Relcraft Owners

[Si Dude]

Hello all,

My name is Simon, I'm an owner of a Relcarft Sapphire named Pherosa

I'm interested in finding out as much information about the relcraft range and members experiances

Pherosa has a BMW 3.2 straight 6 petrol engine is is currrently moored at Stourport Yacht Club on the river Severn

I've set up a Relcraft Owners Group on Facebook and welcome any one who wishes to join and help in my aim form a group.

 

[enterprise]

Hi Simon, welcome
Sorry I have no info on Relcraft but wish you the very best with the owners club.

Stourport, remember it very well as a youngster, is the fairground still there?, spent many a happy weekend walking up and down the river after a meal at the Old Beams!

Enjoy your new boat.

 

[rafiki_]

Hi Simon, and welcome. Sorry, know nothing about Relcraft, but we are parked down the Severn at Tewkesbury, and are considering the northern trip to Stourport in the spring. Would appreciate any local knowledge on what to look out for, both above and below water level.

 

[jfm]

A german lady posted a Relcraft thread on here in the last 6 months. Worth searching for, as there was much Relcraft info posted on it

 

[lanason]

Kim Marie

Hello,
My Dad had a Relcraft called Kim Marie - was about 19 foot with a 40hp Merc outboard. she was bright orange and bought from a Farmer in a barn.
The 25 foot was popular as was a 29 foot aft cabin version. Lots were beige / cream in colour :-(
I think the factory was nr Salisbury - if my memory is working

 

[lanason]

After a bit of digging:-

Relcraft Marine Ltd., Watt Road, Churchfields, Salisbury, Wills. SP2 7UD United Kingdom. Telephone: Salisbury (0722) 334713

or even
Company #: 1985190
Company: RELCRAFT MARINE LTD
Registered Address: Mitchell Rd Churchfields Salisbury Wilts SP2 7UD

http://www.jonesboatyard.co.uk/documents/Relcraft-23,-26,-29-.pdf

 

[boatmaster]

Hi Simon

I've also done a little digging, not much out there but did stumble across a thread on here dating back to 2003

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17913

enjoy the boat!

 

[Si Dude]

Thanks for your welcomes and info. I did come across the theads posted in 2003 via google.

I'm lucky with pherosa, she's a white hull and body so looks very cool from a distance. I have meet up this two other Sapphire's whilst travelling up the avon last year.

Sports Special and Southern Comfort. Both built in the mid 70's

once i've had a bit more of a play with the forum i'll post some pictures

 

[Julia-Kristina]

Relcraft Topaz in Germany

A german lady posted a Relcraft thread on here in the last 6 months. Worth searching for, as there was much Relcraft info posted on it

Hi, that had been me !

I just added some photos of our boat in an album.

Relcraft topaz without aft. cabin

The photos were taken just after having bought her, spring 2010, in Berlin.

On the photos she is still unrenovated, looks quite untidy, but the owner had died 3 years before and since then she was not used anymore. So she was in quite a bad shape.

During this winter we will try to make her beautiful again !
When everything will be finished I will post some photos again.

Since Relcraft boats are very seldom in Germany it will be interesting to follow this thread with, I hope, many good advices concerning this type of boat....

We are now just planning to put a lot of ballast in the front to make her go more straight.
I also already added a so called course-keeper / ruddersafe which is a genial invention !

She already has a - quite weak - bowthruster and I am thinking about mounting an additional sternthruster / jetthruster.
Technically not so easy because of the outdrive.

Also the idea of an added skeg here in this thread ( with photo ) is interesting.

Would be nice if the Relcraft owners could write something about their experiences concerning the amelioration of the going straight ahead.


Kind regards from Germany,
Julia - Kristina

 

[Chris Woods]

Further to my recent posting enquiring about previous owners of my Relcraft 29 Topaz called BORATO, I would note that before we bought her, she had been converted to a single, large marinized early Ford Transit 2.5 ltr diesel. This was too big to go in her after engine compartment and was fitted below the large cockpit hatch.

She was also fitted with a keel (!!!) increasing her draft to 3' 5" which is a great shame as she cannot now get up onto the full plane position but as she is only used in inland waters, this is not a problem. She is still a beautiful boat and ideal for gentle cruising.

