Portuguese residency - current situation - advice needed

[nortada]

Why does Spanish Res involve "giving up UK health care" when you seem happy to contemplate Portuguese Res please Webby? Do they not have the same impact?

If the UK EHIC is no longer available and you do not have residency you will no longer be able get free healthcare. You may even have to produce evidence of private health cover to enter the country. Hopefully, rumours that the UK EHIC will survive in Portugal will prove to be true.

Brits in Portugal enjoy dual (UK/Portuguese) residency but I have been lead to believe that the same is not true in Spain, where it is not possible to hold duel residency. If am wrong, no doubt somebody will be along to put me straight.

This is just an example of how different EU countries (Portugal, Spain, Greece etc.) have very different rules, regulation and attitudes towards Brits in their country.

We have property interests in Spain and a boat in Portugal so carried out a bit of research and then plumbed for Portugal as the friendlier of the 2 Iberian states.

 

[Beneteau381]

Why does Spanish Res involve "giving up UK health care" when you seem happy to contemplate Portuguese Res please Webby? Do they not have the same impact?

He will be back tomorrow

 

[Pavalijo]

I looked into the idea of Spanish residency and was told I would have to import the boat with an 11% or so tax - but that this is not a requirement of Portuguese residency.

I’m not saying that is correct, just passing on what somebody told me, so that if someone is considering a Spanish residency they might check that out before proceeding.

 

[webcraft]

Why does Spanish Res involve "giving up UK health care" when you seem happy to contemplate Portuguese Res please Webby? Do they not have the same impact?

Getting Spanish residency if you are retiring/on a pension involves getting an S1 form, which transfers your NHS privileges to the Spanish health care system.

In Portugal dual residence is possible - you do not give up your rights to UK health care.

In ten weeks time, all bets are off.

- W

 

[steveallan]

Getting Spanish residency if you are retiring/on a pension involves getting an S1 form, which transfers your NHS privileges to the Spanish health care syste

- W

As the UK will be paying for your treatment in Spain, it also means you still retain your rights to use the NHS in the UK . Plus you will be entitled to a UK issued EHIC ( this may change after 31/12.)

 

[webcraft]

As the UK will be paying for your treatment in Spain, it also means you still retain your rights to use the NHS in the UK . Plus you will be entitled to a UK issued EHIC ( this may change after 31/12.)

Is this from personal experience?

- W

 

[Sailfree]

Is this from personal experience?

- W

We get treated in UK as well as Portugal. I would assume the NHS prefer you to use their facilities instead of paying someone overseas!

 

[Graham376]

I think there are different rules in Portugal depending on age (below or above retirement) and whether using S1, formally immigrating or, just taking up residence. I'm registered at local health centre without S1.

 

[nortada]

I think there are different rules in Portugal depending on age (below or above retirement) and whether using S1, formally immigrating or, just taking up residence. I'm registered at local health centre without S1.

This is my understanding.

A resident not in receipt of a UK state pension, just takes their residency document, passport and fiscal number to their local Centro de Saude and registers for a doctor and gets a health number. Portugal picks up the tab for health care.

Those in receipt of a UK state pension apply through the S1 system to the UK overseas desk in Newcastle then takes a completed S1 to their local Portuguese Social Security Office, who if requested, will issue a Portuguese EHIC.

You then take a copy of the S1 to the Centro de Saude who issue a health number and allocate a doctor. UK picks up the cost of health care. Moreover, you are still entitled to free access to the NHS when in the UK.

But I am hearing that if these ‘mature residents’ just pitch up at their Centro de Saude, the system is short circuited and they are issued with a health number and allocated a doctor. Luck of the draw on the day - such is Portugal. ?

As residents with state pensions, but yet to resister for health cover, we still use our UK EHIC but when we get past 31/12/20, we will take a closer look at the best option for us.

Think Graham has possibly engineered the best possible option.?

 

[Graham376]

But I am hearing that if these ‘mature residents’ just pitch up at their Centro de Saude, the system is short circuited and they are issued with a health number and allocated a doctor. Luck of the draw on the day - such is Portugal. ?

"Mature"? well I suppose it's better than calling us old farts

Yes, I just bowled up at the local Centro de Saude and registered with a doctor (who I have yet to need) and obtained health number. Later applied for and was issued with a Portuguese EHIC. I have the advantage of having a native wife who isn't shy about arguing if they try the bums rush and, it was well away from tourist areas where they're even more overworked and reluctant to take on new patients.

 

[Sailfree]

Change of Residency Update.

Carvalhal Freguesia now only open in morning. Went on Wednesday last week and they took photocopies and said come back on Friday.

Returned on Friday paid €5 and got "Atestado de Residencia". Document requested by Bombarral Camara (for those not familiar with my circumstances i already have these but issued at old address (now sold) in Nazare.

Immediately went on the Friday to Bombarral Camara and went straight to reception to be told no staff return on Monday!

