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RYAS ADVICE for return to boating in Scotland

JumbleDuck

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8 Aug 2013
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21,137
Location
SW Scotland
If I am right, and some boaty places like Marinas or Boatyards are actually stipulating who and whom can visit theit establishments based upon estimated mileages traveled they are beyond contempt and clearly organising the 'next' collapse of the boating market.
On the contrary, I think that would be laudable public-spiritedness. The suggestions/request/order that we do no travel is not a pointless exercise of power; it's to stop people dying and private businesses which help by discouraging the stupid, the selfish and the ignorant should be commended.
 

mm42

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9 Sep 2014
Messages
283
Location
Scarborough
Might ask, wtfs has travelling to a Boaty place got to do with the RYA, RNLI, Harbour Master etc etc
Because every time you go to sea you’re elevating the risk of requiring assistance. If you’ve sailed for some time you must know people who’ve needed rescuing through no fault of their own, hardware failure, collision, medical emergency etc. You might even have needed rescuing yourself.

It is impossible to socially distance yourself aboard a lifeboat, so every time they or, as a lifeboat coxswain, should I say we, are called we’re elevating the risk to ourselves, the shore crew, and all our families when we go home.

As a professional mariner I know the draw of the sea as much as anyone, and how frustrating it is not to be sailing, but these are unusual circumstances and need everyone to work together.

Essentially if you rush back to sea you’re making the decision to prioritise your enjoyment over other people’s safety.
 

webcraft

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Cyberspace
.
For what it is worth, I don't see any great danger in driving 20 miles - or even 50 - to your boat. You would be allowed to do that in Scotland if you were visiting an elderly relative, it is only for exercise that a 5 mile limit is suggested.

Of more significance is the risk posed of an incident at sea when this is peoples'first time on a boat this season, they have not perhaps had as much time for preparation as usual and they may be unfamiliar with sailing single-handed or short-handed.

If you live in Scotland and want to make your own assessment of the risks involved the most detailed and up to date website is this one: it is an improving

Scotland Coronavirus Tracker

It is an improving position, but there are still 168 infections in Argyll and Bute, 2 new deaths in the past week but no new infections. But if you are travelling from Glasgow City, East or West Dumbartonshire or North Lanarkshire, the rate of new infections is still worryingly high and you are increasing the risk of spreading the disease to areas with much lower rates of infection when you travel.

I think the main point to consider when rationalising our own behaviour is that full lockdown could be imposed with frightening rapidity just as the sailing season is really getting going again, and that is what we want to avoid. With this in mind, my main concern is that boat owners from outside Scotland living in areas in England with much higher rates of infection could inadvertently screw it all up for us.

This pandemic is far from over.

- W
 

BlowingOldBoots

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15,593
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Scotland.
On the contrary, I think that would be laudable public-spiritedness. The suggestions/request/order that we do no travel is not a pointless exercise of power; it's to stop people dying and private businesses which help by discouraging the stupid, the selfish and the ignorant should be commended.
Unfortunately JD I don't think a radius around ones locality discourages " the stupid, the selfish and the ignorant" from practising ill considered behaviour. Of course it is a numbers game and limiting numbers will reduce risk but if it is not hard wired in for the whole country then individual organisations may find their actions futile.

The issue is that the majority will, when given an inch, take a mile, not out of badness, but due to the psychology of risk normalisation i.e. it will not happen to them, they have been living with this for a period that easily resets individuals risk tolerance, the government says go (even if it is just go a wee bit.
 
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JumbleDuck

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SW Scotland
Unfortunately JD I don't think a radius around ones locality discourages " the stupid, the selfish and the ignorant" from practising ill considered behaviour. Of course it is a numbers game and limiting numbers will reduce risk but if it is not hard wired in for the whole country then individual organisations may find their actions futile.
I agree, but hard rules would probably make things worse and would be awful hard to enforce. I think the best we can hope for is that enough people understand and follow the spirit of the rules that the deliberately and constitutionally contrary can't do too much damage. I'm a confirmed anti-authoritarian myself, but I'm happy to inconvenience myself for the general good.
 

Capt Popeye

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Dawlish South Devon
On the contrary, I think that would be laudable public-spiritedness. The suggestions/request/order that we do no travel is not a pointless exercise of power; it's to stop people dying and private businesses which help by discouraging the stupid, the selfish and the ignorant should be commended.
Yes well, guess that thge RNLI, RYA, Harbour Authorities etc etc are all in a tither about this curfew and its obligations, each one feeding of the other, just like on these pages, leapfrogging each other in an effort to be 'best virtue signaller' ; lets be clear, the travelling restrictions are in the domain of Govt, Police etc NOT bloody Marina and Harbour Authorities, so why not let them that shpuld deal with the travelling, and the others deal more effectively with the Boating side ?

All theHarbour Authorities and RNLI and RYA need do is state that the travelling restrictions and rules should be observed; its simple, honest, truthfull, adaptable to whatever the Govt should dictate without the need to modify the RNLI, RYA and Harbour Authorities rules and regulations at all = simples

Having rered the JD post again, it does not state ........... we do not travel ...... at all, where did you get that from ?

Actually your post makes the point that, when the next person repeats (or thinks that they do ?) the rules they oft get it rather skewed a tad, a bit like those who witnessed the Angler show how big his fish was, each time the Anglers tale is retold the fish gets bigger and bigger, so it has become with the Lock Down Rules, for some, each retelling the rules get more and more severe, and someone gets more and more irate at those whom stick with the Real Original rules rather than the Anglers Tale.