Regarding your thrusters, yes, she will get caught occasionally by the wind, but careful planning should allow this to be handled. It's all a matter of momentum. I am a retired mariner and if we needed to turn our large tankers around in a small area without tuges, it was '½ Ahead with helm full over' until she started to swing, then 'Full astern, helm amidships' while she was swinging. This stopped any forward motion. Once the swing stopped, another blast ahead to build up the swing, quickly followed by full astern to stop her getting forward motion. You can almost turn a Rellcraft 29 in her own length, and in the case of the Relraft 29 I found it was not necessary to bring the helm to amidships while giving the engines a big kcik astern. A bit of practice in calm waters, ieally close to a buoy, and you will find your boat should rotate without thristers. The addition of your weak bow thruster would be a small benefit in keeping the swing for longer.

We also had bow and stern thrusters on our ships and so |I am familar with their usage.

The bow of the Relcrafts are not suitable for tunnel thrusters - they are far too shallow and the thruster will not be able to operate sufficiently. Thrusters need depth to work well. If you really need a bow thruster, you must look for one that will hinge or drop down when needed. I've used these on commercial vessels and because of their added depth when operating, they are very efficient, but if available for the small craft market they will be expensive.

Regarding the stern thruster, although useful, they are not as advantageous as the bow thruster as full use of a good rudder and use of the engines above should normally be sufficient. If you know you are going to encounter strong cross winds when berthing in a small area as I had to in my last berth, you need to plan your approach, whether to commence the swing earlier or later, and to consider whether it approach bow or stern first.

Our keel does reduce side drift but doesn't reduce the turning effect of a side wind on the housing.

You might enquire about possibly increasing the arc of turn of your rudder. Most ruddrs turn through a small arc, which is fine for normal forward movement and more than sufficient for fast boats like Relcraft, but for slow manouvering a larger arc of turn is a great advantage. An extra 10° in each direction would increase slow manouverability considerably.

I hope this may be of some help,
good cruising,
Chris

 

[colhel]

When I left college I was offered a place at Relcraft on the "YTS" scheme. I thought the factory was on the A30 (London road) as you head out of Salisbury. This would have been around 1983. I'm not sure when it wasn't long after this date. It would have been possible due to the rather sprawling lay out of Churchfields Industrial that expansion wasn't possible under one location, but I'm only thinking aloud here. Certainly when I was shown round as part of the interview process I can't remember seeing any engineering activity (which is what I was interested in) but I did see them being fitted out.
It is possible the Watt Road address was later taken over by a firm called Harben Systems (now called Flowplant) who manufature pressure cleaning equipment.
Good luck in your research.

Colin

 

[Chris Woods]

Hi Colin,

thanks for that. Not a part of the country I know.
Looking at one of the older postings on Relcraft, I'm trying to track down the moulds which may still be with Minster Composite Products of Nottingham. I'll post their reply.

Chris

 

[Julia-Kristina]

boat renovations

Dear Chris,

thank you for your long and very detailled article and the many advices.
I read it quite conscientiously !
The maneouvre you are describing ( turning her on small place ) functions well with her, we learnt it also already in the boat driving school.
I used it quite often but it does not help when I have to get into our small harbour and the wind is blowing.

In the meantime we found some possibilities to ameliorate things which were disturbing me:

1) We put a lot of ballast in the front, around and in front of the water tank under the bow beds.
Now her nose is deeper in the water which makes her move better straight ahead.

Since we go very slowly with her, no racing, it does not disturb us that she can not run so fast anymore. She is an old lady anyway

2) As you all know a normal stern thruster is not possible if you have this kind of drive ( " stern drive " ? )

So we had the idea to mount an electric motor on her platform.
The motor is fixed in an angle of 90 degrees.
So when you switch it on, forward, it moves the boat to the left side, when you switch it back, it moves it to the right side.

A perfect stern thruster.

Until now we have the problem that we have to lift the motor out of the water when driving the boat with the main engine because it produces too much resistance in the water.

So we plan to mount an extra hydraulic motor which would allow us to lift the motor out of the water and also to move the motor in its normal position.
Then we could use it as an extra motor in case the main engine would not function anymore.

Of course such an E-motor is not very strong but it should be sufficient to move the boat to the next shore.

3) Sensibility to the wind : We are used now to put away all the windows of the canopy when entering in a harbour. So the wind can pass through and the effect is noticeable.