Returned on Monday and stopped at entrance by Security Guard (this is new!)- "do you have an appointment". No just told to return today! Must now telephone for appointment. (Wish they could have made one last Friday!) He gave me number and I got answerphone obviously in Portuguese! Let him listen and in fairness he was helpful and then took me through to reception. Now have an appointment for Wednesday!

Patience is required but I'm retired so time not of an essence but when I think back to designing , building and commissioning pharmaceutical plants in US in 12 months I do despair for the future if countries like Portugal cant get things done more efficiently.

I am told I can expect the habitation licence for the new house about 15months after completion! We can live in it immediately just no council tax due until licence is issued.

Still love Portugal but like the UK I just want the best for its future.

 

[Graham376]

Still love Portugal but like the UK I just want the best for its future.

Portuguese bureaucracy is similar to UK weather, very changeable. Nothing much will change until the generation with lifetime employment contracts have retired from state departments, they have to find them some work to do. They are under the impression that computers were designed to produce more paperwork.

 

[GHA]

I do despair for the future if countries like Portugal cant get things done more efficiently.

Hope not, places which see having a really nice long lunch sitting in the sun as more important than paperwork are much nicer places to be
Despair for the future if filling a few more forms efficiency is the be all and end all..
Better to take a more Portuguese pragmatic view, it's not that big a deal really and the sun usually shines so carry on with a smile. It's them from the frozen north that do all the complaining

 

[Sailfree]

Portuguese bureaucracy is similar to UK weather, very changeable. Nothing much will change until the generation with lifetime employment contracts have retired from state departments, they have to find them some work to do. They are under the impression that computers were designed to produce more paperwork.

yes did not think of that - lifetime employment contracts! Mind you private companies can also suffer. I had to transfer a whole department from Paris to UK as the only way we could make inadequate staff redundant. One individual in particular was not up to the job and he influenced the others preventing the whole team achieving.

I look back on my last 28yrs work - you could make one mistake but it would be your last!

Yes sunny on boat this afternoon and great that being retired so have the time to be patient.

 

[steveallan]

Is this from personal experience?

- W

Yes

 

[nortada]

As the UK will be paying for your treatment in Spain, it also means you still retain your rights to use the NHS in the UK . Plus you will be entitled to a UK issued EHIC ( this may change after 31/12.)

As they are not EU based, I don’t think the S1 privileges will change after 31/12 so folk in receipt of a UK State Pension will still be entitled to free healthcare funded by the NHS.

Not sure a UK EHIC will exist post 31/12 but S1 holders are able to get an EHIC from their country of residence; again funded by the UK.

 

[Sailfree]

change of Residency update

Attended my 10.15 appointment in Bombarral this morning. They went through all my papers but NEEDED to see my bank account. Balance is OK and summary of all accounts even better (until I pay the last 2 builders invoices!!) but I got the impression they were looking for a regular income. Luckily I get my state pension paid by UK government in € paid straight into my Portuguese bank account. I transfer other money in lump sums buying € when the rate looks as good as it will get! So be prepared to show evidence of mony trandfers and a regular income either in UK or Portugal

I note this is after having residency in Nazare for 4years and all I'm doing is transferring my residency to my new address. I was not asked for bank details in Nazare.

May be now looking for evidence that you can support yourself before issuing the new SEF ID card.

Hence be prepared with Bank Statements if you are applying for residency.

Got a friendly welcome from the receptionist though who informed me she is one of my neighbours in a house behind us!

 

[Harrickbayley]

Provided you remain in the Schengen Zone and do not sail out of a Portuguese marina, I agree. But a bit limiting don’t you think.

I would go even further and say, even if you do not have EU residency, provided you stay permanently in the Schengen Zone and do not transgress or get picked up by the authorities, you will probably escape detection. But if you are detected and picked up, you could be barred from the EU for life‼

Why take the risk

Kind of technical, thanks for the information. How easy is evading the authorities?

 

[nortada]

Kind of technical, thanks for the information. How easy is evading the authorities?

Welcome to Liveaboard Link.

Actually it only gets technical if you try buck the system.

When you are in the Schengen Zone, unless you bring attention to yourself, detection by the authorities is the same as it is in the U.K. but you will be checked entering and leaving the Schengen Zone - again same as in the U.K.

I would add until we know the outcome of the current negotiations, nothing is set in concrete.

Although Schengen is a EU wide thing, residency is a national issue, with the requirements, rules and regulations varying markedly between different EU countries. On top of that, countries may enter into bilateral agreements, which could dramatically change the shape of things. Then there is the possibility of the EU matching the U.K. and rather than limiting Brits to 90 days in 180 in the EU, it could be extended to 183 days. (The deal the U.K. is offering the E.U.

Who knows; only time will tell.

 

[webcraft]

Catherine and I have an appointment for Residencia here in Cascais in a week's time. Will report back.

- W