In that way the sittuation becomes clearer for all of us; gawd think that this country is good 'Stasi' country
 
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NormanS

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10 Nov 2008
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7,451
Maybe I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt, but my reading of the information from RYAS was that it was merely confirming the information from the Scottish Government, but focussed as to how that information affected the use of boats. We are in a situation where there is still a significant danger of the virus getting out of hand, and although it might inconvenience us as boat owners, the "greater good" surely should take precedence.
I will not be travelling the 110 miles to my boat in the meantime.
 

dunedin

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3 Feb 2004
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Boat (now back in) the Clyde
Yes well, guess that thge RNLI, RYA, Harbour Authorities etc etc are all in a tither about this curfew and its obligations, each one feeding of the other, just like on these pages, leapfrogging each other in an effort to be 'best virtue signaller' ; lets be clear, the travelling restrictions are in the domain of Govt, Police etc NOT bloody Marina and Harbour Authorities, so why not let them that shpuld deal with the travelling, and the others deal more effectively with the Boating side ?

etc etc
Not sure why you have come to have a rant on a post about sailing in Scotland, but like many I suspect you have little experience or understanding of what all the sporting authorities, including RYS, are having to do on our behalf for us to be allowed to do our sports at all.
As I understand it form the statements by RYA Scotland and others, they needed to put forward proposals to the Government to be approved.

If you know better, or can do better, then please contact the relevant Government authorities and/or MSPs etc and do so.
But AFAIK there is a lot of work being done behind the scenes which we should be thankful for, not eternally critical.
 

Seven Spades

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3,961
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Surrey
Because every time you go to sea you’re elevating the risk of requiring assistance. If you’ve sailed for some time you must know people who’ve needed rescuing through no fault of their own, hardware failure, collision, medical emergency etc. You might even have needed rescuing yourself.

It is impossible to socially distance yourself aboard a lifeboat, so every time they or, as a lifeboat coxswain, should I say we, are called we’re elevating the risk to ourselves, the shore crew, and all our families when we go home.

As a professional mariner I know the draw of the sea as much as anyone, and how frustrating it is not to be sailing, but these are unusual circumstances and need everyone to work together.

Essentially if you rush back to sea you’re making the decision to prioritise your enjoyment over other people’s safety.
This is just a stupid thing to say you might as well lock everyone in their homes. You are far more likely to be knocked of a bike than be rescued from a boat, no one has suggested that cycling should be banned. I bet that you are in more danger getting into a car then getting on a boat. How many times have you been rescued?
 

Capt Popeye

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Dawlish South Devon
Not sure why you have come to have a rant on a post about sailing in Scotland, but like many I suspect you have little experience or understanding of what all the sporting authorities, including RYS, are having to do on our behalf for us to be allowed to do our sports at all.
As I understand it form the statements by RYA Scotland and others, they needed to put forward proposals to the Government to be approved.

If you know better, or can do better, then please contact the relevant Government authorities and/or MSPs etc and do so.
But AFAIK there is a lot of work being done behind the scenes which we should be thankful for, not eternally critical.
I have no problem with the relevant authorities pursuing their aims and objectives, but when say a Harbour Authority adds into their Harbour edicts that a boatowner should not travel by road more than so many miles they have strayed into terroriory out of their territory, wher e they have not the wit and experience to delve into or dictate; Plus whilst or when doing that they have let down big time their supporters
 

alan_d

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15 Mar 2002
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2,059
Location
Scotland
If I am right, and some boaty places like Marinas or Boatyards are actually stipulating who and whom can visit theit establishments based upon estimated mileages traveled they are beyond contempt and clearly organising the 'next' collapse of the boating market.
Or perhaps taking what seem to them reasonable precautions to safeguard the health of their employees.
 

Seven Spades

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Location
Surrey
Or perhaps taking what seem to them reasonable precautions to safeguard the health of their employees.
Well you could do the same by denying access to anyone with blond hair or has a birthday between January and June. Distance from the marina has no bearing on th likelihood of carrying the infection. This restriction is just reducing the numbers of visitors. However that is nonsense too. I have been working on my boat for the last few weekends and have not met a member of staff nor any other boat owners. When you go to the dock I don't see any members of staff helping to tie or unite lines. You are just making p risks that don't really exist.

This virus is airborne, you get it in close proximity to others. Keep your distance and you will neither contract it nor spread it. It is really that simple.
 

alan_d

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Joined
15 Mar 2002
Messages
2,059
Location
Scotland
Distance from the marina has no bearing on th likelihood of carrying the infection.
Many of the infection control procedures introduced nationally and internationally include some restrictions on travel, aimed at stopping the virus passing from places with a high rate of infection to places with a low one. In Scotland (and this is a thread about Scotland) higher rates are found in urban areas, where most people live, and low rates in rural ones, where most of the marinas are to be found. The ban on visiting second homes addresses the same risk.
This virus is airborne, you get it in close proximity to others. Keep your distance and you will neither contract it nor spread it. It is really that simple.
Not that simple, I'm afraid. The airborne viruses can settle onto objects or surfaces and can remain capable of infecting someone for 48 hours or longer. This explains the advice to wash our hands frequently and to try and avoid touching our faces, and the drive to sanitise door-handles, counter-tops and the like. If you don't believe me read this account of contact tracing in Singapore " The mystery of 'silent spreaders'" detailing how a woman was infected after using a church pew which had been occupied some hours earlier by a pre-symptomatic but infected couple from Wuhan. Even if you do not see another soul on your visit to your marina or boatyard you could still contract or spread Covid-19. (Think door or gate handles, keypads or anything else you and others might touch.)
 
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