So this is what's new with our boat !

Thank you again for your mail,

kind regards from Germany ( where it rains and rains and rains.....)
Julia-Kristina

 

[Chris Woods]

Relcraft & Crosswinds

Dear Julia-Kristina,

one final and simple option when the wind is a problem and if you have sufficient crew, is to lower your forward anchor just onto the sea bed and let it act as a drag if your bow is being blown in the wrong direction.

This needs careful handling and depends on the type of anchor. An achor that digs-in very easily requires more careful handling. The trick is to use the weight of the anchor to hold the bow against the wind (or cross tide), and if necessary to let the anchor drag on the bottom, but not to let the anchor dig into the sea bed.

As the anchor will be heavy, and it is not being used to secure the boat at an anchorage, it would be easier to handle if it is secured to rope rather than chain. It will not affect the drag of the anchor but will make the equipment lighter and easier to handle, and to feel how the anchor is touching the bottom.

It is a balancing act between the drag effect of the anchor and control of the cruiser's heading.

It also needs good communications from the helmsman.

Alternatively, if you can apply your electric cross-drive motor on a lifting mechanism at the bow, you will find it much more effective than using it aft where your stern drive is already capable of providing some side thrust. An intersting problem for a good mechanic.

I will be interested to know if you find light use of your anchor against cross winds is of help,
damp Norfolk,
Chris

 

[Chris Woods]

New engines & Stern

Two or three years ago I saw a most interesting alteration taking place to a Relcraft 26 cruiser at Wroxham on the Norfolk Broads.

The hull and shell were in fine condition as one would expect from such a strong boat, but the owner wanted a complete rebuilt including new engines, and to performance level.

Rather than fitting stern drives, the builder fitted outboards!

To do this he cut away the stern below the engine hatch and rebuilt it with the stern constructed in line with the bulkhead below the forward end of the after hatch/stern seat.

This meant that by lifting the hatch, one looked forward at the stern and down into the water. The upper bulwarks supporting this hatch were strengthened as was the original above-water transome.

Two large outboards (sorry, don't know their size) were then slung in the well below the hatch.

Result - a very manouverable boat, and depending on their capacity -probably back to her original performance level. I did not see the boat operating with this new configuration but am told independantly it was very successful.

It also means that cost of, access to, mainenence of the outboards would be much easier than with inboard engines, and there would also be a cost saving over fitting and maint ainingstern drives, and any fouling of the props could be easily sorted.

A most interesting adaption,
Chris

 

[Julia-Kristina]

E-motor at the bow / anchor manoeuvre

Dear Chris,

this anchor manoeuvre seems to be very tricky - and I am only starting with my boat experience. :-(

But the idea is very interesting and when I will have more experience I will try this.
The problem is only that I am sailing alone very often because my husband has a lot of work and not too much time. And since we live in Bavaria and the boat lives in the north of Berlin - more than 500 km to go - we can not go there every weekend to get more sailing experience.

But I will keep this suggestion in my mind , thank you !

And you idea to mount ( another ) e-motor at the bow is quite interesting too. Did you see such a construction already ?

Have a nice weekend - with more sun than we have here in the moment,

Julia- Kristina

 

[Julia-Kristina]

I only now saw your second mail concerning this outboard solution - very interesting, a lot of technical phantasy .

I will show this to an engineer.

Thank you again,

Julia-Kristina

 

[Chris Woods]

Relcraft & Crosswinds

Hi again Julia-Kristina,

The idea is to hang the anchor just above the bottom of the river and then, if the bow is being blown the wrong way, lowering the anchor slightly until it touches the bottom and causes sufficient drag to stop the bow swinging away. A close watch of the swinging of the bow will immediatly show when the anchor is becoming effective.
Then raise the anchor clear of the bottom once you are pointing in the required direction.

A light weight anchor would be sufficient for this type of manouver, and it might be possible to lead the anchor rope to your helm positions so that the driver alone could operate the anchor for this purpose. I have two small clip-on mirrors attached to the frame supporting the canopy over the helm so I watch my stern while looking ahead.

If you consider this idea worth while, I would practice when there is someone with you, and I would suggest you have some sort of cleat for securing the anchor rope when not using that anchor. You would also need to lead the anchor rope from the bow roller through two snatch-blocks down the port side deck. One snatch block would be secured close forward of the foredeck cleat and in line with the anchor roller, and the second would be secured to the base of a port side rail stantion, in line with the front of the main cabin. These would ensure the rope does not jump out of the bow roller. If you need a drawing, you can email me direct.


