in sheltered waters. It can be driven easily by a 3hp ob using the factory option side mount bracket. We were also quite profficient at using a single sweep oar on calm days. It also came in very useful for pushing off after running aground! The keel has a large flat area on its bottom and the boat will dry out upright on it unless encouraged to lean over. LEGS could be fitted using the rowlock holes in the side deck coaming. it is important that the rowlock holes are bunged should you ever deliberately leave the boat to dry out on her side. The small diameter hole allows a very large amount of water to ingress whilst the boat lifts off its side on a returning tide.

I recently had a casual conversation with a visitor passing my boat in Port Dinorwic marina. It turned out that he was the Manager of Ferranti the GF builders of many small dinghies based in Bangor. He remembered the day that two members of the then Class association from the Dart came to view the hull and deck moulds with a view to having more boats moulded. The moulds had been carefully preserved and were offered at a very very low price to the CA. The bosses also told them there would be no negotiation on the price. They mistakenly thought that returning after a long lunch they would be able to take away the moulds for their own use at their bargain offer of £1.00 .The manager had them ready for them but cut up in to pieces to reflect the value they had offered.

Steve

Hi Steve,
Interesting article about the Saro Scimitar. I’ve just bought 1 down in Barry. She’s on a trailer but not road worthy. Need her on a yard trailer. If you still have plans for yours then I’d be interested to hear from you. Where do you sail yours?

Rhun

 

[Rhun]

If you PM me I can send you a lot of information and plans for the Saro.

Hi there,
If you still have plans for the Saro Scimitar I’d be interested in seeing them. Recently purchased one in Barry with intention of doing some work to it.
Thanks

 

[Peterdownunder]

Won the racing part of the Rendez-vous de l'Erdre festival of Jazz and Belle Plaisance this week-end. Only 70 boats this year, and few of those were seriously racing, but it does show that the hull shape works well, and the gaff rig with the topsail up high catches wind that other boats can't get at. The only boats in front of me at the finish were a Fireball and a Flibustier dinghy, and only by 3 seconds. Their ratings are much faster than mine, so it was a clear cut thing.View attachment 98083View attachment 98083View attachment 98084View attachment 98085

Hello David. It was great see photos of Sunshine. We owned her from 1996 to 2002. She was moored at Alresford Creek for most of that time where we sailed the Colne, Blackwater rivers.
I have many fond memories of her amazing performance under sail. We now cruise the Queensland coast on our Whitsunday 42. She is well suited to the cruising life, but a slug to sail compared to Sunshine.

 

[NickDunn]

I have Sarah. Hull No 80. Sail 84. In Brixham. Had her for 40 years. Initially Torbay then Falmouth then back to Torbay.