Regarding the 'e-motor' or side-thruster at the bow, I was thinking of only this one side thrust motor. I would not consider it necessary to have an 'e-motor' aft.

No - I have not seen this in practice - the idea is just theoretical, but it is based on both vertically raising azimuth thrusters and on hinging side thrusters used in the specialist vessels of the off-shore oil and gas industry in the North Sea. Rolls Royce Marine, which has long been involved in the design of these ships, recently produced a hinging thruster for the bow which lowers to the vertical when required, and then hinges back into the hull when not required. The extra depth of these two types of thusters below the hull make them particularly effective as these ships have relatively shallow draft and work in heavy seas with the bows often coming out of the water while manouvering, making conventional side thrusters ineffective.

In practice, this would be very expensive and it would be better to have a cruiser with a deeper bow design to allow the more effective use of a forward side thruster in a tunnel. I have not found side-winds a major problem - it is usually a matter of pre-planning an approach, but if the wind directions are variable, this makes manouvering in cross-winds more difficult.

The Relcraft 29 is quite a big boat to manouver single handed,
Chris

 

[Julia-Kristina]

Hi Chris,

long time ago that we had our contact here in this forum...
So, in the meantime we have done a lot of technical mounting with our boat:

First of all the bow thruster did not function anymore ( exactly at the first day of our 1 week summer trip ).
So at least I learnt a lot about steering a boat without a bow thruster.
We had to pass about 20 watergates ( " lock " ? ) so specially the first ones were really fun for the other boats watching us. ;-)

But after a while no problem anymore.

After returning to our home base we got a new bow thruster ( from the company Vetus) which works very well, it is a really strong bow thruster.

And we ameliorated our E- motor/ stern thruster.

You may remember that the motor is fixed in an 90 degree position at the stern.
I can now handle it while standing at the steering wheel because it works with buttons fixed on the dashboard.
So I can lift up the whole motor when leaving the harbour, so it gets out of the water.
And when I reach the harbour again and become slowlier I let it go down.


And to make it go right or left ( which corresponds to the signal "ahead" or "backward" ) I only have to use a second button which is to be pushed left or right.
So the whole construction is very easy to handle.

It really helps when I have to enter in a harbour with little berths where I have to turn a lot.

Of course the energy of the stern thruster is not as strong as the one of the bow thruster.

But it has the additional advantage that you just have to turn it for 90 degrees to make it work as a normal motor.
We tested it and even with wind of 2 bft coming from ahead the motor pushed the boat very well.
So you have an additional factor of security in case your main engine would break down.

I really can recommend this system ( E-Motor ) to everybody who can not mount a normal stern thruster because of technical reasons.


Kind regards from Germany to you and all the other Relcraft owners,

Julia- Kristina

 

[Chris Woods]

Relcraft & Crosswinds

Hi Julia-Kristina,

Great to here that your perserverance has paid off.
These Relcraft may be relatively old now but they were strongly built to withstand their high speed performance, which makes them still a good boat with plenty more years for cruising.

The only Osmosis we have is on the top of the cab - nothing on the hull which shows she was well built in dry condition. We think the Osmosis on the cab roof was as a result of an old radar either being knocked off or badly removed. That roof had several poor repairs when we bought her and I suspect water got under the gellcoat before it was repaired, and caused the damage. Not a problem, but an interestng talking point.

Vetus is a well known name over here. Would you like to identify the model bow thruster you had installed in case other owners are interested?

You might also like to tell us more about the E-thruster you have installed.

Many modern ships how use azimuth thruster pods (often made by Rolls Royce) rather than conventional shaft propellors as they can also provide side and reverse thrust, making the ship very manouverable at slow speed.

Luckily on the Norfolk Broads we have little need for these thrusters, but if I won the lottery I would re-engine our Relcraft 29 Topaz back to her original spec and enjoy her designed fast performance.

A less powerful stern thruster is not unusual as the Relcraft suffers less windage aft, and you can also use your rudder or Z-drives to add a degree of side movement, particularly if you have twin engines which can be controlled seperately.

Thanks for your interestng update,
all the best,
Chris